Gender Discussion #13

[AnderbeauJohnson]

I'm still mostly taking a break from gender stuff for a while so I don't know if it was mentioned in the last thread but I just found out about 'gender nullification surgery' and I genuinely want to curl up in a ball and cry at this point - it is surely going to be done to some CSA victims who might want to look non-sexual to people. And I hate the 'cutsy' terms being used for such extreme, life-altering surgery. 'Top surgery' was bad enough but Nullo? Smoothie?

Non-Binary Surgery - Crane Center for Transgender Surgery

At Crane Center, we offer several options for Non-Binary Surgery. Our surgeons will work with you to create a plan that is specific to you and your needs.

cranects.com

Genital nullification, Nullo, or Eunuch procedures involve removing all external genitalia to create a smooth transition from the abdomen to the groin. In some cases, this involves shortening the urethra. For patients born with a uterus, a hysterectomy is required prior to any genital nullification procedure. Your specific goals can be discussed with one of our surgeons to develop a plan that works for you.

Gender Nullification in Palo Alto, California | Davis Plastic Surgery | Gender Nullification in 94306

Before and after photos can be found in our Gallery or by clicking the link here. Dr. Davis is one of just a handful of North American surgeons who have been performing gender confirmation surgeries for more than 20 years. However, not all gender pat...

www.davisplasticsurgery.com

For his gender non-conforming patients, Dr. Davis also performs gender nullification, also known as male to eunuch or “smoothie” procedures. The procedure includes a complete penectomy, orchiectomy, a reduction of the scrotal sac, and shortening of the urethra. The goal is to leave the area as a smooth unbroken transition from the abdomen to the groin. Although, an inconspicuous midline scar and shortened urethra will still be present.

Gender Affirmation - Post Street Surgery Center

www.poststreetsurgery.com

• Nullification produces a relatively-smooth genital area with a continuous transition from the abdomen down into the genitals, suitable for those who don’t identify with male or female identities.

NULLIFICATION

At Align Surgical a gender nullification procedure can enable non-conforming clients to enjoy a relatively smooth genital area by creating a relatively continuous and mostly unbroken transition from the abdomen down into the genital area.

www.alignsurgical.com

This one has some photos if you click on 'gallery' of MTF nullification but come with an obvious trigger warning

While many patients might be interested in transitioning into either a male or female identity, there are plenty of individuals who feel that their gender identity does not quite conform in one direction or the other. Gender nullification surgery can enable non-conforming patients to enjoy a relatively smooth genital area.

Nullification creates a relatively continuous and mostly unbroken transition from the abdomen down into the genital area, enabling gender non-conforming patients to enjoy a body that looks closer on the outside to the way they feel on the inside.

How does turning someone into a Ken doll fall under 'do no harm'? How can any surgeon look themselves in the mirror after doing that to someone, even if they say they want it? I hope the patients sue the hell out of the people who performed them in future.

 

[thegirlscout]

What on Earth?!

 

[Whatevesmate]

I know. This thread has always been so friendly and respectful, it genuinely upset me to see all this graphic talk in favour of porn & BDSM etc.

My spidey senses started tingling when that poster said something disparaging about Emily Maitlis and Naga Munchetty (Naga especially attracts a lot of misogynistic hate on Twitter). I had a feeling the poster was a man. I pulled them up on it but they didn’t respond. The “pay gap myth” stuff is also a very male complaint. I’m sure it’s the same person.

I'm new here (& I am legit! Hopefully that is evident from what I have posted) but I found it really disconcerting when it became apparent that that person was infiltrating this space to spread creepy & damaging BS. I guess we have to be weary that this may happen which is horribly ironic. I'm sick of being hypervigilant. Perhaps we all need to be especially watchful when someone new arrives here now especially if they are saying stuff which seems off. Good it got called out today though and they have fucked off.

 

[Doc]

I wonder if urban/rural affects how you view things? Most of my rural friends are GC, but city ones are TRAs.

my Step daughter is 19, and pressured by her friends at uni (ultra woke irritants who know it all) to not be straight because it’s “not normal”. They harass her about shopping at fast fashion places like Shein (it’s all she can afford), to go vegan, be a communist etc. They’re very vocal about TWAW, step daughter is on the fence but gets torn a strip if she argues back.

honestly, universities are vile. They’ve always been left leaning and prone to producing individuals with condescending attitudes, but they’re inundated with unbearable, oppressively opinionated c*nts now.

