No she had suspicions it wasn’t but went ahead with it anyway.Well wasn’t the point that at the time she did think it was NEC
My son is an (all UK) 999 operator, he says that all ambulance calls are always answered and responded to much more quickly in Scotland than anywhere in England. Always. All the time.It's not a criticism on individuals, but the staff shortages and cuts absolutely make a difference. I left not too long ago because even though myself and my colleagues were all passionate, competent, committed and dedicated to the job it was unsafe. There are undoubtedly issues with the culture in some settings and trusts, but honestly being way way under safe staffing levels is scary. One night shift I was the only registered nurse for 18 patients- even though the HCAs were brilliant that's just bloody ludicrous. Even when you Datix it its pointless as nothing gets done. Wait lists for scans etc at a year plus, it's heartbreaking. I am a huge advocate for the NHS and its great some are still receiving great care, but bloody hell if it was a person it'd be on DNR at this point.
Things weren't as bad nationally in the timeframe of the trial, but lots of things people are finding fairly shocking seem like business as usual to be honest. I will add my GP surgery is amazing, not sure how they do it as the demand is huge and like everywhere they are short of qualified GPs.
I know a lot think the insulin babies are the stronger evidence babies. I’m not medical so not really sure on the ins and outs of insulin (as was obvs the night the insulin discussion happened between yourself and another posterI’ve only popped in and out but I’m hoping once mum duties are done tonight to have a good read of the wiki. From your posts @OldBlondie and a few other posters over the current discussion, there is a lot of sensible and open minded insight as to what can be expected as a reasonable standard within the nhs but I do find a lot of the blame culture around the nhs really difficult. I’ve worked with plenty of crap nhs workers and there are protocols to approach this. It’s broken for sure, but it’s broken from the top down (see the former fecking health minister mopping up 400k - alongside the mp wage which in itself could play for at least four more doctors in that particular nicu) and we all make mistakes but equally what is right for one patient isn’t always the same for the next patient.
The chat around lack of pm.. a bit of understanding and willingness to understand why a pm would be done is so helpful.. if LL had removed oxygen from a patient who then had a cardiac arrest from a low oxygen level which causes heart attack/cardiac arrest.. ‘low oxygen’ doesn’t show on pm, it would be classed as a natural cause ie heart attack with no toxins etc and taken a year for inquest/closure for the parents. And no, not one person had reason to suspect foul play and if they dared to suggest they had done then all the backlash would be (correctly) against why they didn’t immediately call the police on suspecting it.
I’m happy to offer explanations where I can and I being as objective and transparent as possible - including agreeing where failings are evident. Medicine is not black and white, there is almost always more than one explanation for anything from a nose bleed up to a death. Making the decision re what the cause is and proceeding to treat it is one of the main distinguishing factors between what being a doctor is as opposed to other members of the healthcare team, as is holding hands up and admitting you could have been or were wrong. Let’s also remember that she was essentially a manipulating compulsive psychopathic liar, taking in to account the calculating harm she purportedly carried out.
I will let you know once I’ve read a bit more around the background @OldBlondie but I can see for sure the headline of ‘x number of families were interviewed as part of police investigation around LL’ once the verdict is reached. All we can reflect on now is how she’s kept out of the way of inflicting harm. How any of the families, or even the staff in that unit are able to trust another health professional again is beyond me though. I just can’t imagine how that would feel.
You have worded this perfectly - to the point it’s brought me to tears.
Me tooI’m sorry. That is how I feel too sometimes.
I am so interested to see your take on the wiki and insight into things. Thanks for your contribution.
The original fella (sorry for anyone this may offend)Dr Evans perhaps….?
I can definitely vouch for this. I think of it as staff such as Dietitians, Physiotherapists, Speech and Language Therapists etc are the 'black and white' specialisms, whereas medics are the 'all the grey areas in between and weighing up the picture as a whole' staff.sadly medicine is about as far from ‘black and white’ as you can get. It’s about evidence gathering, examination of patients, looking at numbers and trends, looking st responses to treatment or trends over time, and fitting these to a reasonable pattern to make a judgement call. I can only emphasise that medics and the wider team are trusted for their actions and opinions ‘to the best of their knowledge’.
