This. I simply don't believe she was sitting at home by the flickering light of her laptop draining a bottle of Bell's every day. But I can well believe she had a problem with social drinking (and other substances).
Jack Monroe #601 Replican't
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That alone she trotted out the ridiculous tired old myth that vodka does not smell shows this is bull and she’s never lived it. I call Jimmy, Jimmy and James.Sometimes a bottle and a half. Swapping whiskey for vodka if she was ‘working’.
View attachment 3344556
Like you, I lost a friend at around the same age. In fact, his doctor told him that it was because his heavy intake stopped abruptly (having turned to religion, ironically) that the damage was done. Clicking online sideboards it was not.
View attachment 3344570 See also her “I went sober a week ago and I feel wonderful!” article
ETA: mind you, not having a sense of smell would explain quite a bit.
This. I won't go in to details, but she drank away any semblance of dignity before dying before her life had even begun.
I actually carried quite a bit of bitterness about it for a while because I saw what it did to her Mum. A lot of people including myself tried explaining to her that it wasn't her fault, but she couldn't handle the guilt. I'd also had help/support/trust thrown back in my face, so I knew to some extent how she felt. Hearing that both of them had died was absolutely horrific, although not at all surprising.
The sad thing about Jack is that she will encounter dozens of people in those meetings who will die just like my friend did, and probably wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire. Then again, that's half the trouble with AA: Half the people there are part timers, who use it as a social club. They've probably had a couple of drink driving convictions or made a bleep of themselves at the office party, but they've never thrown up a load of vodka and drunk it again to stop themselves from going in to convulsions.
That interview always reads to me like Jack's a crim being interviewed by a cop and Shattenstone is giving her a way out that isn't necessarily true. Like you know when you see a confession video and they're all 'did things just get out of hand? You didn't mean to hurt her?' etc and because it's the easier less terrible option, the crim always jumps on it.
All of that tit faced stuff is just plausible deniability for Jack. Its years later and she STILL hasn't paused her Patreon and she's given the impression she's no longer drinking.
So to me that says what I've always believed, she just sees what she can get away with and has no respect for the money of others who subsidize her existence. If she did she would get a job and pause or stop her Patreon. Ideally she owes people a refund but morally she should just stop. She hasn't.
All of that tit faced stuff is just plausible deniability for Jack. Its years later and she STILL hasn't paused her Patreon and she's given the impression she's no longer drinking.
So to me that says what I've always believed, she just sees what she can get away with and has no respect for the money of others who subsidize her existence. If she did she would get a job and pause or stop her Patreon. Ideally she owes people a refund but morally she should just stop. She hasn't.
Her dayhab phase was awful - holed up in a trendy aparthotel next to Brick Lane, doing the dayhab for longer than anyone has ever had to. All so expensive. I’m not saying rehab shouldn’t be comfortable and safe, but the few places I’ve seen pour their scant resources into helping people get well.
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I see it the other way - it’s the staged “we’re looking into this very seriously” part of the interview. Then Shatters gives us the “well I asked the difficult questions and she’s very sorry, so you can all back off now”.
Its amazing how she manages to make recent interviews (Diva, Shatters) include her whole back story, classic narc needs to lay the groundwork.
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Like others, several on one side of the family have ruined their lives (and the lives of others) with addiction. In our family it was always alcohol, and a bit of tobacco. Nothing stronger than whisky.
My father died officially of cancer - but it was liver damage & cancer from drinking, and then not being able to handle treatment. He was 6'4" but never weighed much more than 10-11 stone on a good day. He was under 7 stone when he died aged 64.
I agree with the notion Jack is a binge drinker and wholly unpleasant with it. I don't agree it is a dependency with her, but more something to do as her "work" is sporadic. I'd guess with shared custody of the kid, partners with actual jobs with long hours, there was a lot of scope for her to drink when home alone. The booze will have caused issues with her relationships (with son, parents, partners, friends) but that's a long way from the way it was described in the Shats article.
The tramadol story is rubbish. It is very addictive, I was taking it for 2 years. That was 2 pills, twice a day. All prescribed for me by a GP. I don't think I would have been able to work full time if I took any more than that. It was horrific to taper off it as it is so strong, but for me I had to in order to start other medication - I was only taking it whilst they diagnosed the actual issue.
I just hope the kid is like Saffy in Ab Fab & rejects any wild lifestyle as his version of rebellion. Or maybe does what I did - move 200 miles away from the problem parent so I could try and forge my own path.
My father died officially of cancer - but it was liver damage & cancer from drinking, and then not being able to handle treatment. He was 6'4" but never weighed much more than 10-11 stone on a good day. He was under 7 stone when he died aged 64.
I agree with the notion Jack is a binge drinker and wholly unpleasant with it. I don't agree it is a dependency with her, but more something to do as her "work" is sporadic. I'd guess with shared custody of the kid, partners with actual jobs with long hours, there was a lot of scope for her to drink when home alone. The booze will have caused issues with her relationships (with son, parents, partners, friends) but that's a long way from the way it was described in the Shats article.