 

[Whatevesmate]

That conversation made me so uncomfortable just reading it so I dread to think how you must’ve felt it’s not normally like that in here. I had typed basically the opposite response to them out to you before I saw their reply and then decided to just dip out instead because it seemed like it was getting a bit weird. You’re not the only one who is anti-porn though, trust me!

Its such a shame that a creep came on here and made women feel so uncomfortable
Makes me simultaneously feel sad and really furious. How dare they. I hope that this incident will make us all more confident to call out material that makes us feel really uncomfortable in the future. I intend to do so. The thought of some aggressive perv saying stuff to upset women on here makes me fucking livid. Grrrr!!!

 

[colouredlines]

i know very little about medicine/science... but how could this possibly work? putting in a kidney/liver or whatever is relatively straightforward as whatever sex you are you have the other parts, but a uterus is not the only thing women need to carry a baby surely? Also curious about where the womb is coming from, as it is not a standard thing to transplant it would be weird if they just have them to use like this surely? I just have so many questions about this, really makes 0 sense, also imagine she cannot conceive naturaly (which I imagine she won't) then IVF doesn't work either, a needlessly dangerous operation for absolutely nothing

There's so much about women's health which still doesn't seem to be well understood. Pregnancy has an enormous impact on a woman's body, and all the results tend to get hand-waved as "oh, hormones!" PND is the prime example of this.

The idea that a womb works on a plug and play basis is insane. Jessica needs psychological help, and the doctors involved should all be struck off. Even if there were a sliver of possibility of a viable pregnancy (there isn't), the child would be a science experiment. That is grotesque!

 

[chorizorice]

I am very cautious of people who speak too much about sex or their sex life on Tattle in general. It just gives me “I’m wanking off hoping these women reply to me” vibes.

I am a bit of a prude in that sense though. I don’t think sex lives should be discussed in detail with anyone other than who you’re shagging.

I completely agree with you. I just want to mention that when I brought up that I find porn offensive and don’t feel comfortable with my partner watching it, I wanted to start conversation about the harm of porn and hear about other people who share the same views as me. When that one person started to tell me what I can do to bring porn into my relationship, find out about their kinks, etc etc etc, I was horrified. Mortified. I felt so embarrassed for coming on here and sharing that I’m anti-porn and upset that my partner isn’t because it suddenly became about my sex life and I stopped looking on this thread for a couple days. that was off and I think the majority of people don’t want to talk about sex lives in that manner.. you can definitely see when things aren’t right.

I have zero interest in children but I've never been on the childfree thread - I don't want them, nothing more to talk about!

Today I met up with a gay male friend and he asked me what I thought about Laurel Hubbard. Can of worms time...we ended up having a very long discussion about so many areas of the gender debate. It was interesting to see the perspective of someone who hasn't previously paid much attention; he told me at first he thought it was fine to have trans athletes, then he realised what that actually entailed, and quickly changed his mind.

As a gay guy, the transwomen he's more familiar with are the old school types, who called themselves gay men before they transitioned. He told me he was quite shocked by how broad the trans category has become now.

It was pretty refreshing. As I said before, I don't often talk about these things in real life, so it's always nice to find someone who is on the same page as me. It's also interesting to see his perspective; I think a lot of people hear "transwoman" and still think of Dana International, so they get the shock of their life when Laurel Hubbard lumbers into view!

How amazing that you got to have a long and from what it sounds like open discussion with a friend about LH. I love when I am able to speak to someone about this topic, I also don’t tend to have many conversations about this with people, but when it happens and we can listen to eachother and even share the same views, it is unmatched and gives me some faith in the world.

Speaking of faith, it’s lost.. again.

 

[Clover123]

Help me, I've just been on Twitter and seen this. What's wrong with the world. Do people really think this. My vagina is not a hole to thrust stuff in, it make me feel sad that people (men) think that. My children came from my vagina, it's not an inverted cock.

This is what I struggle with- how do you even begin to tackle arguing with someone who genuinely believes that male and female genitals are as similar as in and out belly buttons?! Where do you even start?! Primary school level biology lessons?!

