Fathering Autism #116 Trying homeschooling? Who are they fooling?

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Would your dog know the difference between "get the door" and "get your ball"?

Keep in mind I'm a huge nerd and the little intricacies about how people use language and how we communicate
(get as in retrieve vs the colloquial get as in "do an unstated but appropriate and expected action on the object")
is, in fact, my jam (unlike Priscilla and motherhood).

"Get the door" can mean several different things.
It can mean to physically go pick up a door and bring it from one location to another.
It can mean to go back and close an open door.
It can mean to hurry ahead and open a closed door, potentially to even hold it open so another person can go through it.

To figure out which unstated meaning the speaker intends, you have to analyze your environment, determine the issue, and choose the definition that makes the most sense for the given situation. It would make sense to go pick up an actual door on a building site. It wouldn't make sense to do that while leaving the house, so you need to choose another definition.

Turn the light on means one thing. You don't need to analyze the environment or infer what the speaker means. Make the light come on.

Get the door can mean 3 or more things, and responding appropriately to the request involves a decent amount of awareness and observation. Again, I'm talking like 5 or 6 year old level here, not secret genius level.
 
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Meanwhile, why is Sandy in the crate?
Same reason they have a gate in front of Abbies door. I mean his explanation of why P speaks to Abbie/Sandy doesn’t work. Make a list… two columns. One for Sandy and the other Abbie, then see how many things they have in common and then that will be the truth in how P addresses her child

The appropriate answer may of been to not even entertain the question and make a statement ( as well as post a written statement) that their daughter will never be “normal”. She will never hit normal milestones to include the most basic,and for people to stop asking those type of questions because the answer will always be the same. But if they do that then people will not tune in,so they can fuss at people but it only proves that they are scammers and using their daughter as bait
 
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But Sandy is potty trained....
 
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And she puts her shoes on the correct feet. That blows my mind...
 
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https://giphy.com/3o7TKvxnDibVYwawHC Visual I got from her hands up to her face
 
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add to that the fact that they refuse to provide for any of her sensory needs, which would help her to self regulate her emotions if she had the right sensory input, on a daily basis. Then add on to that, they regularly take her to places they know she will find tricky and completely overwhelming. No wonder she has meltdowns left right and centre.

I also wonder how much of some interactions are contextual too. I was on holiday in France as a child and knew a little bit of french from school but really nowhere near any sort of fluency. I was waiting at the toilets for a toilet to be free. A french lady started talking to me and the only word I knew and picked up on was ferme, which means shut, closed or locked. I automatically knew she was asking if the toilet I was standing by was engaged or not. I think it would be likely that in some of these short phrases she may only truly understand a few words and the rest is context. Some of them would just be because she hears them day in day out.
 
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I very much agree with you that Abbie has a level of understanding beyond what many give her credit for. I think there are a couple of reasons for this (not saying these are the ONLY two, just that they're probably common), a major one is Abbie being non-verbal. Because she cannot communicate verbally (and A&P have done a shit job of sign language with her as well as her communication device), there is a major communication barrier. Because of this, she can only communicate in very VERY basic ways which can make it appear that she isn't aware of anything or almost anything, that her intelligence level is much MUCH lower (verging on non-existent in some opinions).
To be clear, I am not denying or disputing that Abbie does in fact have an intellectual disability. I fully believe that she does. Once again just saying I don't think she is AS unaware and unintelligent as others think.
Second reason, while her ID is definitely more prominent, I do think she IS autistic. As many of us know, common traits of autism deal with the expression of emotion. Outwardly, there may be no expression of emotion, but that doesn't mean that things aren't being observed and processed internally. Also, ND people don't always have the same emotional reactions to things as NT people. Paired with being non verbal, having no outer reaction can easily be interpreted as "She's not aware or intelligent enough to know what's going on."

I think you make an excellent point that (altho, there are many MANY times where Asshat has blatantly fabricated something that Abbie supposedly did), there are times when Abbie does things just like the example you gave, which require a certain level of understanding, reasoning etc. This would indicate that her comprehension and reasoning skills, her intelligence, is higher than it may appear. As I've said before, profound ID does not mean NO intelligence.
 
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Howdy all! Need to catch up, today was a busy day. It was my final consult with my surgeon before surgery Friday, which means I actually got dressed and left the house- huge deal, trust me lol.
Anyway, need to read back, but did see Asa posted a short about their podcast. Yet ANOTHER podcast about, you guessed it- marriage.
They have nothing to offer about marriage that they havent already said 1,000x. They live such insulated/self absorbed lives they cant even come up with any other topic. What a waste of time.
 
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I agree and I believe this is all amplified by the fact that they underestimate Abbie while simultaneously over-estimating their own communication skills. We've seen before that she's understood things or had little conversations with Brandi via her ACC. They don't do that with her and if they tell her something, they assume if she doesn't comply it's because she can't understand. They do not *do* *the* *work* to present her with clear, multi-modal communication. Despite this, Asa is aware of these concepts (auditory processing, receptive communication) but only cares enough to lecture about them to the camera, not ever actually use them.

Like, she tore down wallpaper in the living room. They shouldn't be surprised. When she was anxious or bothering him, he let her shred paper in the living room. She cannot differentiate between the function of newspaper and wallpaper, but she loud and clear heard "it's okay to tear paper in the living room to help entertain myself." It's a reasonable conclusion given what Asa communicated with his actions.
 
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I’m not sure I should say this. I’ve known most of you for years. I agree with almost every one’s opinions on what those people did or didn’t do to help their daughter.

