J.K. Rowling #4 JK and the Goblet of Ire

CheshireLove · Dec 22, 2020

Sea said:
Hello and upfront apology for my query which maybe deemed lazy but I'm aware you posters generally know your shit about this so I don't mind asking. Has there been the same gender situation with men and prostate/testicular cancer campaigns?

Unsurprisingly the answer is no. A few occasions but nothing on a similar scale.

We've had women referred to as 'vagina owners' and 'vulva people', 'induviduals with a cervix', 'people who bleed' (by Tampax!), the 'vagina people', 'pregnant people', 'birth givers' and of course the infamous 'menstruators'.

I think perhaps the pièce de résistance for me was Sands, a stillbirth support charity, tweeting about 'the birthing parent' and 'non-birthing parent'. They later issued an apology tweet when, what a surprise, women who have lost babies were offended to not have been referred to as mothers, which they are.

Teen Vogue once ran an article on 'prostate owners' but in the same article also talked about the 'non-prostate owners'....

When a charity that is supposed to support mothers after the death of a baby won't even write the word 'mother', there's an issue there.

Glortard · Dec 22, 2020

sorenips said:
Longtime lurker and fence sitter here. Firstly - and I'm not saying this to stir up an argument - I believe trans women are women (and trans men are men etc). And I want equal rights for trans people. I'm fine with shared spaces, I think. But I'm really struggling to get my head around the constant tellings off for using the word "woman" when talking about... women's things. Birth, pregnancy. I believe men can be pregnant, in the case of trans men. So I'm pretty pro trans rights, but even I'm being told that I'm not pro trans rights enough.

I got told that "breastfeeding" should be referred to as breast/chestfeeding. I work in the pregnancy and breastfeeding world and I know how little support there is already. I don't know how to word this properly, but I feel like not calling it breastfeeding does a disservice to women. And breasts are female AND male. Men can get breast cancer.

I don't know how to articulate myself well on this (was up most of last night feeding my twins) but being told to use "they" instead of he or she really annoys me too. I'll call a trans woman "she" and a trans man "he" each and every time. I have no issue with that and never will. But things like the photos I'll add below are starting to really grate. They're from a dungaree group that I was in (and have now left). Someone posted referring to the model in the photo, who is clearly a woman as "she", and they got told to change the post to say "they". I've added the edit history of the post. I would personally be offended if I was referred to as "they". Women are still very much a marginalised group. I don't know what I'm getting at really. Just thinking out loud.

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I am a man and it’s a biological fact that men cannot get pregnant even if they work for the guardian. Saying that is not breaching anyone’s human rights it’s just shattering some people’s mental delusions.

Woman have breasts and they breastfeed which is not possible for a man to do naturally as the production of milk is triggered by hormones produced during pregnancy. Using words like chest feeding is just another example of slowly eroding woman’s rights. Whilst you are correct that in rare occasions men can get breast cancer this is due to them having a small amount of breast tissue located behind the nipple. Woman on the other hand cannot get testicular cancer as woman do not have testicles.

SqualorVictoria · Dec 22, 2020

CheshireLove said:
Unsurprisingly the answer is no. A few occasions but nothing on a similar scale.

We've had women referred to as 'vagina owners' and 'vulva people', 'induviduals with a cervix', 'people who bleed' (by Tampax!), the 'vagina people', 'pregnant people', 'birth givers' and of course the infamous 'menstruators'.

I think perhaps the pièce de résistance for me was Sands, a stillbirth support charity, tweeting about 'the birthing parent' and 'non-birthing parent'. They later issued an apology tweet when, what a surprise, women who have lost babies were offended to not have been referred to as mothers, which they are.

Teen Vogue once ran an article on 'prostate owners' but in the same article also talked about the 'non-prostate owners'....

When a charity that is supposed to support mothers after the death of a baby won't even write the word 'mother', there's an issue there.

I can't believe that didn't peak more people, it was one of the worst things I've seen.

CheshireLove · Dec 22, 2020

JK was trending again on Twitter the other day due a BBC article recognising her “Terf Wars” essay. Lots of comments about her ‘actual/literal violence” and hatred etc etc. The usual.

Annabanana40 · Dec 22, 2020

Glortard said:
I am a man and it’s a biological fact that men cannot get pregnant even if they work for the guardian. Saying that is not breaching anyone’s human rights it’s just shattering some people’s mental delusions.

Woman have breasts and they breastfeed which is not possible for a man to do naturally as the production of milk is triggered by hormones produced during pregnancy. Using words like chest feeding is just another example of slowly eroding woman’s rights. Whilst you are correct that in rare occasions men can get breast cancer this is due to them having a small amount of breast tissue located behind the nipple. Woman on the other hand cannot get testicular cancer as woman do not have testicles.

The opening sentence is my quote of 2020! Brilliant

rosemarina · Dec 22, 2020

FFS, I expected better from Bella Mackie (although not sure why).

Unfollowed.

Scotch Mist · Dec 22, 2020

rosemarina said:
FFS, I expected better from Bella Mackie (although not sure why).

Unfollowed.

Another writer who can only dream of having the success and talent of JK.
She can fuck off and stay fucked off.
I won't read any of her trash.

