Nigel Farage

[PeteM]

I’d say racism is discriminating against someone because of their skin colour. Not culture.
I’d say it isn’t not wanting Britain overrun with people who aren’t British, whatever colour they are

This country has always been full of people who aren't British. Look at the many Irish who came over here in the 18th century, building much of the infrastructure of this country such as canals and railways. When Portugese Jews came over here, they introduced us to that most "English" of food, fish and chips.

This country has always relied on immigration, and pretty much all of its traditions and culture come from other countries. I guess going out with the aim of getting completely paralytic is quite an English "value" though, since we excel at it far more than the rest of the world.

 

[miss n thropy]

Well I agree.
Like I said above I think there are a very small amount of people that condone the looting, burning and so on of the BLM riots, or who had anything but contempt for the people who did that, but many who took on board the legitimate concerns that led to them. There are very much some legitimate concerns around mass migration.

He didn’t cause the riots come on guys. He’s spoken up for the basic principles behind why people are frustrated, and condemned the actual riots. He’s made it clear he doesn’t condone them.

I am sure you are a lovely person Soph but I am never going to believe that Nigel Farage is anything but a lying grifting arsehole lacking in any moral fibre who cares only for himself and is financed by his Russian puppet masters and far right American shitbags who threaten our beautiful democracy.

I hate him even more than I hated that bin bag full of custard Boris Johnson and that’s saying something.


edited to add, at least Boris has finally fucked off now though x

 

[Gym&Tonic]

Why is it ok for the media to hold the Labour government to account (fine when it’s justified), but not for them to look into Nigel’s dodgy past? No one should be exempt from scrutiny and if he wants to be PM him and his intellectually challenged supporters needs to accept this is going to happen from now on. If he has nothing to hide then he has nothing to worry about does he?

 

[Lady_H]

I really like this idea. I don’t know if my experience counts as any sort of proof but this is how my views have changed:

Maybe a decade ago, if you’d asked me about Farage/UKIP/Brexit Party etc I’d have said: “all a nasty bunch of right wing facists, hateful idiots”

I was a remainer, europhile, liberal left wing type voter.
My in-laws are, husband is etc.

Now, at that time, I lived in a different area of the country - north west England, an area that was relatively diverse, not hugely affluent but not run down.

I got married, ended up living in a not so sparkly area of North Wales that’s been ruined by lack of investment, unemployment and over the last 5 or 6 years an unsustainable amount of immigration from Eastern European countries.

All our local shops have disappeared, all replaced by Eastern European supermarkets, vape shops and nail bars. The street we live on, English/Welsh speaking locals are the minority. You’re more likely to hear a Polish or Romanian language spoken when you step out the front door.

There’s no community or integration anymore and no sense of local bonds. I often feel threatened and scared and don’t go out alone anymore - we get lots of groups of single Eastern European young men hanging round on the streets causing issues.

We regularly have to get the police and social services out to our Romanian neighbours because of their awful behaviour towards each other and their children. It’s scary.

My opinions therefore have altered somewhat. I don’t think mass immigration works. Do I think we need some migration? Yes. Do I think it’s sustainable at the levels it’s at? No. Does that make me a right wing bigot? NO. It makes me someone who has seen both ends of the scale and has moderated my view.

If you asked my in-laws who live in an affluent area of NW England with little to no migration and in an almost exclusively white, British middle class street - they’d tell you that ‘all migrants and refugees are welcome’ - but funnily enough, they don’t want to come and visit us here, because it’s a ‘bit rough…’ and make fun of the fact their son and daughter in law are living in a terraced house in a run down area.

My husband is hanging on to the liberal, left wing - mustn’t say anything bad about immigrants, but he’s not happy here either.

Right, sorry for the ramble…

It’s not a ramble, it’s a wonderful personal example of how experience shapes our thinking. These stories are important and should be told and discussed. They matter, and anyone who’s genuinely interested in changing voting patterns should listen.

