Gender discussion #102

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Cannot express my joy for the Darlington nurses enough but am still livid they've had to go through this in the first place and the judgement that "Rose" wasn't deliberately harrassing them directly "herself" is the biggest load of poo.

I hate living in this timeline, it's so stupid it makes my head hurt.
 
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Cannot express my joy for the Darlington nurses enough but am still livid they've had to go through this in the first place and the judgement that "Rose" wasn't deliberately harrassing them directly "herself" is the biggest load of poo.

I hate living in this timeline, it's so stupid it makes my head hurt.
...so true...it's even got into my Sims Freeplay (choose gender) and apparently the new Star Trek series is ruined by DEI (I stuck by Discovery as some good ideas as was better in later series)...
 
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...so true...it's even got into my Sims Freeplay (choose gender) and apparently the new Star Trek series is ruined by DEI (I stuck by Discovery as some good ideas as was better in later series)...
I've only ever really been into original Star Trek so I dodged the bullet of the latest series, won't even watch the trailer.

Some amusing commentary about it on Youtube tho!
 
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I saw a comment on this on the site of the muvvers. It pointed out yet another subtle (and, I would say, iniquitous) shift in language


IW complains "I don’t know what to say anymore. Really, I don’t. The equivalent of playground mean girl terfs are championed by a UK court - who say THEIR dignity was violated by being near a woman who is trans. When they were the ones doing the harassing and being vile."

The poster pointed out that "a woman who is trans" would, in most people's mids be a "transman" - not a man who has transed from male to female.

So we moved from "transwoman" (no space - trans as a prefix), to "trans woman" (space - trans shifts to perform duty as an adjective), and now it is "a woman who is trans" (emphasis is on the importance of woman-ness). These little linguistic shifts are dangerous. Every single one of them is taking us a step further from the truth.

This is NOT a "woman who is trans". This is NOT a woman at all. It is a MAN, pretending that he is a woman. But just look at where the language is taking us.

Edit to add - Psychologically, using the phrasing "a woman who is trans" pushes us into a mindset of that "woman" being vulnerable and in need of protection in the situation - like "a woman who is blind", or "a woman who is in a wheelchair" or whatever.
 
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I saw a comment on this on the site of the muvvers. It pointed out yet another subtle (and, I would say, iniquitous) shift in language


IW complains "I don’t know what to say anymore. Really, I don’t. The equivalent of playground mean girl terfs are championed by a UK court - who say THEIR dignity was violated by being near a woman who is trans. When they were the ones doing the harassing and being vile."

The poster pointed out that "a woman who is trans" would, in most people's mids be a "transman" - not a man who has transed from male to female.

So we moved from "transwoman" (no space - trans as a prefix), to "trans woman" (space - trans shifts to perform duty as an adjective), and now it is "a woman who is trans" (emphasis is on the importance of woman-ness). These little linguistic shifts are dangerous. Every single one of them is taking us a step further from the truth.

This is NOT a "woman who is trans". This is NOT a woman at all. It is a MAN, pretending that he is a woman. But just look at where the language is taking us.

Edit to add - Psychologically, using the phrasing "a woman who is trans" pushes us into a mindset of that "woman" being vulnerable and in need of protection in the situation - like "a woman who is blind", or "a woman who is in a wheelchair" or whatever.
I bloody wish Himdia really didn’t know what to say anymore so didn’t say anything! That really would be a blessing.
 
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I've never looked at "b;uesky" before - but what a whine-fest IWs timeline is. 🤮🤮🤮
Don't bother.

The very, very worst of Twitter/X from circa 2016 - whenever it was Elon bought it are all there and they are more unhinged than ever. The good thing is it means they don't have the groupthink dominance over other platforms as they did. They seem to only want an echo chamber, they are welcome to it.
 
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Going back to Six, they’ve protected their posts and deleted the tweet quoted here:

I suspect the backlash to Queen Man Boleyn was more than they expected.

IMG_4686.jpeg
 
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Thank you for sharing the pride and predator podcast, it’s really interesting. I could listen to this woman all day. Good on her
 
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I can’t fathom it either. I came across these two comments from a middle-aged, self-described ‘cis’ woman about the Darlington nurses.

