Gender Discussion #7

Blond3g1rl · May 2, 2021

I was watching a programme the other day by a legend of the horse riding world, Lucinda Green. In the equestrian world we are one of the only sports where men and women compete in the same classes/events.
She said, if you’re a man pick your idol who is a man, if you’re a woman pick an idol who is a women. You can’t be a woman and expect to ride like a man.
It is known that the pelvis shape of a man makes it ‘easier’, and I use that term loosely, to ride compared to the pelvis of a woman.

AnderbeauJohnson · May 2, 2021

CheshireLove said:
Look at how they are calling Jenner a “traitor” on Twitter just because as a transwoman Caitlyn doesn’t prescribe to leftist thinking. Do these people think trans people should automatically place themselves on a certain point on the political spectrum just because they are trans?

The world, people and politics are not so black and white as they seem to see things. We’ve discussed this before but I consider myself quite politically left but on this issue I suppose some would consider me far, which is sad because it’s not true at all.

It reminds me of this story of a gay Trump supporter who left-wing publications decided isn't gay (despite identifying himself as such), he only has sex with men

Peter Thiel Shows Us There's a Difference Between Gay Sex and Gay

When you abandon numerous aspects of queer identity, are you still LGBT?

www.advocate.com

By the logic of gay liberation, Thiel is an example of a man who has sex with other men, but not a gay man. Because he does not embrace the struggle of people to embrace their distinctive identity.

The history of the 1970s was not just about political campaigns for equality but it was also a subtle more profound movement to refashion the term gay. This does not mean that LGBT culture is homogenous or that all LGBT people have the same ideological viewpoints or values, but it does mean that they all understand, on some level, the notion of gay culture.

The gay liberation movement has left us a powerful legacy, and protecting that legacy requires understanding the meaning of the term "gay" and not using it simply as a synonym for same-sex desire and intimacy.

thegirlscout · May 2, 2021

AnderbeauJohnson said:
Fallon Fox talking about 'fairness' in sports - you couldn't make it up

Didn’t Fallon break her opponent’s neck during a fight?

AnderbeauJohnson · May 2, 2021

thegirlscout said:
Didn’t Fallon break her opponent’s neck during a fight?

No - she broke her skull

Biological male who broke a woman’s skull named “bravest athlete in history”

MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who twice broke an opponent’s skull to win a match, has been called the bravest athlete in history.

thepostmillennial.com

witchofwestbyfleet · May 2, 2021

thegirlscout said:
Didn’t Fallon break her opponent’s neck during a fight?

Fallon broke Tamikka Brents' skull and IIRC also severely injured Ronda Rousey in a fight. Rousey agreed to fight Fallon despite their "unfair advantage" (Rousey's words) and I just love how this was the response from certain corners: https://www.themarysue.com/ronda-rousey-and-transmisogyny/

Fishyrod42 · May 2, 2021

Luisa18 said:
What the hell are “female clothes”? I think EP needs to educate themselves on the history of clothing and fashion. You mean an actor can no longer bring themselves to wear a costume now? I think you’re in the wrong profession if that’s the case.

Well exactly. Which highlights the mental illness. She/he said that wearing a dress and high heels gave her panic attacks.

CheshireLove · May 2, 2021

emmer_moans said:
I always got creepy massive ego vibes from Barrowman, loves himself a lot I reckon. I'm not surprised at his behaviour, he should n't get away with it either.

The Noel Clarke expose was difficult to read, so much evidence of awful behaviour over so many years. I hope the police are involved and he gets charged with something. Also, shame on BAFTA for knowing about the coming storm and still giving him a lifetime achievement award or whatever it was. Disgusting.

With Barrowman, he’s got away with sexually perverse behaviour in public and lots of people knew, the cast and crew. The producers on Dr Who need to answer as they made him turning up to work with his dick out some kind of joke. The BBC had him kiss the Maria contestants without their consent as a “test” of their “acting ability”. So many people enabling this gross, scummy behaviour. The mans time is up.