The tramadol story is rubbish. It is very addictive, I was taking it for 2 years. That was 2 pills, twice a day. All prescribed for me by a GP. I don't think I would have been able to work full time if I took any more than that. It was horrific to taper off it as it is so strong, but for me I had to in order to start other medication - I was only taking it whilst they diagnosed the actual issue.
I just hope the kid is like Saffy in Ab Fab & rejects any wild lifestyle as his version of rebellion. Or maybe does what I did - move 200 miles away from the problem parent so I could try and forge my own path.
Her twitter replies were always really telling. The way she'd dismiss or ignore people who were complimenting her or trying to help. She barely managed a simple 'thanks' to them most of the time. Her lack of gratitude really shone through. Entitlement isn't a nice quality.
ETA: I've been avoiding the conversation around addiction because I have little to contribute, but I lost an uncle to alcoholism and just wanted to acknowledge what others are saying. It's an awful, helpless feeling to witness someone self-destruct like that, especially when they're trying but still unable to control their drinking. I'm reading all the posts and send much love to everyone who's experienced this.
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I also don’t think she was an alcoholic but an hole drunk, like many people are.
What strikes me is most of us as parents feel like we are failing/doing it wrong. Not Jack, she’s doing a brilliant job. Despite her many public failures, her total lack of interest in taking him anywhere or any extra curricular stuff for him. She’s the best parent ever.
Funny she only ever mentions watching tv with him and not fighting over homework like most of us.
What strikes me is most of us as parents feel like we are failing/doing it wrong. Not Jack, she’s doing a brilliant job. Despite her many public failures, her total lack of interest in taking him anywhere or any extra curricular stuff for him. She’s the best parent ever.
Funny she only ever mentions watching tv with him and not fighting over homework like most of us.
Well, she's an hole sober and I've never known a piss-up make anyone a better person.
Addiction is the stuff of nightmares. I remember someone recommended the ted talk about helping someone with addiction and its main message was to "sit with them"... and not judge or interfere. I wasn't in a good place so I don't think I may have fully understood the message. I ranted at my therapist for the longest time... So they have ruined my bleeping life, and I am meant to SIT WITH IT. Shove it up your a mate.
I have lots of hugely conflicted feelings about addiction - a lot of it is still a jumble in my head. For me, seeing forgiveness as a non-binary issue has helped; so its not either forgiven or unforgiven - but i move closer to one or the other depending on what is happening.
Back to Jack... I have issues with the black beanie photo. Plenty of people in addiction can easily appear as if they are having the time of their lives. I also have issue with her being oh so cheerful about admitting so much, so candidly, so early on. A lot of people really really struggle with the shame of addiction, so admitting it to the world on day one? It just seems so implausible. The person in my life with addiction problems took over 10 years to really admit what was happening, after dozens of "telling me everything" they were lying every time. Even when they truly hit rock bottom it was a slow process to untangle what was really happening.
My top tip for anyone who is exposed to an addict's "honesty" e.g. "Help me I am drinking a bottle of vodka a day" is that they are probably lying and it will be so much worse/more than what they initially disclose. Sorry to be so depressing!
I have lots of hugely conflicted feelings about addiction - a lot of it is still a jumble in my head. For me, seeing forgiveness as a non-binary issue has helped; so its not either forgiven or unforgiven - but i move closer to one or the other depending on what is happening.
Back to Jack... I have issues with the black beanie photo. Plenty of people in addiction can easily appear as if they are having the time of their lives. I also have issue with her being oh so cheerful about admitting so much, so candidly, so early on. A lot of people really really struggle with the shame of addiction, so admitting it to the world on day one? It just seems so implausible. The person in my life with addiction problems took over 10 years to really admit what was happening, after dozens of "telling me everything" they were lying every time. Even when they truly hit rock bottom it was a slow process to untangle what was really happening.
My top tip for anyone who is exposed to an addict's "honesty" e.g. "Help me I am drinking a bottle of vodka a day" is that they are probably lying and it will be so much worse/more than what they initially disclose. Sorry to be so depressing!
I suspect she drinks too much in social situations to try to overcome her inherent awkwardness, then generally makes an absolute tit of herself. I can definitely see this being an issue with both Leggy and Louisa as Jack clearly has an inferiority complex about people being posher or better educated than her, and their work and social circles would consist of people who were one or both of these things.
I also agree that by now, surely someone - anyone - would have popped up in one of her many ‘having a wonderful time with all my friends, oi oi perky blinder!’ threads and agree what a fab time they’d all had and have a little laugh about it etc etc but what happens..? Literal tumbleweed. Tragic.
Can we also just highlight again that she flat out lied to Shatty about the sideboards?
We know she had way more than four of the things and she grossly understated the price of them - lies roll out of her mouth so easily and she kids herself they are true. No way were they only £300 as we noted at the time but by saying that figure she’s being sly because most sane people would say ‘Ach, that’s not that much, let her get on with it’ but if you told them they were more like a grand a pop then it has a different slant.