I’ve said it before, the NHS has just spent 100s of thousands of pounds to save my life. Everyone at the GP’s practice, from the receptionists up, have been fab.
So I don't wanna be a right predictable fella and mention any other high-profile-long-running cases where high ranking establishments have been fighting through the courts, but yeh... kinda par for the course. And I expect it will be a LOT more by the end of the trial too.View attachment 1736595
I don’t think they would spend this amount of money if they had nothing to go on.
True. I just thought it was worth sharing.So I don't wanna be a right predictable fella and mention any other high-profile-long-running cases where high ranking establishments have been fighting through the courts, but yeh... kinda par for the course. And I expect it will be a LOT more by the end of the trial too.
I get that but Charles Cullen killed patients, for 16 years, in a ‘for profit’ healthcare system. There have been killer nurses in Europe.I am really glad they’ve saved your life. But as someone who works on the front line I see disappointed patients most days who are let down by a system that has inadequate funding.
You’ve mentioned several times now that you had a good experience recently and I’m really glad that you did, but that hasn’t been the experience for everyone and people are entitled to voice their negative stories about the NHS and opinions too. At the end of the day this trial has exposed failings at the hospital and has shown that the care some of those babies received was sub optimal. If we don’t complain about these sub standard conditions and talk about the dire state the NHS is currently in, how are things ever going to improve?I get that but Charles Cullen killed patients, for 16 years, in a ‘for profit’ healthcare system. There have been killer nurses in Europe.
Why is this murder trial being turned into an excuse to constantly bitch about the NHS?
Baby G has been left with quite severe brain damage I think, so I really hope there has or will be help for them finance wise. All families deserve justice and compensation, but G’s family could well need financial help especially, depending on the needs of G, having suffered the, I think, permanent brain damage she has been left withView attachment 1736662View attachment 1736664
This solicitors has been working with the families for many years. I hope they get the justice they deserve.
Yes, I get that. Of course people are entitled to voice their negative experiences. We all know there are failings within the NHS. We all know every healthcare system in the world has failings, for example, look at the number of medical malpractice suits in the USA.You’ve mentioned several times now that you had a good experience recently and I’m really glad that you did, but that hasn’t been the experience for everyone and people are entitled to voice their negative stories about the NHS and opinions too. At the end of the day this trial has exposed failings at the hospital and has shown that the care some of those babies received was sub optimal. If we don’t complain about these sub standard conditions and talk about the dire state the NHS is currently in, how are things ever going to improve?
when she was arrested 3 times, did they have to ‘let her go’ the first 2 times because they didn’t have enough evidence or?She was arrested three times so she had more than enough time to think about what had been asked previously and multiple opportunities to come up with an answer.
Say they asked her about the searches in 2018 and she panics and can’t think of a answer. You would be released and run over it all in your head and by the time you are arrested again in 2019 you’ve have had plenty of time to come up with an answer.
Although I completely agree with you – could you imagine the implications for the hospital if they fired her and she lodged an unfair dismissal claim? Even with circumstantial evidence or concern, there was no ‘real’ evidence at the time. I imagine it was a heavily discussed decision with some high up people within the hospital board/NHS who decided clerical duties would be best for her at the time. I do wonder if suspending her WITH pay would have been a better or viable option though…when she was arrested 3 times, did they have to ‘let her go’ the first 2 times because they didn’t have enough evidence or?
I still find it really hard to imagine someone sat doing clerical duties for a long period of time knowing they were being suspected even just by colleagues of harming the babies, I just don’t know how she could turn up to work, even with the ongoing grievance. Also sorry not quite caught up today yet so realise I’m quoting a post from yesterday…
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