Liam Payne #6

[MammaTubbs]

With the whole 'Cheryl paving the way for 1D reconciliation', definitely PR, Simon Jones who used to be PR for One Direction, represents Cheryl herself, Girls Aloud,Louis and Niall, he even attended Liam's funeral himself.

I just can't get on board with the whole she used him to have a baby business, what would be the need? She's affluent enough to do the whole sperm donor route if she desired, without needing to involve a real man at all, bar his donation

Even if she was on the prowl for an unwitting man and his semen, surely there's a more sensible pick than someone with historic kidney issues, and active mental health and addiction issues. And there's obviously that ever since she's been accused of grooming him, tricking him into a baby and so forth.

I honestly can't understand why she would have caused herself the hassle (that's now worse than ever) unless she genuinely loved him at some point.

Maybe she was a bit too controlling, but for her part it's probably lucky she was as it's probably shielded B from a lot of what's happened over the last few years, especially in the earlier years he did seem to see B much more frequently, which suggests it's probably down to something that's happened she's had to put some boundaries in place maybe?

And poor Joan always gets some stick, Liam himself always spoke warmly of her, and even if she is overly fond of her mother I'm sure he knew that before having unprotected sex with her, well I'd hope so anyway lol

Plenty of cultures thrive on multi generational living, but I can understand why it does seem strange to us, in their situation however I'm sure they've got annexes etc so they won't be on top of each other all the time.

Also for what it's worth, it seems like she hasn't restricted the Paynes access to him in anyway, especially if she is a bit controlling she was clearly comfortable enough for Geoff to apparently supervise contact, which suggests he has a consistent and good relationship with B.

 

[FentonLeigha84]

With the whole 'Cheryl paving the way for 1D reconciliation', definitely PR, Simon Jones who used to be PR for One Direction, represents Cheryl herself, Girls Aloud,Louis and Niall, he even attended Liam's funeral himself.

I just can't get on board with the whole she used him to have a baby business, what would be the need? She's affluent enough to do the whole sperm donor route if she desired, without needing to involve a real man at all, bar his donation

Even if she was on the prowl for an unwitting man and his semen, surely there's a more sensible pick than someone with historic kidney issues, and active mental health and addiction issues. And there's obviously that ever since she's been accused of grooming him, tricking him into a baby and so forth.

I honestly can't understand why she would have caused herself the hassle (that's now worse than ever) unless she genuinely loved him at some point.

Maybe she was a bit too controlling, but for her part it's probably lucky she was as it's probably shielded B from a lot of what's happened over the last few years, especially in the earlier years he did seem to see B much more frequently, which suggests it's probably down to something that's happened she's had to put some boundaries in place maybe?

And poor Joan always gets some stick, Liam himself always spoke warmly of her, and even if she is overly fond of her mother I'm sure he knew that before having unprotected sex with her, well I'd hope so anyway lol

Plenty of cultures thrive on multi generational living, but I can understand why it does seem strange to us, in their situation however I'm sure they've got annexes etc so they won't be on top of each other all the time.

Also for what it's worth, it seems like she hasn't restricted the Paynes access to him in anyway, especially if she is a bit controlling she was clearly comfortable enough for Geoff to apparently supervise contact, which suggests he has a consistent and good relationship with B.

I think using Liam rather than a sperm donor would be beneficial to her as she gets child maintenance for life from him and he was rich enough to keep her comfortable plus keep thier son in a very comfortable life. I know she earned a lot of money herself but I don't beleive its as many millions as people think, she was in a successful girl group that didn't write their own singles so she would'nt have made much from that. Neither of her marraiges would have given her a lot of money on divorcing as they were short lived and no children. All she really has is the Xfactor money, dance shows money and some old Hello/OK magazine itnerview money. She does not have enough to afford her the life she has long term. Her 2nd marraige ended although there is rumours of an overlap with her husband and Liam so who knows, but she was open about being desperate to be a mother and being upset at it not happening in either of her marraiges particularly with Ashley. I think she went with Liam possibly out of Lust as well as knowing he was young and could be easily controlled. I think he spoke well of Joan as he speaks well of everyone and never seems to ag anyone off. Even his ex Mya. His whole family seem to come across in a lovely way like that, that they dont seem to see the bad in anyone or talk bad of anyone. These are just my opinions and observations though.

