- Notice
DellaC
VIP Member
I've started writing this many times and deleted it. I'm not going to lie you've really got my back up but I know that's because I have an emotional connection to the subject matter and you very clearly have not.Jeeze what an emotional day
As I’ve seen it being discussed, just wanted to share that the Netherlands uses the Groningen protocol to decide whether a baby is going to experience unbearable suffering with no hope of improvement… if specific, strict criteria is met then baby can be euthanised. Our “equivalent” in this country is palliative care which of course isn’t the same thing. I don’t think from what I’ve read that a baby with DS with no major birth defects would allowed to be euthanised. It’s really done for those that are dying but it could take months of painful suffering etc.
Of course in this case all of these babies were not terminal, were not suffering and should’ve all lead long happy healthy lives
I could've aborted my baby the day before he was born in this country. Legally.
If he was born in the Netherlands I could have murdered him the day after he was born. Legally.
The strict guidance you speak of, the criteria for murder (if a child is already born its not fucking euthanasia or palliative, it's murder) would've been met by my son and MANY of his friends within our community.
When he was born Louie had congenital heart defects, kidney problems and various other issues. He would have met the 'very strict criteria' but instead of murdering him I decided to just love him.
Deeznutslol
VIP Member
Someone stop this man. Mrs Gill, if you are reading this right now then I beg you cut off your husbands internet access.
He has been absolutely disgusting and insufferable all day, I can’t believe what I am reading. At least we can safely say that if she gets a whole life order, there’s absolutely zero chance of her ever getting it overturned if he is going to be the one doing her appeal.
He has been absolutely disgusting and insufferable all day, I can’t believe what I am reading. At least we can safely say that if she gets a whole life order, there’s absolutely zero chance of her ever getting it overturned if he is going to be the one doing her appeal.
gigilouxx
VIP Member
I did, I made a comment saying his devices needed searching with a fine tooth comb and told him to put his lust for LL to one side and consider the families of the victims before he types his usual shit - it was deleted
I also asked him if he’s actually a scientist because I’ve seen Asda employees come out with more intelligent statements - it was deleted
Also said if he was my husband I’d change my name by deed poll and flee the country - once again, deleted
EffingDust
Chatty Member
Ok so…
Obviously this is all just my own opinion.
Full disclosure, before the trial I thought “innocent”, because I didn’t believe a person could do such things on such a scale. Early on in the trial I was G but not for all counts, and for the past 6 months I have been firmly “guilty” for all charges, just so you have an idea of my biases.
I went to court today annoyed that I was only watching BMs closing and annoyed I couldn’t get off work to see BNEs closing or LL on cross. I was thinking “CBA listening to this tosser” but also wanting to see history being made as this case will be massive once it’s over.
My opinion of BM (not LL) has changed a lot today. I was impressed by him, if I was on trial I would want him as my defence.
Yes, he is bombastic, arrogant, and clutching at straws, but really that’s all he has to clutch at. He’s doing the best with what he has. He is a great orator, I found him to weave a compelling narrative (although I didn’t find most of it plausible). I think he’s very good at what he does, and having just read the Standard write up l have to say he comes across much better in person than the write up portrays.
I would describe him as being like that odd amazing teacher or lecturer you get who makes a boring, difficult subject easy to understand, that’s his style of speaking.
For the actual content of what he was saying I’ve done a bit of a thematic analysis, it broadly slots into 4 areas:
like wrong or missed entries made by other nurses “but when LL does it, GUILTY!”, saying the prosecution are ignoring harm events that happens when LL was off duty (on the table of events he said there was 2 or 3 missing). A lot of implying the prosecution had cherry picked stats (but BM actually did the same in his closing).
He really laboured the “innocent till proven guilty” point and was quite compelling in how he presented it, it was a stirring speech about one’s duty to the accused.
As others have said he really went to town on Dewi Evans, however I have to say this was the one thing he said today in his closing that he actually had a bit of evidence to back up. I was quite surprised by some of what I heard and saw about this expert witness. I want to check back in the live reporting to see what was said as I don’t want to say anything I’m not allowed to, but the things he said did give me doubt in the motivations of the witness (not of LLs guilt).