View attachment 3856705
View attachment 3856706
People like this don't know, and can't be bothered, to read the details of the case, understand the law and the facts. This comment says absolutely nothing, it's just insults, name calling and made up words strung together to make a vacuous statement which they think makes them superior. The Darlington Nurses and many other women like them are courageously fighting for the rights of all women, while this bellend posts waffle on the Internet.
 
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Hmmm, what angle do you reckon the Guardian is trying to push with this ? also interesting how they only show photos of one side. Would you not want to show all the hateful white people?


"On one side was a multiracial mix of hundreds of people rallying for trans rights and in support of Becky Pepper-Jackson, a track and field athlete from West Virginia and the plaintiff in the West Virginia v BPJ case before the supreme court.

On the other side was an equally large crowd, mostly white, that was calling on the supreme court to “protect women’s sports” by upholding laws in West Virginia and Idaho that prohibit trans youth from participating in sports programs aligned with their gender identity.

In many ways, the scene looked like other DC rallies over trans and queer rights over the past decade. Trans advocates and their allies danced to remixes of songs by the pop star Chappell Roan, while those opposing trans rights at one point held a prayer for the legal team representing West Virginia.

But the protests this week appeared to have a visible shift in the size, tone and aggression from the crowd opposing trans rights, advocates said. The Guardian witnessed trans activists being shoulder-checked, shoved, chased and recorded. When the trans advocacy crowd chanted “our existence is resistance”, the other side launched one of their own: “Your existence is ridiculous.”"

 
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Anne Boleyn was “transsexual coded” and would have “loved” being played by a man? Are you quite mad?

She was an intensely religious and highly intelligent woman who struggled with the uniquely female, royal challenge of her primary role being to produce male heirs, which she was unable to do, and for which inability she was executed on trumped up charges. She did, of course, end up being the mother of a great queen. And both of them were traduced and shamed every day of their lives for their failures of “proper“ womanhood.

What possible insight can some hammy, flappy, frog mouthed man have into any of that?

I havent seen Six so god only knows what historical atrocities they commit, but if I got to cast it and had to have Mulvaney play someone, I’d cast him as Anne of Cleeves, who Henry couldn’t get it up with because he thought she was a minger.
Here is my Six rant.....
It is a brilliant musical with a lot of historical accuracy. And that is why I am sad.
As well as some cracking songs it teaches you the human side of the 'divorced, beheaded, died' mantra and very much tells the story of the Queens with actually little reference to the twit they all married.
K.Aragon was married for nearly 25 years to H8. Gave birth to many children including sons, but Mary was only surviving child. She considered herself Queen until she died at age 50. Had to watch that large twit remarry time and time again whilst having to fight for her life as well as the life of the daughter she was never allowed to see.
A.Boleyn was extremely religious and basically taught that marrying royalty was the only thing important. Her parents raised their children to marry royalty like an Olympic sport. After only 3ish years was considered an inconvenience because she 'only' had a girl. Trans icon my a.
J.Seymour Good family but not the brightest. Considered a good match because H8 was more educated and therefore could outsmart her. First 2 wives were very clever, educated and experienced in life and could give as good as they got. Wife 3 was almost illiterate and very meek and mild. Married her about a week after he executed his 2nd wife and she died about a year later after giving birth.
A.Cleves My favourite wife. H8 genuinely married her because she had a beautiful portrait. She came from an excellent family both financially and politically. He was genuinely repulsed by her appearance but married her anyway. He was unable to consumate the marriage allegedly because she was so weird. More likely because he was so drunk and riddled with STDs. Annulled (so not technically divorced but that doesn't rhyme) and she actually did very well. Absolutely humiliated she had some bloody good lawyers who threatened to tell the world H8 couldn't get an erection. He paid her handsomely and she lived an incredible life
K.Howard the sadest of them all. Married about a week after 4th wife got her annulment. She was about 17. H8 was about 50. She was executed at 19, less than 2 years later. This was absolutely an abused and groomed little girl. From puberty she was passed around by 'uncles' and H8 learned of her being available. Again taught by her parents that bagging the king was the ultimate goal she flattered the large gout and ulcer ridden slob and convinced him she loved him. H8 actually managed to consumate the marriage but he was cruel and abused her. The poor wretched kid was flattered by courtiers and abused and r*ped. H8 used this as her using witchcraft against him and she was beheaded for treason. In reality she humiliated the king so she had to go. H8 was so humiliated he decided that she shouldn't ascend to heaven in the rapture. When the end of days comes you need a body to go up to heaven so he had her thrown in the ground in the church at Tower of London so her body was next to Anne Boleyn. Then he had quick lime thrown on her so it basically dissolves and there's no chance of redemption.
C.Parr H8 was her 3rd out of 4 husbands. Very clever and navigated Tudor court like a pro. A good match for H8 as she was supportive and kept her mouth shut. Is absolutely the only reason H8 three children had a relationship with each other. Made sure Mary and Elizabeth were put into the acts of succession which not only gave them a chance of succeeding the throne but no doubt kept them alive and away from the executioner block. Was actually a very good wife and was loyal. An astute politician.