Sly. So sly. And manipulative. Shatty’s a moron for not following any of this bull up, too.
Can we also just highlight again that she flat out lied to Shatty about the sideboards?
We know she had way more than four of the things and she grossly understated the price of them - lies roll out of her mouth so easily and she kids herself they are true. No way were they only £300 as we noted at the time but by saying that figure she’s being sly because most sane people would say ‘Ach, that’s not that much, let her get on with it’ but if you told them they were more like a grand a pop then it has a different slant.
Sly. So sly. And manipulative. Shatty’s a moron for not following any of this bull up, too.
This is what I've always thought too - the main problem is compulsive spending combined perhaps with not being great with money otherwise. Which is the one problem a budgety thrifty claiming-to-spend-fivepence-on-food-a-week guru could never admit to, plus her USP has been "being poor" so I think she may be genuinely unsure what to do if she's seen as no longer being in that situation. Plus she's clearly taking a lot in from people sending her money to alleviate her "crippling poverty" and they'd stop doing that if they knew she was fairly well off and also unable to control her spending when she has anything extra in the bank. Can't be famously poor and an expert in being poor if everyone knows you're spending thousands a month on sideboards and fridges.
You're right, she's very sensitive to 'accusations' of secretly being rich or of having made stuff up, even though we know she has. It's too close to giving away the things she really is trying to keep secret, whereas she'll freely discuss substance abuse issues or mental health problems because those aren't the real source of her worries, if they're even true at all. The shame of addiction works as a clue with JM about what her addictions might actully be, as opposed to what she's willing to pretend to have suffered from because she knows she didn't really lose control to those things.
I've often wondered about the poor, stuck people who have to listen to her at meetings.I don't mean to make light of a serious thing, but you'd think an afternoon listening to the incessant honk would make it harder for them to stay sober.
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A Guide to Jack Monroe's 'The Poverty'
Dickensian Pov:
''More jam, mamapapa''
''We shall have a feast, SB''
Soot-covered children (with or without rickets)
Evil landlady
Yuletide Eels
WW1-WW2 Pov:
Military around the edges
Forces' pin-up
Angry strangers yelling 'should have kept your legs shut!'
Rosie the Riveter aesthetic
Lots of tins
Catherine Cookson
1970s Pov:
Retro desserts
Butlins
Caravan holidays
''That'll do''
Pretending to be from a Northern pit village
Aunty Pat aesthetic
1980s Pov:
Same as 1970s pov but includes -
Shoulder pads and big hair
Punk, failed attempts at
Thatcherite obsession with home ownership
Irish Pov:
Saoirse
Secretly approves of Orange Marches.
Dire potatoes
American Pov:
Coffee store
Prison tamales
Attempts to be 'discovered' for her singing talent
Hole (Courtney Love's band)
Free spirit biker
Please feel free to add anything. I've missed a lot of important Jack lore.
Thrift Store
On Guest's bottle of whisky a day habit. If she was drinking that much, she would be dead, end of story.
Agree - plus, how much does it cost to fund that sort of drinking? More than she could ever earn selling her
Lying hat.
That's it exactly, The safest assumption is that everything she says is some sort of a lie. It might be a lie to cover up shame or embarrassment. It might be a lie intended to distract or confuse. It might be a lie told to hurt other people. It might even be a lie to pre-empt being called out for being a liar or to set up a gotcha moment for future use. But whatever the intention, whatever form they take, they're all lies.
And, even taking the kindest possible interpretation of what she told Shattenstone, the bits you've highlighted are actually some of the most straightforward. Yes, some of her vast collection of Cotswold Co storage furniture are technically dressers or tallboys, but she's still shown us many more than four actual sideboards - and all of them cost more than £300.
But she's sown just enough confusion that people are suddenly dragged into discussing whether discount codes could be used in a sale, or if it was fair to exclude the cost of delivery and then round down to the nearest hundred pounds, or whether something was a storage bench or a wine console rather than a sideboard.
Or look at her misdirection over the number of tramadols she took (wasn't it 8 a day at worst, not 40?), and apply the same logic to her drinking - a bottle and a half? Maybe that was the largest amount she ever took, or perhaps she meant miniatures...
They say that practice makes perfect, and she's had a lot of practice with telling lies. It's pretty much the only thing she's actually good at.
I like a drink, I have sporadically abused alcohol, I am a large man. But if I drank that much even once, I am confident I would die
Yeah. If challenged, I reckon she'd say she meant half bottles or similar - which would fit with what I suspect is her mental picture of a stereotypical alcoholic. See also her fantasy about buying from the corner shop with a "please stop me!" note tucked into her wallet...
But it's a good example of a tactical 'obvious' lie, told to distract people into mithering about that rather than asking questions about how she could afford it, or what was happening to her son at the time etc.
Equally though his dad could put his foot down and say he’s spending the night here with his mates and stop guilting him.
Indeed. Although I suspect it's not a coincidence that Jack chose an absolute wet wipe to knock back poppy seeds with.
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