However he over-extrapolated this and tried to paint Sandy Bohin as unreliable “by association” but then had nothing to back this up, so then did not sound credible.
IMO he missed the mark here and tried to kiss arse too much, it came across insincere.
“I do” after LL said “you think I pushed it [the feed] in”.
Said a lot of things about how they belittled LL, how they seemed outraged that she had dared argue back and defend herself.
The “go commando” comment was fairly well covered in the live reporting.
He also kept alluding to this being the first chance the defence has had to really properly address the jury and get their points across, like they haven’t had chance to bring things up until now.
Onto Lucy herself, this was a big motivation for me to visit court, to actually see this person (on video) with my own eyes. Others have commented on her appearance through the trial, and yes she looked more tired, miserable and heavier than her social media pictures. What struck me is how still she was. We all sat in hot courts for hours today and naturally people shifted around in chairs, scratched, drank water, fidgeted. LL could go >1 hour before any perceptible movement, just stock still and staring straight ahead for hours. It just seemed a bit weird.
Later in the day it looked like she dabbed her eyes with a tissue 3 times, but it was during the time BM was tearing Dewi Evans apart, so it seemed like an odd time to be emotional.
There was a point this afternoon where the speakers went wrong and made a horrible noise first and then quite a funny echo when BM was speaking, most people in court laughed briefly, even BM and the police and counsel. LL made no perceptible reaction. She did use that moment after when they were trying to sort the IT to have a bit of a look around the court.
Impact of todays closing on the jury:
There was only two points today that gave
me cause for concern.
Firstly; if somebody found the heaps of medical evidence to be too confusing or difficult to consider, then BM gives a neat
excuse for all this, I.e. that it was all cherry picked anyway to fit the “guilty till proven innocent theory”, and then you don’t have to trouble your mind thinking about it all, because the jury gets to decide what’s important and what’s not. I think this is why he’s popular on the Facebook groups. Hopefully there is nobody on the jury like this.
Secondly; the Dewi Evans discussion visibly swayed some of the people sitting on my side of the court and I think could have the potential to put doubt in the jury’s minds.
Otherwise anyone with half a brain could see all BM did today was well constructed, theatrical waffle.
Personally I think BM knows she’s toast and knows she’ll be up again on more charges before long. He’s just doing his job and honestly I quite enjoyed watching
him do it, as much as one can with such a dark subject matter.
---
Obviously this is all just my own opinion.
Full disclosure, before the trial I thought “innocent”, because I didn’t believe a person could do such things on such a scale. Early on in the trial I was G but not for all counts, and for the past 6 months I have been firmly “guilty” for all charges, just so you have an idea of my biases.
I went to court today annoyed that I was only watching BMs closing and annoyed I couldn’t get off work to see BNEs closing or LL on cross. I was thinking “CBA listening to this tosser” but also wanting to see history being made as this case will be massive once it’s over.
My opinion of BM (not LL) has changed a lot today. I was impressed by him, if I was on trial I would want him as my defence.
Yes, he is bombastic, arrogant, and clutching at straws, but really that’s all he has to clutch at. He’s doing the best with what he has. He is a great orator, I found him to weave a compelling narrative (although I didn’t find most of it plausible). I think he’s very good at what he does, and having just read the Standard write up l have to say he comes across much better in person than the write up portrays.
I would describe him as being like that odd amazing teacher or lecturer you get who makes a boring, difficult subject easy to understand, that’s his style of speaking.
For the actual content of what he was saying I’ve done a bit of a thematic analysis, it broadly slots into 4 areas:
- “The Prosecution has a theory and they’re bending everything to fit with it.”
like wrong or missed entries made by other nurses “but when LL does it, GUILTY!”, saying the prosecution are ignoring harm events that happens when LL was off duty (on the table of events he said there was 2 or 3 missing). A lot of implying the prosecution had cherry picked stats (but BM actually did the same in his closing).
He really laboured the “innocent till proven guilty” point and was quite compelling in how he presented it, it was a stirring speech about one’s duty to the accused.
- “Experts ain’t shit”
As others have said he really went to town on Dewi Evans, however I have to say this was the one thing he said today in his closing that he actually had a bit of evidence to back up. I was quite surprised by some of what I heard and saw about this expert witness. I want to check back in the live reporting to see what was said as I don’t want to say anything I’m not allowed to, but the things he said did give me doubt in the motivations of the witness (not of LLs guilt).
