Caroline Flack

[Dirty Joan]

Andrew is another idiot. What the fuck is he at? He kicked her when she was at her lowest, posted all this shit about her being abusive, rightly or wrongly, and how has the cheek to blame the media for her death? You literally fed them their info on a drip. Another fool who’ll piss whatever way the wind is blowing

 

[bsh3113]

I kind of find it a bit disturbing this small group of her friends talking as if she was their cult leader. Who made Dawn Porter guardian of Caroline’s life and death? I get they were mates but it seems like there was such an effort to keep her troubles private to protect her image and it’s like they’re still doing it. Maybe if Caroline had been more open about her problems while she was alive she wouldn’t have felt so trapped when it all went wrong

 

[Instagram Sham]

This was posted in a one direction magazine saw someone shared it and thought how awful it was

If that’s real then it’s terrible. What example are we setting to young women how to treat others. Shocking. What’s even worse is that parents would buy this for young pre teen daughters and would not assume that type of venom was in the contents. That has genuinely shocked me.

 

[Bashandcrash]

Cocaine, especially mixed with alcohol, is evil. It turns people you love into someone you barely recognise.

I read the other day, that the coroner on Sophie Gradon’s case said that mixing alcohol and cocaine makes someone 16 times more likely to commit suicide.

now if this true, I wish this were more well known. I can’t help but think that given that drugs are such a normal part of many young peoplies lives, a message saying

‘you are 16 times more likely to commit suicide if you take cocaine and alcohol together. If you are struggling with mental health issues, do not mix these substances’

would be more affective than this ‘be kind’ bandwagon. Of course, most celebs and influencers don’t want to be associated with drugs publicly, but it seems like it could be an effective message to me.

 

[Spammingyourhighway]

If she had been able to post that, the outpouring of love and support would have meant she’d still be here today.

stupid advisers... they really had her best interests at heart, not!

That honestly made me sick to read

 

[Jax69]

That seems distasteful considering she was arrested, charged and about to go on trial for assault by beating. Her name wasn't cleared and now her face is being used as the image for Be Kind.

I read further back in this thread that one day, the victim will probably realise what has happened to him and what he went through. I hope he has a lot of support when that happens.

How much would it mess up your head if you had been injured by your partner, and then everyone was posting pictures of them laughing, looking beautiful, talking about how wonderful they were and saying #bekind. If everyone was going on about how no one should say mean things.
And you started to wonder "but that couldn't have been an accident. Why would she accidentally cut my head open? My phone was private, why was she snooping through it?" but you couldn't say anything, because everyone was saying #bekind.

I can really empathise with this point. I was in a relationship with a horribly abusive man but it was mostly behind closed doors, his friends just thought he was a bit of a dick in drink. It got much worse in pregnancy & after so I pressed charges for assault & we split obviously. Anyway we had a child & 14 years later he died suddenly; all his friends, family & acquaintances thought he was wonderful so his death was like a local tragedy. The local news was full of articles about him with quotes from people etc. his funeral was packed with crying people and they‘ve even set up a charity in his name ffs. The thing is, he was so adept at manipulating his own PR & he’d painted all his exes as crazy women, two of us had his kids, so it was difficult for his kids (who he was rarely around for & tight with money) to hear all the adulation from people that didn’t match their experience of him letting them down all the time. Even in death he managed to give me grief.

 

[Sausageface]

Her mum’s comments were lovely. Interesting that the friends who were thanked didn’t include any of the celebrity hangers on.

