Gender Discussions #4

On the Last Leg this Friday they gave a shout out to all of those who have been brave during the pandemic and had to deal with transphobia. My husband turned to me and said but not ones been out of the house
I honestly don't know who is peddling this victim narrative. I get exhausted because, as a woman, no one gives us a shout out even though there is still a pay gap, that stats show the pandemic have screwed women over financially, that we're still denied the top jobs, that our spaces are being compromised, that woman is now a dirty word, that we have to be referred to as chestfeeders.

Inforapenny said:

On the Last Leg this Friday they gave a shout out to all of those who have been brave during the pandemic and had to deal with transphobia. My husband turned to me and said but not ones been out of the house
I honestly don't know who is peddling this victim narrative. I get exhausted because, as a woman, no one gives us a shout out even though there is still a pay gap, that stats show the pandemic have screwed women over financially, that we're still denied the top jobs, that our spaces are being compromised, that woman is now a dirty word, that we have to be referred to as chestfeeders.

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I really wonder if the government are doing this whole linguistic thing just to detract from the disaster they have made of this crisis and the underfunding of the NHS. how is it a priority now to make loads of new leaflets etc with all of these ridiculous new terms when the NHS is so cash strapped?!

Inforapenny said:

On the Last Leg this Friday they gave a shout out to all of those who have been brave during the pandemic and had to deal with transphobia. My husband turned to me and said but not ones been out of the house
I honestly don't know who is peddling this victim narrative. I get exhausted because, as a woman, no one gives us a shout out even though there is still a pay gap, that stats show the pandemic have screwed women over financially, that we're still denied the top jobs, that our spaces are being compromised, that woman is now a dirty word, that we have to be referred to as chestfeeders.

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Not to mention all the women who've had to deal with abusive partners.

But the victimhood is woven into their activism. It's how they get away with so much when it comes to their allies. I know that there are some trans women who have it really tough but they're typically not the same ones screeching about transphobia on the internet.

One trans woman I know is literally financially supported by his parents, is transitioning in his 30s, has thousands donated to fund the transition. This person is often on social media being OTT about the dangers he faces as a trans woman. The only danger this person faces is their own mental health.

The “victimhood” of transwomen is just another aspect of the festish tbh.

chanandlerbong said:

I dunno. From the neovagina disasters reddit thread it seemed like the most perverted/AGP men were the ones opting for SRS. Some of the images of them showing it off were fucking gross. I don't think they plot to transition just so they're able to access female spaces, but when it's such a deeply rooted fetish they do pose a threat to us.

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Yeah I get where you're coming from. I think I've exposed my own bias here because when we talk about women being 'at risk' to be honest I generally am thinking/talking about the risk of sexual violence and rape. This isn't because I don't care about other types of violence, but because when men are regularly harming women in broad daylight and facing no consequences I doubt that's going to change when talking about trans women either. So what I was thinking more was that at least, trans women who have had bottom surgery can't rape us anymore and it's that issue I'm primarily concerned with re the female spaces debate. If trans women have bottom surgery they aren't entering our spaces to rape us because biologically my understanding is they can't. Similarly with a fetish - if you're correct and it is indeed something very sordid going on, bottom surgery indulges their fetish but equally goes further in protecting us, so I still would say that's a better situation.
I think as well there does need to be a middle ground here because trans people aren't going to stop existing. I'm not suggesting that's what you've said by the way, or that anyone here is saying they want that to be the case. Just I think we do need to prioritise here. Ideally anyone might say they think biological women need their own spaces without trans women in - I respect that's your opinion if so. However for me the priority given that we're talking about this against the backdrop of self ID is that at the very least I would like only trans women who have started their transition or completed their medical transition to be allowed in our toilets. I do also think any talk of not allowing those trans women in our spaces is probably futile, while not without merit as arguments, because to my knowledge transitioned trans women have and do access our spaces anyway. That's unlikely to change in my opinion.
As always though open to having my mind changed and interested in other views!

SILKWORM said:

The only danger this person faces is their own mental health.

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I have to say I do find it quite unbelievable that many trans people in the UK actually face violence or even verbal/written transphobia given that you can literally have the police turn up at your door for misgendering someone on Twitter/have your account deleted for the same/lose your job for saying sex exists these days

judgejohndeed said:

One can’t speak for us all and similarly one woman being okay e.g. with sharing toilets with bio men cannot consent for us all. Don’t know if the arrogance or the blatant internalised misogyny disgusts me more tbh.

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Hi there, I’m new here been reading for months, and figured I’d chime in as I’m equally horrified.

