Gender Discussion #11

[hydeist]

but, what is more probable is perhaps the human body, when it senses the ‘female’ hormone - prepares itself for that experience, thus giving every sensation of a period, but the actual bleeding.

If you looked at the link I provided, you'd see that there is not "a female hormone" that causes a period or symptoms - it's in fact a complex process of multiple hormones changing throughout the month.

I will however concede that it does seem entirely likely that the combination of oestrogen therapy and the placebo effect may result in a transwoman experiencing phantom pain or mood swings.

 

[Vanelope]

Trans biology isn’t any different to anyone else’s biology. Yes people haven’t done long term studies of taking cross sex hormones but to say period symptoms rather than medical side effects is disingenuous.

 

[SqualorVictoria]

There's probably a certain amount of wishful thinking too. Let's not forget how some TiMs fetishise pretty much all aspects of female biology- I've seen TiMs fetishise abortion, for example

 

[mindlessness]

Trans women may not really be experiencing a ‘true period’, but phantom pains can still be experienced and can feel very real and I don’t think discarding that is very fair. Unless you’ve had feminizing hormone therapy yourself, you really wouldn’t know.

They experience symptoms, not an entire menstrual cycle.

Those are side effects. Not symptoms of a menstrual cycle. Side effects from the 'feminizing hormone therapy' you mention. I'm sure they also suck just like some period symptoms do. But they're not the same.

 

[SqualorVictoria]

Those are side effects. Not symptoms of a menstrual sycle. Side effects from the 'feminizing hormone therapy'.

Yes it's almost like there'll be side effects when you take hormones that aren't meant for your body...

 

[Notworthy]

Those are side effects. Not symptoms of a menstrual cycle. Side effects from the 'feminizing hormone therapy' you mention. I'm sure they also suck just like some period symptoms do. But they're not the same.

Precisely, nothing to do with a menstrual cycle, just side effects of taking some pretty potent drugs. Stop the drugs and the problem disappears, we have the opposite, stop the drugs and the problem increases.

 

[Lonelylondon]

If you looked at the link I provided, you'd see that there is not "a female hormone" that causes a period or symptoms - it's in fact a complex process of multiple hormones changing throughout the month.

I will however concede that it does seem entirely likely that the combination of oestrogen therapy and the placebo effect may result in a transwoman experiencing phantom pain or mood swings.

I do believe that trans women can experience some of the period symptoms but in saying that, it’s only ever the stereotypical symptoms that I hear them talk about

 

[hydeist]

Those are side effects. Not symptoms of a menstrual cycle. Side effects from the 'feminizing hormone therapy' you mention. I'm sure they also suck just like some period symptoms do. But they're not the same.

Yes, I think it's probably fair to say there could be significant and uncomfortable side effects from taking hormones, and it is pretty important medically to distinguish between menstruation and those side effects.

 

[maytoseptember]

I can well believe that progesterone has an effect on the smooth muscle in the gut, as it does in the female menstrual cycle.

Do TW take progesterone as well as oestrogen?

If so, it’s fair to assume that they might get some occasional abdominal cramps.

Is it reasonable to call it a “period”? Is it duck.

 

[Ispyabudgetbeanblogger]

If you looked at the link I provided, you'd see that there is not "a female hormone" that causes a period or symptoms - it's in fact a complex process of multiple hormones changing throughout the month.

I will however concede that it does seem entirely likely that the combination of oestrogen therapy and the placebo effect may result in a transwoman experiencing phantom pain or mood swings.

I'm experiencing mood swings reading about transwomen getting periods. What is that a symptom of I wonder?

 

[hydeist]

I can well believe that progesterone has an effect on the smooth muscle in the gut, as it does in the female menstrual cycle.

Do TW take progesterone as well as oestrogen?

If so, it’s fair to assume that they might get some occasional abdominal cramps.

Is it reasonable to call it a “period”? Is it duck.

My (admittedly quick) research would suggest that it's common to take oestrogen/oestrogen-increasing drugs and medication to suppress testosterone - as the main goal is "feminisation" and progesterone doesn't contribute to that and so isn't particularly useful to a trans woman. Progestogens are mostly useful for maintaining a pregnancy and lactation (also creation of sperm), outside of the menstrual cycle.

 

[Lonelylondon]

Has anyone read about that influencer who has come out as Korean? Lol, they have actually had surgery to make themselves look more Korean, despite being white British. I also say they, because they are non binary (shock). They have rightly had a lot of backlash in terms of the transracial thing, but I wonder if this is where we are heading next, having said that, I can’t see anyone ever really being okay with people claiming to change race, but it is interesting why that is so controversial but changing sex isn’t? Isn’t your gender a more important characteristic than things like your race or age? And when I say important, I just mean in terms of differences, men and women are more different than a 20 year old and a 40 year old, or a black person and a white person. I hope Im making sense.

 

[mindlessness]

Meanwhile, in women's health... https://www.theguardian.com/books/2021/jun/08/unwell-women-elinor-cleghorn-book

 

[AlanBanan]

derp.. trans women can actually get period symptoms believe it or not :O

how’s about educating yourself on the matter instead of slaying people you know absolutely nothing about.