However he over-extrapolated this and tried to paint Sandy Bohin as unreliable “by association” but then had nothing to back this up, so then did not sound credible.
- “Buttering up the jury”
IMO he missed the mark here and tried to kiss arse too much, it came across insincere.
- “If you can’t attack what someone is saying, attack the way they say it”
“I do” after LL said “you think I pushed it [the feed] in”.
Said a lot of things about how they belittled LL, how they seemed outraged that she had dared argue back and defend herself.
The “go commando” comment was fairly well covered in the live reporting.
He also kept alluding to this being the first chance the defence has had to really properly address the jury and get their points across, like they haven’t had chance to bring things up until now.
Onto Lucy herself, this was a big motivation for me to visit court, to actually see this person (on video) with my own eyes. Others have commented on her appearance through the trial, and yes she looked more tired, miserable and heavier than her social media pictures. What struck me is how still she was. We all sat in hot courts for hours today and naturally people shifted around in chairs, scratched, drank water, fidgeted. LL could go >1 hour before any perceptible movement, just stock still and staring straight ahead for hours. It just seemed a bit weird.
Later in the day it looked like she dabbed her eyes with a tissue 3 times, but it was during the time BM was tearing Dewi Evans apart, so it seemed like an odd time to be emotional.
There was a point this afternoon where the speakers went wrong and made a horrible noise first and then quite a funny echo when BM was speaking, most people in court laughed briefly, even BM and the police and counsel. LL made no perceptible reaction. She did use that moment after when they were trying to sort the IT to have a bit of a look around the court.
Impact of todays closing on the jury:
There was only two points today that gave
me cause for concern.
Firstly; if somebody found the heaps of medical evidence to be too confusing or difficult to consider, then BM gives a neat
excuse for all this, I.e. that it was all cherry picked anyway to fit the “guilty till proven innocent theory”, and then you don’t have to trouble your mind thinking about it all, because the jury gets to decide what’s important and what’s not. I think this is why he’s popular on the Facebook groups. Hopefully there is nobody on the jury like this.
Secondly; the Dewi Evans discussion visibly swayed some of the people sitting on my side of the court and I think could have the potential to put doubt in the jury’s minds.
Otherwise anyone with half a brain could see all BM did today was well constructed, theatrical waffle.
Personally I think BM knows she’s toast and knows she’ll be up again on more charges before long. He’s just doing his job and honestly I quite enjoyed watching
him do it, as much as one can with such a dark subject matter.
---
Yes I did, too much for one dayHmmdid you stay over last night and drive back today?
nosycowmoo
Well-known member
9 months, week in, week out, un-believably long hours, usually pouring with sweat with the heat in there, the amount of things he has to remember, cross reference, predict what her answers could be and what he might need to link next, what he needs to say next remembering all those babies and parents and staffs names, it’s taken over his life, he’s so gentle, he speaks with respect and class at all times. I‘ve sat in awe of him many times now, and what a job he’s done (with the police’s help of course! ) 
"that’s our case and you'll let us know if we’re right" 
and they will 
"that’s our case and you'll let us know if we’re right" and they will 
I’m sorry I’ve gotten your back up. God I wish I didn’t have an emotional connection & I could’ve scrolled by the messages but got to me. This is because my baby was dying in my womb from an extra chromosome & so I chose to end their suffering in the most humane I knew how. They wouldn’t have made it outside the womb, perhaps for a few minutes, an hour at most.
Horrified when I read Netherlands could euthanise babies for otherwise being well so read into it and the baby has to have “unbearable suffering”. Your sweet boy and millions of other children who are leading happy, healthy lives have a great QOL & aren’t the children I’m or Holland are referring to..
Having an extra chromosome is a spectrum where many children like yours can have a great life in a loving home. Many others have major major defects which caused suffering. When I say major defects, I mean ones which affect their breathing, inability to eat etc. Ones that cause immense pain & suffering and they’d never be able to leave the hospital.
All the love & medical intervention the world wouldn’t have saved my daughter.