THIS is in particular something I find incredibly interesting about this whole debate. The internalised misogyny is something a lot of people seem to skip over. Why are we supposed to be full of love and acceptance for trans “women” when men still treat us like garbage? I detest men and when I talk about feminism I don’t talk about men. I talk about women and girls because that’s my priority. We still have a long way to go with our struggles. Changing the narrative that suddenly trans “women” are the ultimate victim, and trying to force women to accept this is misogyny unlike anything else. Women are still suffering every single day at the hands of men, and I’m sick of this internalised misogyny making the rounds.

Has anyone here read the book “I Hate Men”? Highly recommend it.

This is very sad and infuriating at the same time

SqualorVictoria said:

This is very sad and infuriating at the same time

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Here’s an idea, why don’t they get off their arses and make their own shelters? Why the fuck should women be made to move over to make room for these people. We weren’t handed these shelters on a plate we had to work for them, so for trans women to come barging in saying “what about us” is just insulting, you are not biologically a woman you have no place in a women’s refuge. Go and make your own trans friendly refuges, it will benefit us all. It won’t be easy but fuck should trans people be allowed to take a slice of what women worked hard for just because they say they feel like women.

Typical male entitlement, funny that.

It's crazy. Nothing anyone ever does it good enough, this is what the sad thing. They will never be pleased, no matter how often someone bends over backwards

SqualorVictoria said:

This is very sad and infuriating at the same time

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That's really sad to see. Women's shelters don't have enough resources at the best of times. Probably goes without saying that all types of domestic violence is horrific, but this just feels like another issue that has been dumped on women involved in refuges/charities to sort out. The needs of trans women are very different to that of biological women and they should have their own refuges that can cater to it.

i jus

SqualorVictoria said:

This is very sad and infuriating at the same time

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I just cannot understand why such a small group of people has ended up with such a huge influence, it is really shocking

They don't want their own spaces, they want ours and they want to punish us if what we do isn't good enough. I'm sorry but if they really are women why do they have such a hatred and contempt for us?

It's the clearest indication ever that they're men, isn't it? I'm utterly disgusted at all this. How dare they.

Inforapenny said:

On the Last Leg this Friday they gave a shout out to all of those who have been brave during the pandemic and had to deal with transphobia. My husband turned to me and said but not ones been out of the house

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It was someone’s tweet they’d chosen to read out, rather than something they’d come up with themselves tbf, but I did cringe. “Because there’s so much transphobia out there at the moment!”

If “transphobia” = “people with opinions” then yeah, I guess there’s a lot of it about.

They’d never read a tweet out about the women who are murdered by their partners every single week though...

SqualorVictoria said:

They don't want their own spaces, they want ours and they want to punish us if what we do isn't good enough. I'm sorry but if they really are women why do they have such a hatred and contempt for us?

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Very true but it would be nice if just once someone would look these people in the eye and tell them no for once. Don’t even give them the option to try and infiltrate. Unfortunately people are scared because being transphobic is obviously the worst thing someone can be

I’m out of fucks so if I worked in one of these shelters I would probably end up being arrested because I have absolutely no time for these men.

I’m finding it really scary and disheartening how many people on Twitter I’m seeing say stuff like ‘well women aren’t killed just for being women like trans people are killed just for being trans’. Yes women are, and actually it seems like there’s no stats to support the second contention in the UK. Even in other countries there’s confounding factors e.g. lots are sex workers which have a higher murder rate in general so a big problem here re causation or correlation. But I’m just so worried once our rights are gone they won’t be back for a very long time.

Yep trans people and the community need to start making their own spaces rather than infringing on what little areas we have.

Has anyone seen TLC transitioning?

Troy at 3:40 to 3:49 sums up what a man thinks a woman is

Did anyone watch This Morning today... There was a "real life Barbie" (transwoman) as she called herself saying her surgical vagina is the exact same as a biological one and that she can't stop looking at it. Phil and Holly just nodded as she said her vagina is the same as a bio woman.

2020two said:

Did anyone watch This Morning today... There was a "real life Barbie" (transwoman) as she called herself saying her surgical vagina is the exact same as a biological one and that she can't stop looking at it. Phil and Holly just nodded as she said her vagina is the same as a bio woman.

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Fecking hell. I didn't see it but I know the person your talking about. He's obsessed with plastic surgery and his nose looks like it's going to melt. I'd also make a guess that he's got serious psychiatric issues.
And Holly Phil and co are just going along with this ridiculous shit show.

Jessica Alves, formerly Rodrigo, by any chance?

I’m pretty sure he only transitioned because he’d run out of “male” body parts to butcher with plastic surgery, and desperately needed a new fix.

So far it’s been facial feminisation, breast implants, gallons of god-knows-what pumped into hips and thighs, and now a surgical vagina.

I don’t think he’s going to live a long life, considering the abuse his body gets.

But my main question has always been, how does he afford it? It’s very sinister.