Savanna Brockhill & Frankie Smith #6

[justheretoread99]

(Apologies if this has been mentioned previously I’ve only read from the beginning of thread 5)

I know the other children in the flat on September 22 are too young to be questioned, but surely someone would have asked them what happened. Where did the children go when FS went in the ambulance and SB went to hospital in her car.

Did SB drop the other children off? Did the police stay with them? Did their own parents ask them what happened?

 

[avabella]

I want to believe that FS didn't know Star had a badly injured leg. FS did tell SB that Star was crying when her leg was touched, saying she was going to take her to the Dr, but SB said Star was 'petting' and telling FS not to pick her up. Maybe FS really was that gullible and went along with everything SB said about child care.

In my mind I imagine a fractious (and no wonder!) baby, whining and crying and refusing to walk and wanting picked up all the time. That is stressful. Then add into that mix SB texting constantly or FaceTiming asking was she behaving. Add to that people perhaps messaging that Star has bruises on her and that social services are sniffing. Add to that you’re 19 years old and you have no real pals and half your family are isolated from you. Add to that any time you do go out you have to cloak it in mystery and dare not put a foot wrong incase you get a beating and you can see where moments of frustration come from.

Again, this is in no way me being in a FS fan club, just trying to see it objectively.

 

[mack1102]

I really don’t think FS will serve a long time in prison. Like others have said she suspsected abuse but still allowed SB around her child so I think she will have to pay the price for that mistake. I think FS did amazing today for Star, yes she might not of owned up to biting, but she openly admits she was cruel to Star now she looks back. I feel like her time on remand has been an eye opener and she’s had a lot of growing up to do.

I just so hope SB gets a murder charge but I really don’t think she will.

 

[elikayute]

(Apologies if this has been mentioned previously I’ve only read from the beginning of thread 5)

I know the other children in the flat on September 22 are too young to be questioned, but surely someone would have asked them what happened. Where did the children go when FS went in the ambulance and SB went to hospital in her car.

Did SB drop the other children off? Did the police stay with them? Did their own parents ask them what happened?

I believe one was slightly older than Star and one was younger, so too young to be questioned at all.
SB took them out to her van and then took them to her house and Becky Endecott had them I believe.

 

[LittleMy]

(Apologies if this has been mentioned previously I’ve only read from the beginning of thread 5)

I know the other children in the flat on September 22 are too young to be questioned, but surely someone would have asked them what happened. Where did the children go when FS went in the ambulance and SB went to hospital in her car.

Did SB drop the other children off? Did the police stay with them? Did their own parents ask them what happened?

The oldest of the two other children present was only 2.

Savanna dropped them off with Becky Endacott at her flat.

Their own parents were Savanna’s sister and brother in law, I doubt they would have been very forthcoming if anything was said by the child that could incriminate Savanna.

 

[rosesviolets]

I’ve seen posts on Yvonne’s FB page where she is slagging off whoever took stuff from Star’s grave. I have not seen anywhere that it was SB’s family? However, Yvonne comes across really badly using awful swearing in her FB posts. This is one reason I feel sympathy to some degree for FS, with a mother like that who also encouraged FS to go out drinking with her and falling out of pubs together. Not exactly a role model for FS.

 

[Yorkshire-Granny]

(Apologies if this has been mentioned previously I’ve only read from the beginning of thread 5)

I know the other children in the flat on September 22 are too young to be questioned, but surely someone would have asked them what happened. Where did the children go when FS went in the ambulance and SB went to hospital in her car.

Did SB drop the other children off? Did the police stay with them? Did their own parents ask them what happened?

It has been discussed a bit, they were SB's niece / nephew, she took them to her sisters before going to hospital, personally I think if they were old enough to say 'oh Star' then possibly could have had some sort of 'play' enactment, I don't know if being SB's relative they could refuse police access to them, they literally have not been mentioned other than in passing eg: The kids were given toys etc ... they were old enough to eat crisps so not tiny babies

 

[Ajbmibhrc]

Not sticking up for FS at all, but I was in an emotionally abusive relationship for 16 years odd times physical, he got done for affray once after I went on a night out which ended in a car chase and him writing the car I was in off with a bar, I paid his fines and apologised for it for years as he made me believe it was all my fault, I was 15 when we got together, once I had our son, it was like I'd opened my eyes for the first time to him and I left him, I was so scared of the after math, so I can see where she would be scared of brockhill and from some things I've read SB liked to twist things. But no matter how SB was treating FS her daughter should of come first that's just a natural motherly instinct to protect your child, I also find it very coincidental that SB worked in care at people's homes, so assuming vulnerable or elderly, then dogs and then bouncing, all roles where she can be more in control feel powerful over others!

 

[elikayute]

Where I live old enough to eats crisps means anything over 4 months

 

[avabella]

(Apologies if this has been mentioned previously I’ve only read from the beginning of thread 5)

I know the other children in the flat on September 22 are too young to be questioned, but surely someone would have asked them what happened. Where did the children go when FS went in the ambulance and SB went to hospital in her car.

Did SB drop the other children off? Did the police stay with them? Did their own parents ask them what happened?

They were SB sisters kids. (Her sister is Mary Kate). The children were too young, but according to Mary Kate they were seen by social workers. SB took them to Becky Endacotts.

I really don’t think FS will serve a long time in prison. Like others have said she suspsected abuse but still allowed SB around her child so I think she will have to pay the price for that mistake. I think FS did amazing today for Star, yes she might not of owned up to biting, but she openly admits she was cruel to Star now she looks back. I feel like her time on remand has been an eye opener and she’s had a lot of growing up to do.