I know it’s an emotive subject so you hopefully wouldn’t usually use words like this on reflection but these parents and myself didn’t casually choose to “murder” our babies instead of merely just loving them. If loving them could end their pain then we’d all jump at this solution in a millisecond! Decision is the worst a parent has to make, wouldn’t wish it on my own enemy and believe me when I say, it’s done out of love. You take on the pain so your little baby doesn’t have to. The pain is indescribable.
I became a grandma yesterday, all well and baby and mum home 
was feeding her today and you forget how fragile they are and she’s a big baby but its not a lot of milk they have at this age and I was so gentle giving her a wee burp holding her head up.
Then thought about that bitch and how she overfed some of the babies and probably with force too, poor wee toots, she is evil exactly how she describes herself.
I will try listen tomorrow but not sure what he can say in her defence apart From it wasn’t her
was feeding her today and you forget how fragile they are and she’s a big baby but its not a lot of milk they have at this age and I was so gentle giving her a wee burp holding her head up.
Then thought about that bitch and how she overfed some of the babies and probably with force too, poor wee toots, she is evil exactly how she describes herself.
I will try listen tomorrow but not sure what he can say in her defence apart From it wasn’t her
raspberryjuice
VIP Member
Oh Della
I would heart this post 100x over if I could. My nephew had down syndrome. He was born with a hole in all 4 chambers of his heart. His Mum was told all through her pregnancy to terminate, that he’d have no chance at life and she was repeatedly told she was “still so young and wouldn’t want to be stuck with a baby with DS and disabilities”. At 3 months old he had heart surgery. He was so tiny that when they operated his heart valve also needed replacing and he fought just as hard as anyone would to get through that, he was on life support for almost 2 weeks, and 2 consultants did suggest turning it off as the surgery would likely have left him with further complications. But he pulled through, and he was thriving. He died at 7 months old because the valve failed, completely unexpectedly. It got stuck open and nobody can explain why. If it hadnt, he would probably still be here now. A happy 10 year old running around with his younger brother.
And whilst we didn’t get a happy ever after with him, whilst he was here he brought so much pure joy to our lives and so many people around him. The church was packed for his funeral with family, friends, nurses and doctors who’d met him and remembered his beautiful smiling face. For anyone to suggest that his mum should have terminated, or his life support turned off, is so unbelievably insulting. He was loved for every minute of his life by everyone who met him, and will be loved and remembered for all eternity while any of us are still here. None of us would have ever changed a single thing about him, only the length of time we got with him
I wish I could share his photo but it’s too outing now on a thread getting so much attention. He was perfect. As every baby is.
kabukigirl
Chatty Member
I just read this on the Daily Mail and it gave me shivers
"As he came to the end of his address Mr Johnson read out a series of lists of babies who had similar experiences across a number of categories.
These included infants who had bleeds in their throats, those with unusual colouring, those who had screamed or cried uncharacteristically, and those who collapsed shortly after being visited by their parents.
The barrister then told the jury: 'If anyone tries to tell you there are no similarities in this case, you've got a list now'.
None of the babies can be identified for legal reasons, but Mr Johnson named each of the alleged murder victims as he listed those who would all have gone home from the Countess of Chester Hospital had Letby 'not sabotaged them'.
He then read out the names of the other 10 babies Letby is accused of trying to murder.
In his final words to the jury, he said: 'That is our case, and you'll let us know if it's right'."
"As he came to the end of his address Mr Johnson read out a series of lists of babies who had similar experiences across a number of categories.
These included infants who had bleeds in their throats, those with unusual colouring, those who had screamed or cried uncharacteristically, and those who collapsed shortly after being visited by their parents.
The barrister then told the jury: 'If anyone tries to tell you there are no similarities in this case, you've got a list now'.
None of the babies can be identified for legal reasons, but Mr Johnson named each of the alleged murder victims as he listed those who would all have gone home from the Countess of Chester Hospital had Letby 'not sabotaged them'.
He then read out the names of the other 10 babies Letby is accused of trying to murder.
In his final words to the jury, he said: 'That is our case, and you'll let us know if it's right'."