 

[FentonLeigha84]

Speaking of that RS article, I know they had their "sources" implying his struggle with sexuality but does anyone else think it could more his identiity struggle that Maya was talking about rahter than sexuality? As in, maybe he was autistic spectrum - many youtube vidoes of their really early days he doesnt seem to get the innuendos being said from both interviewers and his band mates and the sexual innuendos and he seems to takes everything at literal value? so could he have been neurodivergent. He came across very adorable and nerdy, serioud and old soul but more recent interviews in his solo career he seemed to want to be seen more as sexy and a sex symbol which didn't help with his image as he was slated for some of his songs - Strip that dowm and both ways, neither of which he really wrote, they were given to him. In some interviews hes playing up to the sex songs but on other interviews he says he wanted to have more meaningful songs on his next album as he isnt a "horn dog" as he put it and there are more meaningful things to write about its not always about sex - his own words in a podcast I saw. Or could just be his mental health struggle with him knowing who he is ie does he want to be a solo star, is he struggling on stage without his bandmates and would prefer a band or maybe he wanted a simple normal life - old interviews he talks fondly of his dads factory job and also wanting to be a fireman. Maybe that was his struggle???

Its sad if it was his sexuality he struggled with, in this day and age youd think people can live how they want to rahter than have to hide themselves. Can't help but wonder if lines were blurred within the band due to their affectionate nature and boredome and being stuck together 24/7 while on tour, did they become confused with feelings for same sex/each other and not knowing what or who they really want. I know there has always been a "Larry" thing but only recently came across the "Ziam" conspiracy but really, out of 5 members 4 of them being in love with each other? What really are the chances of that actually happened? Im wondering oif RS article is just sensationalising theories that are widely out there. Its a shame they did so as really they should just let him rest in peace now.

 

[bellbells16]

I feel a bit icky even talking about this because it was Liam’s own business…but if he had questions about his sexuality I think it’s so sad that he couldn’t explore that in a safe way or even be open about it. That part of the fan base that fetishised them and obsessed about their sexuality did so much damage. It gave them no space to be anything other than heterosexual because of how crazy the fans were.

 

[LittlePea]

I find it weird the papers kept saying how Cheryl had paved the way for the other 1D boys to reconcile at Liams wake back at his house, I kinda think it was PR spin for her though because Im sure the boys wouldn't need her to bring them together at the wake which was in a private place.

Also having gone down a rabbit hole of his relationships - I agree I think he loved Cheryl as mother of his child plus she seems a good mum keeping their son out of the limelight, albeit she seems a bit controlling on the whole Bear front and reading between the lines in many of Liams interviews once they splut I get the feelign that she is very controlling and makes the decisions. When he got with Mya he said in a few interviews his last relationship - Cheryl was with someone who cared far too much about how she came across and with papparrazzi etc and he was so happy to be with someone more carefree who he could go out and enjoy himself with and be free not caring about paps etc. He also spoke of how they disagreed on bears name - he wanted traditional she wanted unusual and hes called bear. He wants privace but is also more open to posting and talking whereas she isnt, he was open about their relationship too and there is many stories of her being angry at him for saying too much in interviews etc. Given her history of also being bossy with her exes and moving her mum in, I really don't see their relationship being the amazing fairytale that would have gave him the happy ending and life he desired. I stand by what I have said before in previous posts - she saw an opportunity with him and took it to have a child, and once she got what she wanted - Bear, she didn't really care if it worked out with Liam or not. Imo he would have been better matched with someone in the normal world - many articles in 1D early days he often talked of eventually marrying and kids, I think his failure to find a thriving and fulfilly life (which inluded the stepford family life with white picket fence) beyond 1D and the fake world of fame will have contributed to his mental health, not been the sole factor but I believe his lack of family life with his son and lack of an actual family life byond his parents and siblings (who all have loving partners they married and started a family with) contributed to his depression etc. Cheryl was not the best person to pro-create with as they were never going to have the family life he seemd to crave - she wanted sole control of parenting and a nice home with her mum and brother, perhaps she wanted him as part of it but I doubt he wanted her mum with them 24/7. I think initially he hoped for her to come with him to usa abd be a mother/housewife while he woked on his solo career but cheryl is not into the usa life and being away from home (UK). He said in multiple interviews and podcasts about her living out there in his calabassas home when pregnant but again she couldnt be an adult and be with her partner alone, he talked of her mum being there too. She was never going to substain a relationship with anyone with her mother around all the time, but like i said, I beleive she didn't care for a long term relationship with him or anyone once she got her goal - a baby. I also feel she needs to watch and not become one of they toxic boy moms - the way she has said in interviews she doesnt need a valentine as her son is her dream man, when asked another time when somthing happnes who the 1st person she would call and she says "me son as he always has something to say" its kind of creepy. She will probably be the type to not like his gf or partners as it is competition for her time and affection. He had 2 major relationships after her that lasted a few years each and Maya he was even engaged to yet they never met his son. Super weird. When you have split and move on then you have to accept that your ex will have a new partner that will become a step parent to your child but I bet cheryl would not allow any one else access or to be involved.