Ah, yeah. I forget that trans women all have female sex organs and can shed their menstrual tissue every 28- 35
days.

I also don’t have to educate myself on periods as I do get them!

 

[hydeist]

Has anyone read about that influencer who has come out as Korean? Lol, they have actually had surgery to make themselves look more Korean, despite being white British. I also say they, because they are non binary (shock). They have rightly had a lot of backlash in terms of the transracial thing, but I wonder if this is where we are heading next, having said that, I can’t see anyone ever really being okay with people claiming to change race, but it is interesting why that is so controversial but changing sex isn’t? Isn’t your gender a more important characteristic than things like your race or age? And when I say important, I just mean in terms of differences, men and women are more different than a 20 year old and a 40 year old, or a black person and a white person. I hope Im making sense.

To be honest I find it really hard to understand the difference between the offence taken at someone being "transracial" and the same feelings from people who don't believe in changing sex. Not that I don't understand there are differences, but rather the responses to the transracial guy are things like "you can't just get surgery and say you're Korean now". What's the difference between that statement and "you can't just get surgery and say you're a man now"?

Though outside of any opinions on those topics, I think it's crazy any doctor agreed to perform those surgeries to make him look "Asian". He looks terrible, not Korean.

 

[Vanelope]

Has anyone read about that influencer who has come out as Korean? Lol, they have actually had surgery to make themselves look more Korean, despite being white British. I also say they, because they are non binary (shock). They have rightly had a lot of backlash in terms of the transracial thing, but I wonder if this is where we are heading next, having said that, I can’t see anyone ever really being okay with people claiming to change race, but it is interesting why that is so controversial but changing sex isn’t? Isn’t your gender a more important characteristic than things like your race or age? And when I say important, I just mean in terms of differences, men and women are more different than a 20 year old and a 40 year old, or a black person and a white person. I hope Im making sense.

How is that different to Rachel Dolezal tanning and living as a black person?

 

[maytoseptember]

My (admittedly quick) research would suggest that it's common to take oestrogen/oestrogen-increasing drugs and medication to suppress testosterone - as the main goal is "feminisation" and progesterone doesn't contribute to that and so isn't particularly useful to a trans woman. Progestogens are mostly useful for maintaining a pregnancy and lactation (also creation of sperm), outside of the menstrual cycle.

That’s why I wasn’t sure if progesterone was even given to TW, but it’s certainly more of a contributor to abdominal cramps than oestrogen, afaik.

There is still a huge amount of trans biology that hasn’t yet been studied or documented due to societal repression so nobody really knows for sure.

what is more probable is perhaps the human body, when it senses the ‘female’ hormone - prepares itself for that experience, thus giving every sensation of a period, but the actual bleeding.

1. Tell me about about this societal repression and why this would be?

2. This is not probable at all, and it only seems probable if you have zero understanding of biology. A male body, which does not possess a uterus, simply cannot and would not produce pseudo uterine cramps, simply because it’s being supplemented with female hormones. That is pure magical thinking.

 

[Blond3g1rl]

I’m sure if a trans woman goes to the gp saying they have period pains they will get all sorts of pain to help ease their ‘symptoms’.
Unlike me, who was told by a male GP, that periods can hurt get used to it.

 

[Waazzii]

Trans biology isn’t any different to anyone else’s biology. Yes people haven’t done long term studies of taking cross sex hormones but to say period symptoms rather than medical side effects is disingenuous.

Okay, period-like symptoms if we’re getting technical about it

Those are side effects. Not symptoms of a menstrual cycle. Side effects from the 'feminizing hormone therapy' you mention. I'm sure they also suck just like some period symptoms do. But they're not the same.

I didn’t state that it was an actual menstrual cycle, they just experience symptoms such as cramping and mood swings.

All of this hasn’t been studied enough to know for sure, but I personally know trans women who have experienced this and their symptoms are very close to that of a normal menstrual cycle - even syncing with their cis female friends’ cycles.

The way things are in the world with people identifying as things when they’re not etc is ridiculous, I agree with you all on that. But disregarding trans people just because you don’t understand or simply just haven’t been through it yourself is unfair, although it’s a natural human reaction to disagree with a totally new concept.

My brother is trans (FTM) and I feel really strongly about this whole topic. Please just try and be more open minded, most people who come out aren’t just part of the facade.

With generations and education developing by the century, there’s gonna be a lot more of this new knowledge to come. We might even find out all the reasoning behind these phantom period symptoms in 5 years time, who knows

 

[AlanBanan]

To be honest I find it really hard to understand the difference between the offence taken at someone being "transracial" and the same feelings from people who don't believe in changing sex. Not that I don't understand there are differences, but rather the responses to the transracial guy are things like "you can't just get surgery and say you're Korean now". What's the difference between that statement and "you can't just get surgery and say you're a man now"?

Though outside of any opinions on those topics, I think it's crazy any doctor agreed to perform those surgeries to make him look "Asian". He looks terrible, not Korean.

He’s obsessed with a singer called Jimin Park from the band bts and desperately is trying to look like him.