I just so hope SB gets a murder charge but I really don’t think she will.

I think she pretty much HAS paid the price for that mistake. She’s lost her daughter.

 

[LittleMy]

Where I live old enough to eats crisps means anything over 4 months

Not saying it’s right now, but my mum would give us Quavers as soon as we were on solids.

 

[mack1102]

They were SB sisters kids. (Her sister is Mary Kate). The children were too young, but according to Mary Kate they were seen by social workers. SB took them to Becky Endacotts.


I think she pretty much HAS paid the price for that mistake. She’s lost her daughter.

That’s not good enough in my eyes, she deserves to be punished for allowing it to happen.

 

[Foreverunknown]

This is 100%.... and to add - as a mother to a 19 month old boy .... toddlers truly are testing to the most saintly of mothers (and I'd love to put myself in to that category)....nevertheless, can totally see how a storm could easily brew for for them to push you over the edge.

if you don't have emotional intelligence, or parenting experience, or adequate support or are a teenager who would rather be out drinking... (and that's not a criticism either because I might have been a different mum at 18 too)....

Star Deserved so so so so much more, my heart bleeds for her suffering - that poor little mite ....
but once again - it's very clear how it's unfolded. Really incredibly tragic.

Apart from a load of rambling twists from KG what I picked up from today was that pre SB, FS had loads of help with Star, possibly a bit misguided in that Anita said just leave her with us to sort yourself out, which kind'a gave FS a free pass to behave like an immature teenager and free reign to get to know SB better.

No one really helping FS to bond and how to care for for Star, just taking Star off her hands and if you have the time why not, she was obviously a delightful child to have around. Then, enter SB, they 'co-parent' Star but to SB's agenda, FS cut off from those who care about them both and doesn't have a clue how to care for Star, she parents as instructed by SB.

Left to her own devices they have moments of loving play but when it comes to misbehaving (like toddlers do) FS hasn't got the skills, eg: distracting with a toy when she's pulling clothes out of a box, instead she punishes as instructed by SB because by this stage SB is the only person in her life as Grandparents have been cut out.

 

[avabella]

That’s not good enough in my eyes, she deserves to be punished for allowing it to happen.

Wait, what? It's not good enough that she's lost her baby? And will live with that knowledge for the rest of her life, no doubt tormenting herself with it? A jail time is small fry in comparison to that.

 

[Treesy19]

Between thread 5 and this one, I had over 40 pages of Tattle to catch up on so I’ve had to just abandon the idea of even attempting to read everyone’s recent input. (I mean I could, but I’d have to ignore my kids the entire evening and don’t want to ).
Anyway, yeah today’s all I could get from it was KG simply hammering home that FS tells lies. Which I suppose was her aim. FS having given the damning testimony that she saw SB already in the living room, KG now needs the jury to know that if FS lied about other stuff then this one could also be a lie. Fair enough. (Personal opinion: this was a truth, and SB indeed already in the lounge).

I don’t have personal experience of DV but from what people have shared on here, I can see exactly why FS told lies and kept on with the shambles of a relationship. Thus, I became tired of FS being asked why didn’t you leave etc. Clearly it’s not easy to leave. Sounded a bit DV victim blaming to me. On and on she rolled with saying this. Yeah she should have left the relationship, but she didn’t.
It’s clear she was cruel to Star due to all the videos showing so , she’s not ingratiated herself to the jury with her mothering ways.

 

[mack1102]

Wait, what? It's not good enough that she's lost her baby? And will live with that knowledge for the rest of her life, no doubt tormenting herself with it? A jail time is small fry in comparison to that.

No i don’t believe it is, I believe she needs to serve time for the crime she’s committed. (If found guilty) (My opinion, don’t jump down my throat) I hope she gets out and rebuilds her life though.

 

[Milktray]

That’s not good enough in my eyes, she deserves to be punished for allowing it to happen.

I'm so torn about this. She did let Star get in harm's way but I believe it was down to her misjudgement rather than her intention (in addition to being in a coercive relationship).

This is where I think we should have a 'smarter approach to sentencing' because I would prefer to see a judgement based on redemption and education for FS. Let her better her life, build her self esteem but also reflect on her past actions.

FS still has the rest of her life to live and I'd prefer to see her coming out of prison, with support and a different outlook on life.

 

[LittleMy]

No i don’t believe it is, I believe she needs to serve time for the crime she’s committed. (If found guilty) (My opinion, don’t jump down my throat) I hope she gets out and rebuilds her life though.

I agree. If she’s found guilty of any of the charges, she should do the time. Maybe it’ll give her time to reflect on her life and she can come out a better person for it. She shouldn’t get off lightly imo. Yes she will have to live with the knowledge that she failed to protect her child, but it isn’t enough. She still has a lot to learn.

 

[mack1102]

I'm so torn about this. She did let Star get in harm's way but I believe it was down to her misjudgement rather than her intention (in addition to being in a coercive relationship).

This is where I think we should have a 'smarter approach to sentencing' because I would prefer to see a judgement based on redemption and education for FS. Let her better her life, build her self esteem but also reflect on her past actions.

FS still has the rest of her life to live and I'd prefer to see her coming out of prison, with support and a different outlook on life.

I agree these are good points! I really do hope she’s builds her life. I just believe a sentence is a part of Stars justice.

 

[elikayute]

The way I see it, the death of Star is the real sentence, hence thinking the jail sentence should be fairly low, based on what we know so far. The law of causing or allowing is there for a reason - parents have a duty to protect their child’s life. F did fail to do that - she had suspicions and she still let SB in her flat. We can’t, as a society, turn a blind eye to that failure to protect, however tragic the parents story is.