As for Maya - I stilll dont believe everything she alleges. I do believe they had a toxic relationship but I think she was just as toxic as him. He was no angel but he was not what she is making him out to be. she is another amber heard & blake livey, fabricating stories cos people will blindly beleive all women despite NO evidence! If you go down the rabbit hole of her she was with Austin Mahone for a long time and at one point was seeing both him and Liam at same time. There are runours she ruined what little career he had left once they split but also many allegations and time stamps in her book are linked to her time with him and not Liam. She would never get the "fame" or attention on her book with it being based on multiple ex boyfirneds or just Austin himself, she will only get the attention with saying it is based on Liam. There is no way to prove what she is saying is truth or for him to prove she is lying so she can say what she wants. Abortions are a tablet these days unless she was quite far along then it would be surgical so that part of her story is either full lie or fabricated. Given his nature I doubt he would so callously leave her just bleeding, he could easily have her taken to hospital and none of it would come out because it is against both UK and USA law to publicly declare someones health issues hence many of Liams previous substance od's etc have been announced as kidney issues and such.

I actually like Kate's tik tok she seemd genuine. The interview wasnt so good but she is not used to them, she is more used to the shorter vlogs/tik tok reels that she can curate herself so could have been nerves etc.

‘People will blindly believe all women’ yet you are blindly believing Liam couldnt have done terrible things as a partner? Hardly anyone believes Blake Lively or Amber Heard so that’s just not true is it? Let’s face it, very very rarely is a man’s career ruined after a woman accuses them of something.

Your part about the abortion doesn’t make sense, what would she be lying about? You can have reactions, complications and bleed heavily regardless of whether you have a medical or surgical abortion and If he didn’t want her to go in for surgical, it could have been because he didn’t want the public to see and say, not because he thought a Dr would publicly declare it.

It’s SO textbook of abuse to say ‘he had such a great nature, he was was so kind to everyone, he couldn’t possibly have been like that’ because that’s quite literally how they get away with it and why the person who was abused is rarely believed.

 

[MammaTubbs]

The media's response to it is ridiculous, if he even was, there's no shame in question in your sexuality, there's no shame in keeping in private as you do so, there's no shame in never commenting on it etc (I know he denied being in a relationship with Roger), only one person knows how Liam felt about his sexuality and that was Liam, and he's not around to confirm or deny any longer so it's cruel.

There's plenty more to focus on in how he sadly ended up where he did.

 

[AllSeeingEye123]

Just a quick Google of "liam payne sexuality" brings up a list of major publications from around the world like Rolling Stone Magazine, Hollywood Reporter and New York Times writing about him sexting fellas.

 

[KINGAA]

In this day and age…. WHO CARES. Honestly, why does anyone even care who he liked. If he wasn’t comfortable with who he was then he wasn’t. It’s none of our business if he likes men or women in the privacy of his own home.

Also, I took Maya saying identity issues as more in line of what his friends were saying which was he was struggling with fans not connecting with his music like others and him comparing himself to 1Ds success. I think RS and other publications are taking snippets of her statement and twisting it.

 

[MammaTubbs]

Identity is such a broad definition, and it's clear he was probably struggling on several fronts related to it without having to go into sexuality.

He's openly admitted to mental health issues, alcohol issues, struggling with fatherhood, struggling to decide what to do with his life after 1D, and he even said himself not being the person he wanted to be in relationships, I'd say all those probably made more of a contributory factor to his reported identity struggle, rather than any potential sexual prefence.

It's just really sad the media have decided to run with it in this context, especially for his family, who honestly seem to have tried their best all round and at the moment it just seems neverending for them.

 

[Starlight_100]

I’m surprised to see Maya participated. Her statement sounds actually quite heartfelt, she obviously very much struggled with the fact that he couldn’t stay sober.

I don’t doubt that she went through some horrific times with him, but for me one thing that niggles, is that I saw clips of where she was actively enjoying the fans turning on him and I found that hard to watch.
I may be looking at it from a different perspective, as I have been an absolute horror when in alcohol addiction (granted I never chased anyone with an axe or threw them down stairs) but those moments when you sober up and either remember, or are told how you’ve hurt those you love, are truly awful and come with the kind of anxiety I wouldn’t wish on anyone. And ironically the only way to quieten that anxiety is to drink again.