Fishyrod42 · May 2, 2021

AnderbeauJohnson said:
No - she broke her skull

Biological male who broke a woman’s skull named “bravest athlete in history”

MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who twice broke an opponent’s skull to win a match, has been called the bravest athlete in history.

thepostmillennial.com

That is horrific.

Vee6 said:
I remember many years ago when I used to get popbitch emails there was always stories/rumours about barrowman. It was around the time of torch wood. And there was like a big fake eyeball that was part of the props in every episode..I remember one of the stories was about how he put it up his bum and used to then bend over and show all the people on set. Everyone was sick of him in those days

It's inappropriate but not in the same league as sexual abuse/harassment. I think as a society we need to be careful we dont edge back to the Victorian days of hypocritical propriety.

emm · May 2, 2021

Fishyrod42 said:
In the case of Elliot I feel they are a tragedy waiting to happen. In that interview with Oprah, Elliot looked so ill and fragile. I'm certain the acting work is going to dry up, what are they going to play, male characters? And he cant play females as he said wearing female clothes makes him faint. I just dont see this ending well. What Elliott needed before all this transitioning was a good, and honest, psychiatrist.

this is what makes me angry, for years we have been moving towards being gender neutral, with clothes, childrens toys etc, we are now regressing and the genders are becoming more rigid again. If thye didn't want to wear what they deem "female clothes" why did they? no one is foricng them to wear dresses or whatever. So many people that back in the day would have just been deemed "effeminiate" or a "tom boy" are now being convinced they need to transition or make big announcements regarding what they/their pronouns are

Fishyrod42 · May 2, 2021

emmer_moans said:
I always got creepy massive ego vibes from Barrowman, loves himself a lot I reckon. I'm not surprised at his behaviour, he should n't get away with it either.

Having read more he does seem an exhibitionist for sure. Why wasnt he reprimanded by bosses? Is the fact hes gay a reason people laugh it off? Is that why he thinks he can do it? Kenneth Williams was well known for flashing on set. I think it's a need to shock people.

Bitofthebubbly · May 2, 2021

Notworthy said:
I can't remember if this has been posted but good for Caitlyn Jenner. No doubt she will be cancelled shortly. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56960011

Can’t stand Caitlyn but so glad to see some sanity in this discussion from someone on the other side for once. This is someone who was an elite athlete and is now living as a trans person so they are more than qualified to speak on this to be honest.

As for Fallon Fox well he just loves beating up women which says it all, absolutely no self awareness in that one. Disgusting individual.

Fishyrod42 said:
In the case of Elliot I feel they are a tragedy waiting to happen. In that interview with Oprah, Elliot looked so ill and fragile. I'm certain the acting work is going to dry up, what are they going to play, male characters? And he cant play females as he said wearing female clothes makes him faint. I just dont see this ending well. What Elliott needed before all this transitioning was a good, and honest, psychiatrist.

She’d get away with playing a teenage boy, but that’s about it imo. She’s too tiny to be convincing as a full grown bloke.

mindlessness · May 2, 2021

Yeah, there seems to be more than a few men in entertainment who find flashing others and being ‘racy’ in group situations to be highly amusing banter. Which it isn’t. Obviously.

SqualorVictoria · May 2, 2021

Fishyrod42 said:
It's inappropriate but not in the same league as sexual abuse/harassment. I think as a society we need to be careful we dont edge back to the Victorian days of hypocritical propriety.

I'm sorry but I would say it's a little more than inappropriate. I'd be mortified if any of my colleagues did that, actors are also at work just like everyone else on set is too. We don't need to become Victorian but some more modesty wouldn't go amiss. I'm far from a prude but I don't want to see up anyones arse.

judgejohndeed · May 2, 2021

Tavistock trust whistleblower David Bell: ‘I believed I was doing the right thing’

The psychiatrist behind a critical report on the gender identity unit at the NHS trust on the efforts to silence him and his concerns about children’s access to treatment

www.theguardian.com

This is a great article.

witchofwestbyfleet · May 2, 2021

Fishyrod42 said:
Well exactly. Which highlights the mental illness. She/he said that wearing a dress and high heels gave her panic attacks.