I too was a lefty Labour or Lib Dem voting Remainer who thought Brexit could only have been a result of racism. I lived for decades in London where we started to be told that “our diversity is our strength”. Over the years what i saw and experienced personally led me to see that slogan for what it was - rubbish. What I saw included 2 stabbings on our street in a six month period, a neighbour’s son mugged at knife point at the station, and the local summer funfair turning into a sea of burquas - and noone else there. The high street was turkish barbers, chicken shops and vape shops. The local school which boasted 40 different languages spoken by pupils was nice enough, but I realised pretty quickly that this kind of much-touted “diversity” brought its own massive set of problems, not least just making a playdate with a mum who didn’t speak any English. As it turns out, having a shared language and culture really matters. I didn’t feel “stronger” because of diversity - I felt unsettled, disconnected and uneasy in the neighbourhood I’d known and lived in for years.

I didn’t want my son growing up in what felt like a genuinely threatening environment. We moved.

The affluent suburban areas of the UK can afford to support immigration without limits because they’re not impacted by it - at least, not yet.

 

[LadyMuck]

You see the one thing that shocks me from this is the Hitler Youth stuff, but sounds like he was led astray and being a silly little boy at school. Nobody that young really understands politics enough to have those views.
The rest… hardly outrageous

Didn't prince harry dress as a nazi.

 

[SharkAttack]

Oh lordy This thread took longer than I thought to go Pete Tong.

Tbf, I asked one question and still haven't had it answered re: the motorways. I would like statistics, like I have provided several times

I'm guessing this was for me but I missed it. TBH Mark if you think it's absolutely fine that a city the size of Hull arrives here every year, and that 'the Government' (ie taxpayers, ie me and hopefully you?) should just pay for it, we will never agree.

And if you think motorway driving in this country isn't plagued by obscene traffic every day of the week, I have to conclude you live on the Isle of Wight.

 

[soph30]

The fact Labour had solid seats in certain places for decades and suddenly there’s been huge shifts of millions of voters towards Reform to try to get the immigration issue sorted really shows that something’s amiss. I don’t think millions have turned racist, xenophobic and so on over the space of a few years… the UK’s had immigration for hundreds of years and it’s never been such a talking point until recently

 

[cl16girlie]

I don’t think Nigel can do no wrong, I’ve pointed out actions from him I’m not keen on. That video is also from 2020, so not like he’s doing it now after recent events.


I get that you’re saying these sorts of comments and videos from him fuel the fire, and I don’t disagree. But you could say the same about a leftie media figure saying the tories have caused cuts to public services and therefore starved children (which is rhetoric I’ve seen that isn’t untrue per se, but still inflammatory and intended to provoke emotion) and linking that to some previous riots which have also involved people burning things to protest against austerity. None of it helps and riots aren’t a healthy way to show frustration. Neither is Nigel stirring things, but at least he’s talking about issues that seem to resonate.

It is a consequence of cutting public services then blaming asylum seekers for it by the previous government. They think that the NHS is on its knees due to migrants not because it’s been underfunded to the bone where it’s not able to function properly. Nigel is stirring things, he spread lies about the murderer of the 3 girls and has egged on other far right figures in their bigotry. He resonates heavily with who exactly? He doesn’t with me, he might resonate heavily with Russian bots but most certainly with not with other people as they’ve demonstrated on this thread. He’s managed to portray himself as the saviour of the working class while being a public school boy, worth millions and being a leech off the tax payer as he’s so far not done anything for his beloved Clacton!

 

[miss n thropy]

The posts are from June

They demonstrate a pattern of language and behaviour over time which has led to the recent appalling riots.

Do you seriously believe all of this was anything to do with the murder of those three beautiful girls and just started on July 29th?

He has emboldened a festering hatred in his “fan base” and deserves jail time for incitement as much as the gullible fools who have listened to him.

 

[Perspicacia Tick]

Where do low income migrants live- rich or middle class areas or poor urban or seaside areas, causing overcrowding? What kind of jobs do they do- professional jobs or those typical of the low skilled working class? Sorry to use such blunt economic terms but it’s necessary
And sorry P I do like you, but just as a general comment people who make this sort of comment tend to live in unaffected areas. I’d be prepared to wager as an educated lady past 30 or so you do not live in an area where you see these issues first hand.