I’m NOT excusing his behaviour or saying addicts should get off Scot free because they’re struggling, that’s not what I’m saying at all. But in this Rolling Stones article, in her statement she does actually genuinely sound like she loved and hoped for him to get better (even after them splitting), and I just find it difficult to correlate that version with the one I saw clips of, revealing the stuff about zayn and sort of mocking Liam and some of the fans turning on him.

This is why so many people don't trust her. She posts videos like that and makes a book which includes fiction. I personally feel both Kate and Cheryl understood Liam's struggles more than Maya did and I do think its partly due to her age but I don't know 100% of course Liam showed difficult behaviors while in a relationship with her but I think she's gone too far, she doesn't come across as a very nice person at all to me.

 

[KINGAA]

This is why so many people don't trust her. She posts videos like that and makes a book which includes fiction. I personally feel both Kate and Cheryl understood Liam's struggles more than Maya did and I do think its partly due to her age but I don't know 100% of course Liam showed difficult behaviors while in a relationship with her but I think she's gone too far, she doesn't come across as a very nice person at all to me.

Let be honest, we don’t actually know anything about Cheryl or their relationship. I imagine it wasn’t the best dealing with essentially a deadbeat dad and having to make up excuses as to why he’s never around and why he can’t go to his house etc. Cheryl’s priority is and was Bear, not Liam.

I don’t think Liam was THAT honest about their relationship because she’s insanely private and he didn’t want to look like he was a bad or absent father.

 

[BobbyBoos]

Let be honest, we don’t actually know anything about Cheryl or their relationship. I imagine it wasn’t the best dealing with essentially a deadbeat dad and having to make up excuses as to why he’s never around and why he can’t go to his house etc. Cheryl’s priority is and was Bear, not Liam.

I don’t think Liam was THAT honest about their relationship because she’s insanely private and he didn’t want to look like he was a bad or absent father.

I remember her being very anti-drugs in the girls aloud days because of friends who had passed from that, so I can only imagine the efforts she went to avoid Bear being exposed to this.

Yeah I think Liam spoke a lot of tit to make himself look like a better father, talking about Bear’s grades in school like 7 year olds are getting graded in lessons. I found it all a bit odd acting the doting father in interviews and moving half way around the world.

I don’t think anyone who’s in a relationship with someone who has a drug problem and is actively using can understand their struggles. You can only help someone who wants to be helped. I think Maya came across mature in the Rolling Stones interview, considering everything she went through.

 

[MammaTubbs]

Cheryl hasn't referenced him for a longgg time until her tribute post. Maybe something like 2021?

Before that she did speak positively about him, but like you said, I'm sure that was for B's overall benefit rather than Liam's.

She's been around long enough to know whatever she said would still be out there somewhere when B is older, so she's not going to say anything negative about his dad in public.

I'm sure she, like all of his loved ones, wanted him well and healthy, but in her case it'd be primarily so B could have a fit, well and present father.

As said above her teenage partner passed from his addictions also, and her brother also has addiction issues, so she's got my full sympathies to have been affected to such an extent for over half her life.

I won't be too judgemental over Liam gushing about Bear, and even Cheryl, there's plenty of worse things in this world and even his own specifc situation than being overly proud of your son and his mother.

 

[Starlight_100]

Let be honest, we don’t actually know anything about Cheryl or their relationship. I imagine it wasn’t the best dealing with essentially a deadbeat dad and having to make up excuses as to why he’s never around and why he can’t go to his house etc. Cheryl’s priority is and was Bear, not Liam.

I don’t think Liam was THAT honest about their relationship because she’s insanely private and he didn’t want to look like he was a bad or absent father.

I wouldn't say he was an "Absent father" as a lot of the time absent fathers don't bother with their children after they end the relationship with the child's other parent and he did acknowledge his son and speak about him and did visit him since leaving Cheryl. I know 2 men who are absent fathers and if you didn't know them during the time they were becoming parents you wouldn't know their children even existed. One of them has two young daughters he never visits, never speaks about them, doesn't show pride in their accomplishments at school or how they are as people. They are sweet little girls but he never bothers. From what I saw Liam did want to be around Bear, but he also dealt with a lot of struggles and maybe wasn't there as much as he wanted to be (on top of that he's been honest about struggling when becoming a young dad after such a busy career with One Direction)
At the end of the day his little boy will never see his Daddy again in this life and that is very sad I just hope Bear can find some comfort in his paternal family and the music that Liam created.