MmmB777
VIP Member
Just put my darling six year old to bed ready to wake up 7 
always find birthday eves a little tricky. Time goes so fast. Just so grateful and extra sad tonight for all the babies that should be here as happy little children. Especially thinking of O&P that should be just like my little boy right now 
this case has been something else. Thank god you were all here too. I don’t think I’ll follow much at all tomorrow. Don’t think I can stomach hearing any nonsense after what BNE delivered this week. X
always find birthday eves a little tricky. Time goes so fast. Just so grateful and extra sad tonight for all the babies that should be here as happy little children. Especially thinking of O&P that should be just like my little boy right now this case has been something else. Thank god you were all here too. I don’t think I’ll follow much at all tomorrow. Don’t think I can stomach hearing any nonsense after what BNE delivered this week. Xnosycowmoo
Well-known member
Soo yesterday wasn’t as bad as it sounds written up- at all!
•BM was too gushing too OTT going on and on about how good the jury are thanking them etc but it went on so long it almost came across as insincere/ too rehearsed. I felt like I needed a sick bucket
•when he was saying the prosecution say everything leads to guilty he was throwing his arms around trying to get an Oscar i think, everytime he mentioned LL he did this poor LL face and pointed at her. He’s been army, author, barrister and I’m guessing actor next, it was very theatrical and kinda too OTT- again came across to over rehearsed and not Authentic.
•the bit about the prosecution shouldn’t have asked LL about staffing pressures etc, you could tell he was narked. He wasn’t happy she’d answered it and he had to basically say she doesn’t know what she’s on about and then told us there was staffing issues etc. he went on and on and on about so many sick babies extra children brought in extra this is in direct correlation etc. no it’s not! There’s a ratio of staff to needs, they were never shown to my knowledge to not have enough staff!
•about her remembering pieces of evidence, he said ‘there’s little else to do in prison’ there were a few laughs here. Granted yes BUT that doesn’t explain why she doesn’t remember the rest or forgot things from 2 weeks ago but suddenly after all these years now remembers somethings that happened 7 years ago that she hadn’t remembered 2,3,4 years later in police interviews
•he said her treatment in cross exam was (in the most over exaggerated voice, tone and action ) ‘BADDDD’ yet he ate the witnesses alive in cross exam, who’ve done nothing wrong, they aren’t in court suspected of murder.
•he said that the fact everyone seems to think the babies were doing brilliantly boggles his mind, then he said something basically saying they could’ve all died they were soooo sick that’s why they were there. But some of those babies were ready to go home!
•defence Said we are the only people who will stand up for LL-no one else will. No because you brought a plumber, where’s your expert witness’s, character witness’s etc that’s no one’s fault but his! Well hers…
•she ‘dared to defend herself’ no she was rude arrogant, self righteous sometimes snappy, absolutely I wanted her to defend herself and tell the truth but she did not IMO she changed what she said every sentence.
•when he said there were months in which they could’ve raised the alarm, if they were right it was a failure and staggering failure in care WAIT WHAT so one second he’s saying she’s done nothing wrong, then said well if she has they haven’t stopped it continuing and reported it… sorry what. She’s either guilty or not you can’t have answers for both, to try and make the prosecution wrong for both this was really clutching at straws for me.
•then he basically said if air embolism worked so well why change it up to insulin etc and if she was so good why did some not die WTF this didn’t go down well, really clutching, he came across awfully! Like she’s not stupid if she did the exact same thing over and over it would be noticed she covered her back and changed them to make it less suspicious…
•saying the list of similarities wern’t all similar some were similar because parents had just gone home, he was saying the opposite for all the others- but yes of course because again it would be soooo obvious!
•notice board was really pointless. Do murders not have notice boards, or perhaps theirs have skulls and Satan pictures on?! I’m sorry if one of your only examples for being nice is a notice board I’m sorry it’s not looking good!
•the she dared to have a social life before the arrest- the problem he failed to point out is SHE WASNT ALLOWED to speak to any work colleagues, then eventually a few, but she ignored it all and carried on yet clearly lied to the jury to get them to feel sorry for her- that was proved FACT with the socials.
•he said about her messages to colleagues were normal, others did it too, I wouldn’t say moaning about not being in room but colleague gets to etc is normal. I certainly don’t think talking about confidential babies etc is normal. And as for many staff doing it 2 wrongs don’t make a right- no one should’ve had their phone even on them! Let alone being used.