SORRY FOR LENGTH!!! But I just wanted to point out how awesome these women were and how good the musical Six portrays them. It makes it all the more sad that men get the opportunity to sing about their stories and that absolute ducks get to claim these are 'trans' bleeping voices. Get in the bin.
 
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Here is my Six rant.....
It is a brilliant musical with a lot of historical accuracy. And that is why I am sad.
As well as some cracking songs it teaches you the human side of the 'divorced, beheaded, died' mantra and very much tells the story of the Queens with actually little reference to the twit they all married.
K.Aragon was married for nearly 25 years to H8. Gave birth to many children including sons, but Mary was only surviving child. She considered herself Queen until she died at age 50. Had to watch that large twit remarry time and time again whilst having to fight for her life as well as the life of the daughter she was never allowed to see.
A.Boleyn was extremely religious and basically taught that marrying royalty was the only thing important. Her parents raised their children to marry royalty like an Olympic sport. After only 3ish years was considered an inconvenience because she 'only' had a girl. Trans icon my a.
J.Seymour Good family but not the brightest. Considered a good match because H8 was more educated and therefore could outsmart her. First 2 wives were very clever, educated and experienced in life and could give as good as they got. Wife 3 was almost illiterate and very meek and mild. Married her about a week after he executed his 2nd wife and she died about a year later after giving birth.
A.Cleves My favourite wife. H8 genuinely married her because she had a beautiful portrait. She came from an excellent family both financially and politically. He was genuinely repulsed by her appearance but married her anyway. He was unable to consumate the marriage allegedly because she was so weird. More likely because he was so drunk and riddled with STDs. Annulled (so not technically divorced but that doesn't rhyme) and she actually did very well. Absolutely humiliated she had some bloody good lawyers who threatened to tell the world H8 couldn't get an erection. He paid her handsomely and she lived an incredible life
K.Howard the sadest of them all. Married about a week after 4th wife got her annulment. She was about 17. H8 was about 50. She was executed at 19, less than 2 years later. This was absolutely an abused and groomed little girl. From puberty she was passed around by 'uncles' and H8 learned of her being available. Again taught by her parents that bagging the king was the ultimate goal she flattered the large gout and ulcer ridden slob and convinced him she loved him. H8 actually managed to consumate the marriage but he was cruel and abused her. The poor wretched kid was flattered by courtiers and abused and r*ped. H8 used this as her using witchcraft against him and she was beheaded for treason. In reality she humiliated the king so she had to go. H8 was so humiliated he decided that she shouldn't ascend to heaven in the rapture. When the end of days comes you need a body to go up to heaven so he had her thrown in the ground in the church at Tower of London so her body was next to Anne Boleyn. Then he had quick lime thrown on her so it basically dissolves and there's no chance of redemption.
C.Parr H8 was her 3rd out of 4 husbands. Very clever and navigated Tudor court like a pro. A good match for H8 as she was supportive and kept her mouth shut. Is absolutely the only reason H8 three children had a relationship with each other. Made sure Mary and Elizabeth were put into the acts of succession which not only gave them a chance of succeeding the throne but no doubt kept them alive and away from the executioner block. Was actually a very good wife and was loyal. An astute politician.

SORRY FOR LENGTH!!! But I just wanted to point out how awesome these women were and how good the musical Six portrays them. It makes it all the more sad that men get the opportunity to sing about their stories and that absolute ducks get to claim these are 'trans' bleeping voices. Get in the bin.
If you haven’t read it already Alison Weir’s book on the six wives is excellent. Properly deep dives into Katherine of Aragon which is at least a third of the book. Proper insight into each of them and their backgrounds beyond which number wife they were.