Except it's been shown time and time again that the areas with least immigration were more likely to vote for Brexit (and less immigrants) than the areas with the highest level of immigration - most of whom voted remain.

Nigel himself is standing in an area with very low levels of immigrants and minorities.

Why are people who are least likely to regularly come across people from other countries and races so much more anti-immigration? Could it be that it's much easier to convince people that immigrants are The Worst when they haven't really had the opportunity to meet any and discover that the vast majority of them are just, you know, normal fucking people.

 

[hogwartsgraduate]

Hello, Nigel fan here also!

Most of my saving votes have gone to Nigel I admit

 

[miss n thropy]

There’s too many people, basically because of very high immigration levels which is why the public services are under strain. A bit of immigration is fine and beneficial. As Monga says there’s a low wage economy which further makes things a race to the bottom, fuelled again by lots of low skilled immigration. Few Brits are Uber drivers living in cramped HMOs.

You have a point there @soph30.

I think we should get rid of all immigrants and descendants of immigrants who are a strain on our taxes.

I suggest we start with those tax dodging, low skilled, descended from countries all over those bloody rotten EU countries, inbreds in Buckingham Palace.

 

[Joon]

They wouldn't have had a nice breakfast and tea, if it wasn't mostly down to Nigel getting the answers right..... Thick as shit most of them....

 

[Moley1]

We have way too much immigration for a small island. Cut it in half and watch things improve- it would free up housing for a start. Baby steps Of course immigration's not the only issue and austerity HAS had an impact, but it does contribute
It's not about being callous towards migrants in need, but we get it ALL and we can't cope. There needs to be more of a balance

I thought it had been accepted that we need migration? The NHS, care homes, farming, there are so many sectors that rely on immigration. That is why the Tories have got themselves into a pickle. On one hand they are trying to placate the gammon voters and the far right of the party and in the other they know that we are stuffed without them. In trying to balance things up and not being honest about the need for migrants they have shafted themselves.
The money wasted on the stupid Rwandan vanity project would have been better spent on recruiting staff to deal with the massive backlog of asylum claims and a properly effective campaign in France against the trafficking gangs (another waste of money so far because current measures clearly haven’t stopped the boats).
We also need to understand that we are an aging population. Instead of forcing the old and infirm back to work, we should welcome younger, fitter workers here to help. This morning they were talking about how well Luxembourg is going financially and how migrant workers are contributing to their economy.
Instead of demonising migrants as Patel, Braverman and Jenrick have done (we even have a separate minister for illegal immigrant FFS!) we need to sort this out, stop thinking about migrants as terrorists and rapists, speed up the application process so those not meeting the criteria are sent back home, and put more time and energy into rebuilding the economy, the NHS and other public services. That is what we need. Not this endless pathetic attempt at distraction from the main issues facing the UK right now. This shower will only stop throwing red meat to the gullible when it stops working. Don’t fall for it!
---

Yep. So many people are so hard line. They genuinely do believe it's as simple as ___, and if you don't agree then you're wrong. End of.

Closed minds. Not interested in any discussion of a complicated situation. Their mind is made up.

All so reductive and helps no one. But we are where we are.

More and more people are talking about how this country is broken and nothing works. When the Middke Classes start getting twitchy you know things are getting bad. It is only Brexit although that has hamstrung our ability to deal with the various problems we face. Years of enforced austerity, a global pandemic, wars in Ukraine and the Middle East…it isn’t easy, we know that. But successive absolutely useless PM’s and their cabinets have only served to make things worse. As for being stronger alone, that myth has been busted surely? Even Farage can only come up with the submarine deal with Australia as a benefit from Brexit.
Brexit has screwed small businesses, our farming industry, our fishing industry, our freedom of movement…I could go on but I guess I will just be dismissed as a negative remoaner.
I would have loved Brexit to have been a success and to have been proved wrong as my life and those of my children would have improved. As it is, they have got worse.
If there was a vote tomorrow this country would vote to rejoin the EU. That’s how successful leaving was.
More and more people are seeing how they were lied to about the so called benefits, about the sovereignty lies, the migration lies. This is not being stuck in a mindset. It is coming to terms with reality and not PR spin from those with ulterior motives