•the collection of paper, IMO he wasn’t impressed with how she explained she collected them so he’s tried to soften the edges. He also failed to mention that yes she had 257 but the ones relevant to these cases were in a bag of just around 30 for safe keeping under her bed. They may have been less than 10% of the total but they were around 50% of the ones under the bed! Some wern’t the correct dates- no but it still had the names to search on fb.
•moaning about air embolism research being on pigs and rabbits, hmm I wonder why that could possibly be…. Hmm surely there wasn’t a lack of parents wanting to sign their babies up to have air embolisms inserted for research
The microphones kept messing up some awful ear hurting stuff and some where it kept repeating the last bit he said like a rap- literally everyone was laughing- I felt like Matilda ‘shut him up shut him up’ and off went the sound
Sorry for the biggest ramble ever
•BM was too gushing too OTT going on and on about how good the jury are thanking them etc but it went on so long it almost came across as insincere/ too rehearsed. I felt like I needed a sick bucket
•when he was saying the prosecution say everything leads to guilty he was throwing his arms around trying to get an Oscar i think, everytime he mentioned LL he did this poor LL face and pointed at her. He’s been army, author, barrister and I’m guessing actor next, it was very theatrical and kinda too OTT- again came across to over rehearsed and not Authentic.
•the bit about the prosecution shouldn’t have asked LL about staffing pressures etc, you could tell he was narked. He wasn’t happy she’d answered it and he had to basically say she doesn’t know what she’s on about and then told us there was staffing issues etc. he went on and on and on about so many sick babies extra children brought in extra this is in direct correlation etc. no it’s not! There’s a ratio of staff to needs, they were never shown to my knowledge to not have enough staff!
•about her remembering pieces of evidence, he said ‘there’s little else to do in prison’ there were a few laughs here. Granted yes BUT that doesn’t explain why she doesn’t remember the rest or forgot things from 2 weeks ago but suddenly after all these years now remembers somethings that happened 7 years ago that she hadn’t remembered 2,3,4 years later in police interviews
•he said her treatment in cross exam was (in the most over exaggerated voice, tone and action ) ‘BADDDD’ yet he ate the witnesses alive in cross exam, who’ve done nothing wrong, they aren’t in court suspected of murder.
•he said that the fact everyone seems to think the babies were doing brilliantly boggles his mind, then he said something basically saying they could’ve all died they were soooo sick that’s why they were there. But some of those babies were ready to go home!
•defence Said we are the only people who will stand up for LL-no one else will. No because you brought a plumber, where’s your expert witness’s, character witness’s etc that’s no one’s fault but his! Well hers…
•she ‘dared to defend herself’ no she was rude arrogant, self righteous sometimes snappy, absolutely I wanted her to defend herself and tell the truth but she did not IMO she changed what she said every sentence.
•when he said there were months in which they could’ve raised the alarm, if they were right it was a failure and staggering failure in care WAIT WHAT so one second he’s saying she’s done nothing wrong, then said well if she has they haven’t stopped it continuing and reported it… sorry what. She’s either guilty or not you can’t have answers for both, to try and make the prosecution wrong for both this was really clutching at straws for me.
•then he basically said if air embolism worked so well why change it up to insulin etc and if she was so good why did some not die WTF this didn’t go down well, really clutching, he came across awfully! Like she’s not stupid if she did the exact same thing over and over it would be noticed she covered her back and changed them to make it less suspicious…
•saying the list of similarities wern’t all similar some were similar because parents had just gone home, he was saying the opposite for all the others- but yes of course because again it would be soooo obvious!
•notice board was really pointless. Do murders not have notice boards, or perhaps theirs have skulls and Satan pictures on?! I’m sorry if one of your only examples for being nice is a notice board I’m sorry it’s not looking good!
•the she dared to have a social life before the arrest- the problem he failed to point out is SHE WASNT ALLOWED to speak to any work colleagues, then eventually a few, but she ignored it all and carried on yet clearly lied to the jury to get them to feel sorry for her- that was proved FACT with the socials.
•he said about her messages to colleagues were normal, others did it too, I wouldn’t say moaning about not being in room but colleague gets to etc is normal. I certainly don’t think talking about confidential babies etc is normal. And as for many staff doing it 2 wrongs don’t make a right- no one should’ve had their phone even on them! Let alone being used.