Please don’t judge me too harshly, but when my ID kid does something age appropriate and on his own, I let myself pretend he is just a young adult. He’s turning 19 and still I’m questioning every single thing I didn’t pick up on from a younger age. He is my baby, my last. I excused a lot of behaviors and thought he was messing with me when he’d misbehave. I understand why they are like that with Abbie. The difference I think is that I will take control if he starts acting up. We have left movies and roller skating and bowling and so many stores it hurts to admit he’s different. He’s my kid. I love every single imperfect perfection he is. For his sake more than mine I have him set to be on a placement list when he ages out of his program.

I hope some of that makes sense. I was t-boned on Saturday afternoon and still have a headache. I will be getting an mri tomorrow if it doesn’t let up. Funny though, the woman that hit me is from Brazil and went back home Sunday. I’m glad no one was hurt but my poor ugly Kia is a goner. I can’t believe I really cared so much about that pos car! My daughter thinks it’s hilarious how dramatic the light post was being!
 

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@Whimsical great post.
I've said it before many times....
Abbie lacks a reasoning factor. She totally lacks it. Assa has said this several times and even if he hadn't said it, it's still true. It's part of profound ID.
She would need this in order to REASON ANYTHING. Anything at all.
I will never be convinced that she "knows" anything really. She's 2 years old in her mind without a reasoning factor.
Ffs. And all of her behaviors reflect this.
Edit to add:
  • ID replaces the DSM-IV term "mental retardation" (MR)[2].
    • In this prior multiaxial system, the diagnosis of mental retardation was placed on Axis II.
    • IQ cutoffs for mental retardation in DSM-IV were: mild (IQ 50-55 to ~70), moderate (IQ 35-40 to 50-55), severe (IQ 20-25 to 35-40), and profound (IQ < 20-25).
    • MY thoughts:
  • WITH AN iQ of 20-25 which is what profound ID is.. and no reasoningfactor, it most definitely is possible there is no intelligence.
 
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I totally understand this. I hope your headache goes away. You've got so much on your plate already
 
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I think this is very well put. There is a lot to be learned when we try to look at the bigger picture and use critical thinking. I suppose some people don't care to look past what is at surface level and that's totally fine. We all have our different view points and opinions and that's a good thing. How restrictive and not to mention dull would it be if we all thought and felt the same things on the same topics etc.

To do what you've described DOES require a certain level of cognitive skills. As you've said and I've said, NO, we aren't saying Abbie has the intelligence & comprehension of a NT sixteen year old. Just that her cognitive skills are somewhat higher than first glance suggests and not the absolute bottom of the ladder.
 
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I don't understand her inability to do things sometimes. I've seen her unable to identify a spoon or choose the milk from the fridge even though she eats cereal every day. I realize this may be a difficulty with receptive communication, but last video she rinsed a dish when prompted but didn't take off the lid. This is a task she's been doing for years. My kids and nieces at 3 or 4 would have taken the lid off. She has just been so failed by her parents.
 
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She has most definitely been failed by A&P. It really makes me feel for her.
While cognitive skills are one part of it, I think it's likely there are other factors at play. One being I think she is SERIOUSLY prompt dependent. She knows how to do a task but depends on the prompting to do it. Another could be she's having difficulties focusing her attention on the task at hand, maybe there's some sensory issue going on, maybe she has a headache, maybe it's just too difficult to hold her attention on what is being asked of her. That is not always caused by intelligence level. It can be, but not every time. A third reason I would guess is that she's dragging her feet because she is being made to do chores which she doesn't want to do. Maybe she thinks that if she resists enough that she won't have to complete the task.
 
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Her fat foot is the size of my calf
 
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Oh, @Kimmied, a car accident, too?! I hear my maternal grandmother’s voice saying, “When it rains, it pours.” Take good care. I’m glad you will consider getting your brain checked out. Praying for you and your health.
 
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Cognitive function can be split into so many domains as well...it's completely possible for someone to be at the level of an infant in one area of cognitive function, but at the level of a preschooler in another.

As far as Abbie's awareness of what's going on, the one thing I can say for sure is that she has the ability to recognize routines or patterns in behavior. You can see it pretty readily in the way she behaves regarding food, since she is so food-motivated...she notices when food is nearby, and she knows where the food is kept. She knows to lead people to the pantry when she wants food, and appears to understand which packages contain which foods. She understands what a restaurant is...and she appears to be able to generalize upon entering a restaurant and being seated that she will be brought food. I'm not 100% sure but I think she may even be able to recognize different restaurants...for example, it seems like she may be able to tell the difference between a Dunkin and Wendy's drive-thru, and expect to receive different foods from each one. She is also able to categorize signs and words...for example, when she is asking for a snack, she will scroll through all of her food-related signs or iPad buttons. She is sometimes less successful with the iPad, which is constantly being reorganized and also requires a higher level of fine motor function...but I don't recall ever seeing her accidentally throw in a non-food related sign (such as "bathroom" or "swing") when asking for food.

When it comes to what's important to her, she is definitely aware of her environment...and she is able to understand what will (or should) happen in different contexts, and with different people. For example, remember how she used to throw tantrums when she would come home from school and see Brandy? People say all the time that they don't think Abbie really knows the difference between the people in her life...but she can definitely discriminate between people, and expects different things to happen when she is with different people.
 
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She lacks the understanding of WHY. If she understood the meaning behind why we rinse dishes, she would understand the need to remove the top. Prompted or not.
She knows the word shoes, and how to put them on, but she has no ability to understand why they make her put them on.
I also do not believe anyone has ever negated her ability to recognize a few words. I think it all gets mighty confusing when she clues in on one thing, and then later stands there staring into space with a dish in her hand. It is all hit or miss. Plus, I do NOT (haha…I sound like that Dawn Leghumper ) put anything past Moobie F’ing Dick. Since we all have our own opinions, we all speculate, because how could any of us truly know….How do we know Moobie is not practicing certain things with her over and over again in order to kick the progressing narrative can down the road on camera?
 
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