 

[Sunraged]

I don't know whether this will help, but:

• When someone attempts suicide it's not the job of the Ambulance crew to assess that person's risk to self, and whether or not they need hospital admission. That job would be reserved for the Psychiatric Liaison Team/Crisis Team/IHBTT (Intensive Home Based Treatment Team.
• Refusing to accept treatment wouldn't necessarily prevent that person receiving an intervention. Capacity would be a factor, and there is the facility to place that person under a section.
• Many Crisis services operate on a positive risk taking approach. Someone saying they're going to kill themselves, or indeed making an attempt to kill themselves, might not necessarily trigger an in patient intervention, but might trigger an intensive home based intervention, or possibly nothing. There is an emphasis on the least invasive intervention possible to ensure that person's safety
• It is highly unlikely that someone presenting like CF hadn't presented like this before. I would imagine that she has had contact with MH Services in the past, and possibly in the present, and those services would and will have been assessing risk regularly as part of her care package (assuming anyone was currently involved).
• If the MH Services weren't contacted, the Police wouldn't have been able to remove her from her home, as a Sec136 (place of safety) would only apply to her if she was out of her home
• Impulsive suicides are difficult to predict, therefore difficult to provide care for. This type of presentation could potentially manifest as numerous attempts and threats of suicide. CF was 40yrs old, and this type of difficulty develops in childhood. She's lived with this a long time.
• There was an old research paper that suggested that 65% of persistent self harmers eventually complete a suicide, be that intentionally, or accidentally, and a more recent publication (I think from Australia), that suggested that only 1.6% of people who say they're going to commit suicide, actually do.
• Fame is often a honey trap for people who need desperately for validation that is so explicit that they can't argue against it. Adoration is like petrol. Not everyone in public eye is like that, I can assure you, but it's like the observation that many people in front of the cameras on a regular basis are. no taller than 5'2" It's not an exact rule, but it's a. common finding. The paradox is, that with every person that adores you, there are 10 that want to pull you down to within an inch of your psychological life. Some people deal with it, some people can't live with it. So, in finding the thing that helps you live, you also attract the thing that kills you.
• When we treat people with this kind of presentation, often a fundamental part of that is being boundaried. Boundaries in how we communicate with them, boundaries around acceptable and unacceptable behaviour, and boundaries around how much time the service will devote to addressing that person's issues. We have had people phoning the Ambulance service 50 times a day, contacting our Duty Team 50 times a day, threatening suicide when clear boundaries aren't in place. The client responds well to those boundaries (which might sound counter intuitive), but one of the worst feelings in the world for someone with this presentation, is the feeling you get when you're alone, when you think you're going to be rejected, or when nothing in your life seems certain. Emotional Dysregulation is devastating if unmanaged.

I don't know whether this clears anything up, or is just stuff everyone already knew, but there you go

 

[thatgirlcarlz]

I really hope Caroline's family (or management) do something about Stephanie Davis - she's an absolute embarrassment!!

 

[GrunkaLunka]

Keith Lemon has posted that her friends are talking about setting up a Festival for her. He's designed a Tshirt with her image on and the #Be Kind.

That seems distasteful considering she was arrested, charged and about to go on trial for assault by beating. Her name wasn't cleared and now her face is being used as the image for Be Kind.

I read further back in this thread that one day, the victim will probably realise what has happened to him and what he went through. I hope he has a lot of support when that happens.

How much would it mess up your head if you had been injured by your partner, and then everyone was posting pictures of them laughing, looking beautiful, talking about how wonderful they were and saying #bekind. If everyone was going on about how no one should say mean things.
And you started to wonder "but that couldn't have been an accident. Why would she accidentally cut my head open? My phone was private, why was she snooping through it?" but you couldn't say anything, because everyone was saying #bekind.

 

[Moley1]

So the article that has been shared this morning just goes to prove that you don’t know what happens behind closed doors and you cannot for one second believe anything that the press says. I hope all those armchair CSI melts who have been calling her a domestic abuser all week feel ashamed of themselves!

It is not for Ms Flack to decide whether she was a domestic abuser or not. It was for the court to decide. Just because she said it was an accident does not make it an accident. Yes it is very sad. But one persons “truth” isn’t necessarily reflective of what happened. Like you I wasn’t there so I don’t know the full facts, but if someone phones 999 and says their partner is trying to kill them, something is clearly amiss.