 

[Lady_H]

Matt hates Nigel.. but seriously there are load of examples. He’s absolutely obsessed with these boats in the channel when IMO there are more important things to worry about than desperate people trying to flee persecution

I’d love to see some specifics about these loads of examples of racism and xenophobia. Farage’s is hardly an unusual viewpoint. An awful lot of people in the U.K. are worried about “boats in the channel”, about where people will go and how already stretched services will support them and the impact on local schools, hospitals, jobs and crime rates. Are they all racist and xenophobic too, for worrying about this?

And perhaps for you there are more important things to worry about, but that’s got absolutely nothing to do with other peoples’ concerns and campaigns. What doesn’t worry you might be extremely worrying for someone else and vice versa. Isn’t that wonderfully diverse! Lots of problems out there, plenty for all of us to get working on!

 

[PeteM]

He’s probably just taking it on the chin, if he shows he’s upset it will just encourage them

A lot of his immigration views seem to be muddied with racism, which I actually think is quite racist in itself. I know plenty of black Brits for example who like him and everyone’s always shocked, like they think the black Brits.. aren’t British and don’t like Britain and want the best for the country? Because of their skin colour?

We clearly mix in different circles. Every black person I know thinks he's a bellend. He's certainly xenophobic. That Breaking Point poster was abhorrent - and it's pretty much that which got Brexit over the line. He's the most powerful person in UK politics as far as I'm concerned - the Tories felt emboldened to go more right wing because of him. He is the turd that can't be flushed.

 

[Miss Havisham]

Yeah but how many of these boats are coming?! If it was like four boats a year then yeah there’s bigger issues, but they’re apparently coming DAILY (happy to be corrected). What other country has boatloads of daily migrants?

Also a load are from France

I don’t usually watch Breakfast TV, but as I have had a week of working from home - I have watched Good morning Britain (the 6am-7am part of the show) each morning. It has been an eye opener for me - they talk about the same few topics on a loop!
What I did find odd, is that the presenters talk about ‘the boats’ like it is the only route people have into the country to claim asylum. Most asylum seekers come in on aeroplanes - this idea seems to escape the presenters of Good Morning Britain.
People can come to this country as visitors, students, short term workers etc and then can go missing - living her illegally. Some then pay for false documentation that can make them appear legal (often involving fake / stolen identities). Some people live here anonymously for a while and then present themselves to the authorities as seeking asylum, often with little or no documentation that says who they are.
You would think from listening to the media that we stop boats coming over, and the issue of uncontrolled immigration is solved.

Regarding London, it is not the only place in the UK were people of different backgrounds live together. I’m sure most posters know this - that there are other cities in the UK that have much older established minority communities.
Resources are now squeezed to the limit though. I believe that a majority of us are pro controlled immigration, and most of us are against uncontrolled immigration. It doesn’t make us intolerant - it means we understand what is realistic / wanting everyone who lives here / settles here to have a decent life. Not people living on the streets with resources unavailable, as the situation has become unsustainable.

 

[soph30]

Seen some stuff online calling him an exhibitionist for showering naked apparently you’re meant to wear a swimsuit? Poor Nige just wants to be clean

 

[SharkAttack]

There's a lot of issues with the NHS unfortunately and I don't think a small (comparatively, to the general population) volume of people settling here are the issue, to be honest. I know people who work 'on the ground' in the NHS and it's an absolute shitshow. There's an absolute incompetence in managing basic things like appointments (pointed out to me by the family and friends I know who work there and have sadly ended up having to access healthcare because of Long Covid or cancer) and a very large volume of vastly, vastly overpaid non-clinical staff on Band 8a/b/c roles. I wasn't aware of quite how many of those roles there were until recently and I was quite appalled.

You’re right about the non clinical roles - I couldn’t agree more.

But I wouldn’t call 1.2M immigrants this year ‘small’ in any context.

 

[PeteM]

Farage being a shit stirrer? Never!