 

[LaLa247]

I’m finding a lot of the media coverage on incels pretty frustrating at the moment, it’s obvious this is the first time a lot of people are hearing the term and I don’t think ‘involuntary celibate’ describes it very well at all.

It’s true a lot of these men might have found themselves on these site and forums because they felt they were unable to meet women, but a lot of the men on these sites are in relationships and even married. Like most things on the internet there are loads of different fractures that sit under the ‘incel’ umbrella.

We obviously don’t know a lot of information about the incident that has happened recently here in the UK - but I am absolutely sure that perpetrator walking into a bar and sleeping with a woman would not of changed anything. These are deep rooted misogynistic (and very often racist) beliefs - these people aren’t all in their parents basements, you could be living with, working with or even dating an ‘incel’.

And that’s me not even getting started on the awful ‘dating coaches’ ‘pick-up artists’ that are more popular than ever, a different approach but all of course laced with misogyny and lack of respect for women.

 

[Brigitjonesbuttcheek]

Alan freestone can fuck right off.

Women aren't on this earth to make men happy. And we are not responsible for their actions, especially not from our own inactions. If anything they should be making us happy, we make their fucking kids. We give them the thing that they want, they should be nice to us. I think it would serve them right if we reverse handmaid's taled them. Keep the clever nice ones for sperm donations, the rest we can just make them build shit.

 

[thegirlscout]

Leaving aside their views on women in general, the comments about rape genuinely shocked me.

When you have websites that teach men how to rape women (apparently there was a subreddit that did this) it’s no wonder boys have this skewed take on women.

 

[Phil Anne Throw Pee]

Women don't commit violent crimes at the same rate because they can't. They don't have the physical strength or high testosterone to lower inhibition.

Take these factors out of it and you'll find we're every bit as violent as men: men and women kill children everywhere in the world in an equal split.

---


Sorry what is TRA, TWAW, WAW?

Is there a glossary somewhere?



Christians are naturally anti-secular but I've never ever found them to be racist.



For sure. These lunatics are operating on borrowed time. I really want to see jail time for some of these doctors doing a Goebbels on little kids. HUGE amounts of money in trans surgery by the way. It's an enormous cash cow. Plus the government gives hospitals and doctors bonuses on top.



This sounds so hard, I'm so sorry. I don't know what I'd do in your situation. I guess, like him, I'd surround myself with people of shared values.

Sanity would also factor quite high up in my list of requirements in friends and family, unless the insane person was seeking help rather than try to co-opt me into their insanity.

I wish there was a real life community for people with our beliefs but HNH and Plod would probably label us a terrorist group, they're so corrupt.



I'm a decade older than you but am often around your age group on a course I'm doing. Even the potential allies have shut off all thought or feeling and walk around like weird asleep people. Easier to be comatose than aware. Maybe get into communities where these things don't come up. Rarely hear about this stuff when I go karting or play tennis or learn about gardening or DIY. As for those who agree, I don't know. Even religious people are forced to pay lip service so going to church or synagogue is no sure bet. It depends where you are. Try and get out of city centres.

TRA - Trans rights activist
TWAW Trans women are women
WAW Women are women.

I bet the TRA's are FUMING that attention is being paid to ACTUAL WOMEN WITH REAL VAGINAS in Afghanistan and momentarily they are not the tippermost of the victim pyramid.

 

[threeSMEGfridges]

WTF so these incels should just purchase a woman's body so they can have their desires fulfilled and potentially be abused and degraded by the incel. And they say sex work is a valid form of work! Yes nice that women have to be the ones to put themselves in danger to please a man

Also, Incels seem to be a combination of chronic low self-esteem / poor social skills coupled with toxic narcissism.

They bemoan not being good enough for 'hot' women; but this isn't a fault of theirs so much as the female species' as a whole. They have an extreme sense of entitlement to have sex with women (which in this case I do mean the female sex). Hence their whole Chad/Stacey narrative crap.

They're "not like other men" however this is more of a failing of the women who they want to be with sexually but also think are too stupid to see how more ideal they are.

 

[dodo789]

Also - Diana was trans



So following this logic, I’m also trans because I dressed up as Harry Potter in kindergarten because I had short hair at the time and was obsessed with HP…seems legit

 

[Icing _on_ the_cake]

In today's edition of, "Puberty blockers are reversible ," this case report is a few years old, but looked at the impact of pubertal suppression on the brain via cognitive evaluation and MR imaging.