Editing to add it does go into detail about the things you raised re Katherine Howard. Historians for years out there thinking that a senior middle aged member of the King’s court climbing through the window of a barely legal girl, who was being groomed to marry the king (whom she had seen dispatch 3 wives one way or another) to “stay the night” was entirely with her consent.
 
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If you haven’t read it already Alison Weir’s book on the six wives is excellent. Properly deep dives into Katherine of Aragon which is at least a third of the book. Proper insight into each of them and their backgrounds beyond which number wife they were.
I shall give it a go, thank you x
Also, and I'm sure you've read it The Five by Hallie Rubenhold about the JTR victims is excellent and reminds me of the Six xx
 
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Here is my Six rant.....
It is a brilliant musical with a lot of historical accuracy. And that is why I am sad.
As well as some cracking songs it teaches you the human side of the 'divorced, beheaded, died' mantra and very much tells the story of the Queens with actually little reference to the twit they all married.
K.Aragon was married for nearly 25 years to H8. Gave birth to many children including sons, but Mary was only surviving child. She considered herself Queen until she died at age 50. Had to watch that large twit remarry time and time again whilst having to fight for her life as well as the life of the daughter she was never allowed to see.
A.Boleyn was extremely religious and basically taught that marrying royalty was the only thing important. Her parents raised their children to marry royalty like an Olympic sport. After only 3ish years was considered an inconvenience because she 'only' had a girl. Trans icon my a.
J.Seymour Good family but not the brightest. Considered a good match because H8 was more educated and therefore could outsmart her. First 2 wives were very clever, educated and experienced in life and could give as good as they got. Wife 3 was almost illiterate and very meek and mild. Married her about a week after he executed his 2nd wife and she died about a year later after giving birth.
A.Cleves My favourite wife. H8 genuinely married her because she had a beautiful portrait. She came from an excellent family both financially and politically. He was genuinely repulsed by her appearance but married her anyway. He was unable to consumate the marriage allegedly because she was so weird. More likely because he was so drunk and riddled with STDs. Annulled (so not technically divorced but that doesn't rhyme) and she actually did very well. Absolutely humiliated she had some bloody good lawyers who threatened to tell the world H8 couldn't get an erection. He paid her handsomely and she lived an incredible life
K.Howard the sadest of them all. Married about a week after 4th wife got her annulment. She was about 17. H8 was about 50. She was executed at 19, less than 2 years later. This was absolutely an abused and groomed little girl. From puberty she was passed around by 'uncles' and H8 learned of her being available. Again taught by her parents that bagging the king was the ultimate goal she flattered the large gout and ulcer ridden slob and convinced him she loved him. H8 actually managed to consumate the marriage but he was cruel and abused her. The poor wretched kid was flattered by courtiers and abused and r*ped. H8 used this as her using witchcraft against him and she was beheaded for treason. In reality she humiliated the king so she had to go. H8 was so humiliated he decided that she shouldn't ascend to heaven in the rapture. When the end of days comes you need a body to go up to heaven so he had her thrown in the ground in the church at Tower of London so her body was next to Anne Boleyn. Then he had quick lime thrown on her so it basically dissolves and there's no chance of redemption.
C.Parr H8 was her 3rd out of 4 husbands. Very clever and navigated Tudor court like a pro. A good match for H8 as she was supportive and kept her mouth shut. Is absolutely the only reason H8 three children had a relationship with each other. Made sure Mary and Elizabeth were put into the acts of succession which not only gave them a chance of succeeding the throne but no doubt kept them alive and away from the executioner block. Was actually a very good wife and was loyal. An astute politician.

SORRY FOR LENGTH!!! But I just wanted to point out how awesome these women were and how good the musical Six portrays them. It makes it all the more sad that men get the opportunity to sing about their stories and that absolute ducks get to claim these are 'trans' bleeping voices. Get in the bin.
Fantastic rant- beautifully put. I feel so bad for throwing Anne under the bus now in my off the cuff post - she was a tremendous woman. I was making a cheap riff off the fact that she was the one that Henry famously couldn’t/wouldn‘t have sex with. She was my favourite after Catherine Parr who I always thought was great apart from her inexplicable reluctance to intervene when her last husband sexually abused young Elizabeth.
 
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