 

[Dirty Joan]

View attachment 86239It’s sad because in this picture, yes it looks like she’s laughing, but if you zoom in on her face and her eyes, you can see she’s in pain and almost like she’s screaming help

oh stop she’s clearly laughing. Why are people dissecting old pictures and old tweets looking for “clues”. Baffling carry on.

 

[2ofeach]

I genuinely feel that what drove her to take her life was the fear of her behaviour being 'outed' and shame that the image she displayed/portrayed to the public was going to be exposed.

She wasn't ashamed to admit she struggled at times. She'd openly spoken in interviews of her experiences of being in the public eye, pressure on her lifestyle and relationship. Mental health wasn't taboo. That said her job also brought her amazing opportunities and a lifestyle many could only dream of. She courted the media and they too kept her in their sights.

Whatever happened on THAT night, the releasing of evidence, the body cam footage, 999 call, photos of the scene etc mortified her.
We don't know for certain how many times IF ANY she'd previously acted in this way but THIS night it came on top for her.

The CPS quite rightly have to assess the evidence and decide whether to proceed regardless of whether the victim wants to press charges. Clearly there was enough to proceed.
This incident COULD have been the catalyst for her to finally take charge of her behaviour, see that she needed help, admit to herself that this lifestyle couldn't continue. She was in a position more than most of us to get the best help available.
Rather than do that she only envisioned the damage to her image this WOULD cause. She basically acted like her own judge and jury. She'd written herself off and sadly took dreadful, drastic action.
Whether this decision was made 'soundly' or was altered due to medication, drink or substance remains to be seen.

Who knows what the judge would decide. It's not even certain that a custodial sentence was even a given, going guilty doesn't necessarily mean jail. Chances are she'd have got a community order, suspended sentence and damages to victim and seek treatment for herself.
I'm unsure if information of any previous incidents IF THERE WERE ANY would be released to show it wasn't perhaps a one off. Her actions finally catching up with her.

Regardless she's suffered and paid the ultimate price. Damned if she did, damned if she didn't. Just bloody tragic.

 

[thegirlscout]

The way people are behaving in the wake of Caroline’s death - not just her friends and celebrities but the London tube sign etc, it’s making me wonder if I dreamt up that she assaulted her boyfriend and was accused of domestic violence.

 

[Cezanne]

Presumably, it’s for this reason:
‘A Guardian analysis shows the Sun published the most articles mentioning Flack in the six months before her death – with a total of 99.

The figure is around a quarter of the 387 stories published in print by all of the UK’s national newspapers in the same period.

A review of the stories shows that a quarter of all these articles took a negative tone, slightly higher than those with a positive tone, which accounted for 18% of the total.’

https://www.archive.is/oldest/https...negative-media-coverage-before-death-revealed

I have a genuine question. Do the members of this forum -obviously because you’ll be first to read it - believe that perhaps the U.K. as a whole is intrinsically negative? The media, the attitude, the general atmosphere?

I’m Canadian - grew up there and only moved here as a fully formed adult, so my ‘being’, my general views of the world is ‘Canadian’. We don’t particularly have a large celeb world (see Jess and Ben Mulroney on the Meghan & Harry thread) and tv shows and so on. Our English speaking culture is quite often imported from the US.

Ok, so where am I going with this? Well, I’ve started to believe that the media is just so bloody negative here. Don’t get me wrong, I can’t watch Ellen drooling over her guests and there always seems to be a ‘moral’ to many NBC/ABC etc dramas. After so many years here in the U.K., I can’t believe I just bought whatever celebs were schlepping and just accepted that they were great and I was just the average joe blow on the street.

However, since I’ve been here: Trashing celebs is a sport. We do it over drinks, at the school gates, on social media. But we also thrash our neighbour, the kids teachers, the PT at the gym. I read the news with my coffee every morning before school (I’m a teacher) and by the time I set off for work, I’ve ingested at least an hour of negative stories. Politician. Last night tv. Who left Love Island. I connect with my year 11s by sharing the hate over a particular influencer. I actually make ‘connections’ with people by being negative. Oh! I hate Sam Smith too!