•the collection of paper, IMO he wasn’t impressed with how she explained she collected them so he’s tried to soften the edges. He also failed to mention that yes she had 257 but the ones relevant to these cases were in a bag of just around 30 for safe keeping under her bed. They may have been less than 10% of the total but they were around 50% of the ones under the bed! Some wern’t the correct dates- no but it still had the names to search on fb.
•moaning about air embolism research being on pigs and rabbits, hmm I wonder why that could possibly be…. Hmm surely there wasn’t a lack of parents wanting to sign their babies up to have air embolisms inserted for research
The microphones kept messing up some awful ear hurting stuff and some where it kept repeating the last bit he said like a rap- literally everyone was laughing- I felt like Matilda ‘shut him up shut him up’ and off went the sound
Sorry for the biggest ramble ever
Cheddar Chalpupa
VIP Member
I bet this bit is really heavy in court with him using their names.
Edit - bloody copy & paste messed up!
Mr Johnson lists the common events for the babies in this indictment by categorisation.
By ones who collapsed despite having good air entry but saturations were dropping: Child A, C, D, G, H [second event], I [third event and fourth event], M, O [twice], P.
By bleeds and/or bleeding in throat: Child C, E, G, H, N, plus 'false note by Letby' in K.
Unusual discolouration: Child A, B, D, E, I, M, O, H.
Suffered life-threatening collapses out of nowhere then recovered very quickly: Child B, D, H [both collapses], I [events one to three], M, N, O, P.
Children who collapsed when designated nurse left or leaving the room: Child C, D, G [first event], I [second event and fourth event], K, N [first event], P [third collapse - when doctors were out of the room], Q [slight variation - when Letby got herself out of the room].
Premature babies screaming/crying at time of collapse: Child E, I, N.
Children who collapsed shortly after being visited by their parents: Child B, H, I [first event], M, N, O, P.
Children who recovered quickly when taken to other hospitals: Child H, I [after 3rd collapse], N, Q.
Mr Johnson says Child K's tube never moved after being transferred out of the Countess.
When Letby participated in inappropriate post-death behaviours: Child C, I, O.
Poinsoned by insulin: F, L.
Mr Johnson says if Letby had not sabotaged seven babies, they would all have gone home. The other 10 babies, Letby attempted to murder.
Edit - bloody copy & paste messed up!
Mr Johnson lists the common events for the babies in this indictment by categorisation.
By ones who collapsed despite having good air entry but saturations were dropping: Child A, C, D, G, H [second event], I [third event and fourth event], M, O [twice], P.
By bleeds and/or bleeding in throat: Child C, E, G, H, N, plus 'false note by Letby' in K.
Unusual discolouration: Child A, B, D, E, I, M, O, H.
Suffered life-threatening collapses out of nowhere then recovered very quickly: Child B, D, H [both collapses], I [events one to three], M, N, O, P.
Children who collapsed when designated nurse left or leaving the room: Child C, D, G [first event], I [second event and fourth event], K, N [first event], P [third collapse - when doctors were out of the room], Q [slight variation - when Letby got herself out of the room].
Premature babies screaming/crying at time of collapse: Child E, I, N.
Children who collapsed shortly after being visited by their parents: Child B, H, I [first event], M, N, O, P.
Children who recovered quickly when taken to other hospitals: Child H, I [after 3rd collapse], N, Q.
Mr Johnson says Child K's tube never moved after being transferred out of the Countess.
When Letby participated in inappropriate post-death behaviours: Child C, I, O.
Poinsoned by insulin: F, L.
Mr Johnson says if Letby had not sabotaged seven babies, they would all have gone home. The other 10 babies, Letby attempted to murder.
nosycowmoo
Well-known member
Not read the write up or tattle. But honestly today was laughable on many occasions. He came across as clutching a lot and it was almost patronising in places too, I was worried some opinions would be turned but actually no, in person it didn’t come across well
Wellthisisinteresting
VIP Member
The fact Lucy Letby can’t be a murderer as she had a photo of her self smiling on her wall
Was she meant to have photos of her holding up bags of insulin with a death stare.
Was she meant to have photos of her holding up bags of insulin with a death stare.