 

[MammaTubbs]

There was clearly some relationship there, more than enough for him to identify and grieve over his absence.

If he never saw him, they barely spoke etc, I'm sure Cheryl wouldn't have put her 7 year old through the ordeal of a funeral, and a pretty public one at that, especially considering she had to twice leave him with other family to walk in and out without him, which was probably some behind the scenes press agreement that her, the 1 boys etc agreed to, to ensure no rat bag paps tried to get his picture at least.

Was it the relationship that they should have had? It seems not, but father and son clearly loved each other regardless.

 

[KYLIE]

Shortly after his arrival there, prosecutors now allege, Payne recruited a CasaSur employee to retrieve drugs for him. Payne also met up with Braian Paiz, a waiter at a nearby restaurant, whom he messaged at close to two in the morning on Oct. 14, according to screenshots Paiz posted to Instagram. “You around? What’s your number,” Payne asks.

“We took drugs together, but I never took drugs to him or accepted any money,” Paiz told Argentine news outlet Telefe Noticias in November. They “spent the night together,” he said. “We consumed drugs because the truth is that something intimate happened.” Later, Paiz denied having sex with Payne.

So.. he had sex with the male waiter then obviously? I think the guy just denied it as it’s in poor taste to out people after their death and serves no purpose really. He’d also likely end up harassed/doxxed

I think that articles covers and confirms a lot of stuff we speculated about.. Kate’s lifestyle funding/spending, the true extent of his addictions etc and explains why Kate is on a PR-led mission to maintain her lifestyle.

Mayas statement was fair imo. He was really awfully abusive toward her. She clearly feels shocked and saddened, but isn’t downplaying what he did / how he was to her, which I ultimately think Kate is sort of doing to try and stay in good standing with fans to keep £££ coming in from her social media channels.

 

[Basic]

It boggles my mind the amount of compassion shown to a man who has treated women so badly. Poor mental health and addiction don’t excuse poor behaviour.

 

[MammaTubbs]

It boggles my mind the amount of compassion shown to a man who has treated women so badly. Poor mental health and addiction don’t excuse poor behaviour.

It's not quite that simple though is it.

It's not a man treating women badly, it's a man treating everyone close to him badly, to the point his own father has reportedly admitted allowing him to use to stop him becoming aggressive.

If Maya who he's reportedly done all this stuff to, even after all this time when he's not even around to appreciate it, can say she doesn't fault him for his own struggles, maybe people who don't even know him can attempt a little human compassion and understanding?

Both mental health issues and addictions are illnesses, and whilst that doesn't outright excuse poor behaviour, it can help us understand it.

 

[wellingtonboots]

It's not quite that simple though is it.

It's not a man treating women badly, it's a man treating everyone close to him badly, to the point his own father has reportedly admitted allowing him to use to stop him becoming aggressive.

If Maya who he's reportedly done all this stuff to, even after all this time when he's not even around to appreciate it, can say she doesn't fault him for his own struggles, maybe people who don't even know him can attempt a little human compassion and understanding?

Both mental health issues and addictions are illnesses, and whilst that doesn't outright excuse poor behaviour, it can help us understand it.

Exactly this.
Having an alcohol/drugs addiction isn’t an excuse for acting badly, but it can make you act in ways you’d never dream of doing when sober/healthy.

Things aren’t just black and white.

 

[GrilledCheese]

I feel a bit icky even talking about this because it was Liam’s own business…but if he had questions about his sexuality I think it’s so sad that he couldn’t explore that in a safe way or even be open about it. That part of the fan base that fetishised them and obsessed about their sexuality did so much damage. It gave them no space to be anything other than heterosexual because of how crazy the fans were.

I agree. While it's not our place to say whether or not he was struggling with his sexuality (he's not here to speak for himself so RS outting him is just wrong), I think if it were true, the fans would've created an uncomfortable space for him to come out on his own terms. They obsess over the smallest details like looking at someone too long must mean you're secretly bleeping your band mate, or making a nice comment means you have a crush on someone of the opposite sex, basically anything that feeds into the shared delusion they hold.

Any member of the band coming out would have a magnifying glass held over them and every action they took in the past and present would be over analysed. If someone is struggling with their sexuality, the last thing they need is fans to create reels and stories about their situation for the sake of entertainment and conspiracy theories