I decided not to join in on the negativity in 2020. I‘m really struggling. I won’t trashed the mum in the tube top (it’s fucking February bitch!) at school with my best mate. I was quite scathing towards CF back in December but I’ve refrained from being unnecessarily negative. I’m reading the threads so it’s not like I’m a saint but I’m trying...

 

[Dirty Joan]

[

I don’t think it’s disrespectful or wrong to discuss the circumstances surrounding her arrest. I think the media have lost the run of themselves as have people online, claiming she was a saint when no she was not. She wasn’t a demon but she wasn’t an angel either. She was human. We are allowed to discuss those facts without being made feel like it’s disrespectful. Yes she’s no longer here and that is sad but she did something awful and we are entitled to discuss that.

Wow!! You're lovely aren't you? Where did you get all this information from then? The press no doubt? none of us know what went on and to just speculate and read what was obviously twisted in the media is wrong. Caroline was clearly struggling with depression and anxiety and feeling she had nowhere to turn, read the statement what she wanted to put out but was advised not to. Just because the cps were gong ahead with a trial does not mean she was guilty of anything, innocent until proven guilty!! She was pushed to suicide, as she saw it as her only way out of the deep black hole of anguish and despair that she was suffering in. Have a heart please!

i got this information from the transcript of the court hearing that took place in December.
And yes I am lovely thank you.

 

[Marcos SP]

The world's gone madder than when Kerry Katona was winning mum of the year after smoking through her pregnancies.

Was Caroline being kind when she signed up to do bo selecta to rip the piss out of people on national TV, some of those people were children.

Was Caroline being kind when she worked on reality TV where the bread and butter of it was shaming deluded people with dreams of showbiz?

Was Caroline being kind with her (alleged) regular cocaine usage? Knowingly supporting organised crime and a horrific supply chain.

Was Caroline being kind when she assaulted her boyfriend. The CPS would be under a spotlight with the case so would have only pursued it if they were very confident. She's done untold damage by putting men off from reporting when they are victims.

It's madness I tell you, madness (Phoebe voice)

 

[Stillafatty]

Not sure but her “best friend” hasn’t even been dead a week I was a complete wreck when someone very close to me passed. So I get where op is coming from tbh... although maybe she’s a “keep calm and carry on” type of person. Hats off to her, if only we could all be that strong.

I lost my best friend to suicide. He threw himself off a bridge 6 years ago. Before his body was found and we knew what had happened he was a missing person for 3 weeks. I was 19 and he was 23. I had to go to work each day, I asked my boss for a day off and I was refused it. The only time I got off was the day of the funeral. I was also a wreck and struggled through every single day, it’s horrific.
Sometimes you need time off, sometimes you can manage and keeping distracted is easier. We’re all different in how we cope.

 

[SentbySali]

Long time lurker here.

I've been following this thread from the start and the only thing that is clear is that we each see this tragic unfolding of events via the narrative of our own experiences.

When I was 20 I threw a glass bottle of ketchup at a man who had emotionally abused me for 3 years.

He moved and it smashed up the wall.

He called the police and said i had tried to beat him over the head with it.

Luckily for me when the police came the one officer
must have got a feel that something was off as after talking to us both he asked if there was somewhere else I wanted to stay that night. I said yes, packed a bag and they took me to my parents.

That wasn't the end obviously but that's a long story.

Imagine how different my life could have gone if he hadn't moved out of the way.

I'm not saying that this is what happened with CF.

I'm not saying that there is any excuse for violence or that it shouldn't be punished.

I AM saying that context is relevant. And that's what we will never get here. Only Lewis now knows what exactly happened prior to the police arrival.

 

[Banana Man]

I'm getting even more annoyed by this all. Everyone famous is using Caroline Flack as a vehicle.

You'd think she left a suicide note saying negative comments online were too much. When her friends and agency have blamed the court case. People forget she was charged with DV.

Caroline was troubled and even if she had a normal job the same tragic outcome is likely.