The 11 year old boy's global IQ dropped from 80 to 71 over the three years of his treatment, as well as other markers such as Comprehension Index and Working Memory Index.

Ijust find this all terribly problematic:

"At age three, they noticed some female behaviors and sought out psychological treatment. They were informed about a possible DG diagnosis, and the child was kept in psychotherapy to “reverse the desire of belonging to the opposite sex” until age seven. The patient and parents report that she made efforts to behave as a boy during this treatment. At nine, she assumed her gender identity and reported believing that she was born the wrong sex, and she wanted to be a girl."

What are 'female behaviours', why were they a problem? What does 'behave as a boy' mean?

 

[Scotch Mist]

I blame Charlize and Angelina for that nonsense they pushed down their daughter's/son's throat.

I do NOT think Brad Pitt supported it and Angelina is the kind of evil bitch (sorry for being crass) she is, is using the kids against him. Source: https://www.thethings.com/20-things-angelina-jolie-doesnt-share-about-her-firstborn-shiloh/

Also, FYI, Madonna went down the same path with her adopted son Banda. She's making him dress in lady's clothes. Rocco, her biological son, could have gone the same path if not for Guy Ritchie having full custody.

I am not villifying women or female celebrities but this seems to be a growing trend amongst celebrities now. They are trying to normalise this nonsense.

You also have this nonsense that Jolie said about her own flesh and blood.

“(Shiloh) looks like Brad. It’s funny because she’s almost going to be the outcast in the family because she’s blonde and blue-eyed. I felt so much more for Madd, Zahara and Pax because they were survivors,” Jolie said. “Shiloh seemed so privileged from the moment she was born. But I’m conscious that I have to make sure I don’t ignore her needs, just because I think the others are more vulnerable.”

I feel sorry for the little girl. Godspeed.

Source: https://www.today.com/popculture/shiloh-jolie-pitt-goes-blob-outcast-wbna22205927

Satire but true sadly. https://www.hvy.com/greg-thomson/transgender-agenda-hollywood-african-babies

That quote from Angelina about her daughter is truly shocking. How could she say that about her own child!

It seems that Shiloh was just a 'tomboy' when she was younger because she wanted to fit in with her brothers.
In recent pictures she has longer hair and looks more feminine. So like most tomboys puberty may have changed her feelings about wanting to dress as a boy.

 

[Vanelope]

Two friends of mine - both work pretty high up at household name institutions - both have had diversity training and raised their eyebrows. One also has to do trans training.
I expressed my opinion that I believe in science. They laughed and said you have to stand in the corner. They agree with me - but have to work within places that increasingly don’t accept science. Which worries me greatly.

 

[AlanBanan]

I don’t know any trained archaeologists that works in a pub full time whilst tweeting their deviant thoughts on Twitter.

They’re more than likely a massive fantasist and shocked they were called out for lying and over exaggerating about throwing the big evil TERFs out of the pub, yet will show no proof and keep calling people cunts like an angry edgy teen.

TiMs always seem to be pathological liars, manipulative and self pitying. So when the liar is caught they go into ultra defence and start to call people names. Anyone questioning their behaviour rather than the usual coddling of their feelings and exempting them from any sort of responsibility are being called cunts by the ugly ginger cumbrain.

 

[Scotch Mist]

Ngl I’m rather interested in the science behind just shoving a womb and how that may turn out in practice but doing this on a human with so little knowledge just doesn’t seem right at all

Even with the slim chance that it would work I don’t think the practice would really catch on in the trans community anyway or at all, so I don’t really see the issue there personally

Hmm I'm not so sure. It's completely unethical in my view not to mention downright dangerous. I think it's guaranteed not to work.

If this was successful I bet there would be quite a lot of takers for the op. Especially as they could then claim to he able to do everything women can do.

 

[Phil Anne Throw Pee]

I am so depressed. On FB earlier, a friend who I REALLY respect commented on an article about Joan Smith who was sacked following her questioning transgender 'policies'. My friend commented that it was right she was sacked as someone who has gone through the pain of transitioning is not going to want to invade women's spaces 'for the sake of it' and what a bigot Smith is. Sometimes my faith in humanity flails wildly.