Would she turn down a period drama because the men of the day wore wigs and heels, I wonder? The Oprah interview also indicated that Page thinks her preference for "boys'" clothes at an early age should have indicated she was trans - so any girl who would rather be comfortable than pretty must really be a boy?!

SqualorVictoria said:
I'm sorry but I would say it's a little more than inappropriate. I'd be mortified if any of my colleagues did that, actors are also at work. We don't need to become Victorian but some more modesty wouldn't go amiss. I'm far from a prude but I don't want to see up anyones arse

I've seen several posts on Twitter/Insta along the lines of "because of Onlyfans, everyone's seen up their friends' arses" which I find revolting - I do think Onlyfans and the like contribute to an erasure of boundaries that makes things easier for predators

maytoseptember · May 2, 2021

Fishyrod42 said:
In the case of Elliot I feel they are a tragedy waiting to happen. In that interview with Oprah, Elliot looked so ill and fragile.

I feel the same. And if, god forbid, something terrible happens, then it will be blamed on transphobia/how difficult it is to live as a trans person, rather than serious mental illness that predates transitioning.

EP is clearly someone in severe mental distress that has latched onto transitioning as the answer to their problems. As is the case with vast numbers of FTMs.

Bitofthebubbly · May 2, 2021

witchofwestbyfleet said:
Would she turn down a period drama because the men of the day wore wigs and heels, I wonder? The Oprah interview also indicated that Page thinks her preference for "boys'" clothes at an early age should have indicated she was trans - so any girl who would rather be comfortable than pretty must really be a boy?!

It’s a horrifying thought when you consider that there has already been an increase in girls identifying as trans and no one seems to be interested in why this might be. Do we really need to be sending the message that clothes have so much importance in relation to gender identity? It feels like erasure of tomboy girls and effeminate boys. They are just clothes for goodness sake, they don’t hold that much weight.

So glad I grew up in the 90’s when I could be left to simply enjoy feeling comfortable in what ever clothes I liked whether that be a dress, a tracksuit or what ever in between. Society is regressing in this aspect.

Notworthy · May 2, 2021

Fishyrod42 said:
Having read more he does seem an exhibitionist for sure. Why wasnt he reprimanded by bosses? Is the fact hes gay a reason people laugh it off? Is that why he thinks he can do it? Kenneth Williams was well known for flashing on set. I think it's a need to shock people.

This has become normalised behaviour though. I have a mixed race Son, an employee of mine, knowing this and having a new black boyfriend thought it entirely reasonable to show me a picture of his cock because I like black men!!! My immediate reaction was to ask her whether her boyfriend was aware she was showing all and sundry this picture as it was a gross invasion of his privacy in my opinion leave alone the fact that I really didn't need or want to see his cock.

emm · May 2, 2021

Notworthy said:
This has become normalised behaviour though. I have a mixed race Son, an employee of mine, knowing this and having a new black boyfriend thought it entirely reasonable to show me a picture of his cock because I like black men!!! My immediate reaction was to ask her whether her boyfriend was aware she was showing all and sundry this picture as it was a gross invasion of his privacy in my opinion leave alone the fact that I really didn't need or want to see his cock.

how in any way would anyone view this as appropriate, especially at work?!

thegirlscout · May 2, 2021

AnderbeauJohnson said:
No - she broke her skull

Biological male who broke a woman’s skull named “bravest athlete in history”

MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who twice broke an opponent’s skull to win a match, has been called the bravest athlete in history.

thepostmillennial.com

Twice?! The poor woman! That’s horrendous.

Gender Discussion #7

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