Milliemoo99 · Dec 22, 2020

Scotch Mist said:
Basically in my view people like Eddie and Elliot/Ellen have self esteem (and possibly mental health) issues and seem to think that they can make us all pander to them.

Why do they think that everyone else should be responsible for this? The world does not have to ignore objective reality because these people make demands. This is nothing to to with us all being 'kind and compassionate'. I would never wish harm on them, but at the same time why should I be forced to use pronouns that make no sense to me?

There is an issue with past and present facts as well.

How do you equate the fact that for 58 years of his life, Eddie Izzard was a man. If he wishes to be regarded as a woman from now on....odd...but maybe ok? but surely his past is/was should still be regarded as male?

I too cannot get my head around the fact that being male or female seems now to be about the clothes you wear!

So does this make me a woman when I go out in a dress, and a man when I go out wearing trousers? Is this what we now need to use to identify whether or not someone is male or female? Women and anyone in girl mode wears dresses and men or anyone in boy mode wears trousers?

So all the girls who go past my house to secondary school in trousers are male, and all the girls who go past the house in skirts are female?

The world has gone mad........I thought women fought in the past to get out of having to wear dresses and corsets and restrictive clothing...and fought for the right to wear traditionally male clothing, eg trousers!

SqualorVictoria · Dec 22, 2020

It's absolute nuts. Biology doesn't make you a woman, lipstick, dresses and feelings do. How did we sleep walk into this regressive nightmare?

rosemarina · Dec 22, 2020

Iran 1979 keeps popping into my head like a warning.

Sunraged · Dec 23, 2020

Glortard said:
I am a man and it’s a biological fact that men cannot get pregnant even if they work for the guardian. Saying that is not breaching anyone’s human rights it’s just shattering some people’s mental delusions.

Woman have breasts and they breastfeed which is not possible for a man to do naturally as the production of milk is triggered by hormones produced during pregnancy. Using words like chest feeding is just another example of slowly eroding woman’s rights. Whilst you are correct that in rare occasions men can get breast cancer this is due to them having a small amount of breast tissue located behind the nipple. Woman on the other hand cannot get testicular cancer as woman do not have testicles.

Thank you. I'll be saving this for another argument I'm undoubtedly going to have at some point about biological sex and menstruation.

mindlessness · Dec 23, 2020

rosemarina said:
FFS, I expected better from Bella Mackie (although not sure why).

Unfollowed.

gah! Annoyingly I have her book on running ready and waiting on my Kindle. ahh well, off to unfollow.

I skim read the article and It was a disappointing read basically villainising Rowling for not being the right kind of left-wing, as far as I can tell?

Bitofthebubbly · Dec 23, 2020

Oh so it’s fine when men write about cross dressing murderers but when a woman writes about the exact same thing there are calls for her head. The world is so incredibly pathetic right now, misogyny is everywhere I look and I’m not exactly looking for it. I’m exhausted with it all.

Flossybun · Dec 23, 2020

I love JK Rowling

Ceelea · Dec 26, 2020

Glortard said:
I am a man and it’s a biological fact that men cannot get pregnant even if they work for the guardian. Saying that is not breaching anyone’s human rights it’s just shattering some people’s mental delusions.

Woman have breasts and they breastfeed which is not possible for a man to do naturally as the production of milk is triggered by hormones produced during pregnancy. Using words like chest feeding is just another example of slowly eroding woman’s rights. Whilst you are correct that in rare occasions men can get breast cancer this is due to them having a small amount of breast tissue located behind the nipple. Woman on the other hand cannot get testicular cancer as woman do not have testicles.

Brilliantly put... Thank you, Glortard.

sheleg · Dec 27, 2020

@sorenips, you say "I believe trans women are women (and trans men are men etc)." I hope this doesn't come across as aggressive in any way, but could you explain why you believe this?

SqualorVictoria · Dec 30, 2020

2020 was the year the tide turned in the trans wars

2020 will, of course, be remembered as the year in which Covid-19 was unleashed on the world. But it is one in which another menace – gender identity ideology – was put firmly in its place, in the UK at least. Perhaps the tipping point was the deranged response to JK Rowling’s essay on sex and...

www.spectator.co.uk

The tide is turning

Zenchick101 · Dec 30, 2020

SqualorVictoria said:
2020 was the year the tide turned in the trans wars

2020 will, of course, be remembered as the year in which Covid-19 was unleashed on the world. But it is one in which another menace – gender identity ideology – was put firmly in its place, in the UK at least. Perhaps the tipping point was the deranged response to JK Rowling’s essay on sex and...

www.spectator.co.uk

The tide is turning

at least in the uk!

Very traditional · Jan 2, 2021

Eddie Izzard says she 'doesn't think J.K. Rowling is transphobic'
#

Sorry for the Fail link but worth a read!

HockyRorror · Jan 2, 2021

Very traditional said:
Eddie Izzard says she 'doesn't think J.K. Rowling is transphobic'
#

Sorry for the Fail link but worth a read!

What’s the Twitter reaction, anyone know? Is Eddie Iszard receiving death threats? (I jest, of course not..)

J.K. Rowling #4 JK and the Goblet of Ire

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