Coronavirus Disease Outbreak COVID-19 #27

[grumpycat]

Why is it the fault of the furloughed staff that the employer has cut pay for those still working?

We haven’t cut pay but due to the current climate there isn’t any overtime available, if there is, it’s minimal.

it seems morally difficult to say to my staff - hey you guys need to keep working for a lesser wage because we are trying to tick over and keep you employed incase we need to get back to full capacity ASAP whilst the furlough staff turn around to them and laughter cos they’re getting 80% average wage for staying at home.

 

[hnoz]

We haven’t cut pay but due to the current climate there isn’t any overtime available, if there is, it’s minimal.

it seems morally difficult to say to my staff - hey you guys need to keep working for a lesser wage because we are trying to tick over and keep you employed incase we need to get back to full capacity ASAP whilst the furlough staff turn around to them and laughter cos they’re getting 80% average wage for staying at home.

If you’re the one furloughing staff then why wasn’t it done on the basis of salary rather than average overtime then?
Plus if there is less work, but less staff isn’t there still the opportunity for overtime?

If you view furlough as a holiday then there are going to be issues around jealousy but the reality is many people currently furloughed will unfortunately not have a job to go back to.

 

[mummy2under2]

because business is quieter. we work in transport so they work 40hours and anything over 40hours is paid overtime - usually we are busy so they can clock up more, but because we need to tide over, so the guys who are working are taking home a couple of hours overtime at most, whereas if those who are furloughed (Which we have done as goodwill due to shielding) could take home more of average hours are paid if you see what I mean?

I have a feeling we are being too kind to offer furlough for shielding when SSP is fine for that situation

Ahhhh okay I get you.
That's such a tricky one.
Maybe you need to rethink what you have in place if it's something that's going to be carried on for a longer period.
Its great you're offering the furlough option though, just makes for difficult conversation.

I've been strict with mine, if someone's sick or isolating they get SSP, otherwise it's furlough.

 

[Platypusfattypus]

I hate the tories, really do. Yet the other day I found myself eyeing up Raab and reckoning he'd be quite good in bed. That and me actually agreeing with piers Morgan and Jeremy Hunt (ffs) has really got me wondering who I am anymore. I'm lost.

 

[grumpycat]

If you’re the one furloughing staff then why wasn’t it done on the basis of salary rather than average overtime then?
Plus if there is less work, but less staff isn’t there still the opportunity for overtime?

If you view furlough as a holiday then there are going to be issues around jealousy but the reality is many people currently furloughed will unfortunately not have a job to go back to.

oh my gosh where did I say I viewed furlough as a holiday, don’t put words in my mouth please!

I have furloughed staff where they are shielding for 12 weeks as opposed to putting them on SSP. because this is the RIGHT thing to do as you rightly picked out, SSP is not enough to live off.

I have furloughed staff on BASIC salary. this because it’s a damn site more than SSP and it’s still a good wage to live on. The issue I have is that the staff working are resentful IF the staff furloughed are able to have overtime added to their furlough wage.

I am in a situation where I have a member of furloughed staff demanding his overtime is taken into consideration for his 80% pay. I am saying I’m in a moral situation where out example say 30 drivers only 5 are furloughed. The other 25 are working as much as they can. They are working to enable our customers needs are met and to keep them employed and ticking over.

Because we have a vast amount of staff I am trying to keep employed, the overtime is spread. Usually we’d have tonnes to give out but as everyone is quite aware, not much can happen right now. The way they are paid is difficult. They were TUPE’d to us, so they have a basic salary but their pay varies week to week as they are able to pick up overtime a lot which is why I raised the question.

As a business I am doing my damned best to keep people employed, the economy in our industry moving in the small part we pay, and a lesser strain on the government.

Don’t make me out to not give a crap about my staff when I’m doing all I can to keep them all paid, and keeping them in jobs.

Ahhhh okay I get you.
That's such a tricky one.
Maybe you need to rethink what you have in place if it's something that's going to be carried on for a longer period.
Its great you're offering the furlough option though, just makes for difficult conversation.

I've been strict with mine, if someone's sick or isolating they get SSP, otherwise it's furlough.

thank you, I agree. the pay structure is so difficult (we didn’t implement it) so they get basic salaries but it’s topped up a lot by overtime

currently we are doing a 80% of that basic wage which I believe is right but we have one who is demanding more and more and it’s stressing me out, hence my comment on the gov stating that shielding employees are entitled SSP as general rule (you can furlough if you choose to)

 

[hnoz]

oh my gosh where did I say I viewed furlough as a holiday, don’t put words in my mouth please!

I have furloughed staff where they are shielding for 12 weeks as opposed to putting them on SSP. because this is the RIGHT thing to do as you rightly picked out, SSP is not enough to live off.

I have furloughed staff on BASIC salary. this because it’s a damn site more than SSP and it’s still a good wage to live on. The issue I have is that the staff working are resentful IF the staff furloughed are able to have overtime added to their furlough wage.

I am in a situation where I have a member of furloughed staff demanding his overtime is taken into consideration for his 80% pay. I am saying I’m in a moral situation where out example say 30 drivers only 5 are furloughed. The other 25 are working as much as they can. They are working to enable our customers needs are met and to keep them employed and ticking over.

Because we have a vast amount of staff I am trying to keep employed, the overtime is spread. Usually we’d have tonnes to give out but as everyone is quite aware, not much can happen right now. The way they are paid is difficult. They were TUPE’d to us, so they have a basic salary but their pay varies week to week as they are able to pick up overtime a lot which is why I raised the question.

As a business I am doing my damned best to keep people employed, the economy in our industry moving in the small part we pay, and a lesser strain on the government.

Don’t make me out to not give a crap about my staff when I’m doing all I can to keep them all paid, and keeping them in jobs.



thank you, I agree. the pay structure is so difficult (we didn’t implement it) so they get basic salaries but it’s topped up a lot by overtime

currently we are doing a 80% of that basic wage which I believe is right but we have one who is demanding more and more and it’s stressing me out, hence my comment on the gov stating that shielding employees are entitled SSP as general rule (you can furlough if you choose to)

Okay you need to relax, I never said you viewed it as a holiday, I was talking about the other employee, nor did I tell you that anything was the RIGHT thing to do. I think you're confusing comments and flipping out at me for no reason.

 

[grumpycat]

Okay you need to relax, I never said you viewed it as a holiday, I was talking about the other employees.

i apologise, the way you worded it was as if it was aimed that I viewed it. it’s a horribly stressful situation and I’m very grateful for the Furlough scheme but by gosh is it much more difficult than it’s laid out

 

[JoeBloggs]

Furlough is never going to be ideal for everyone, my husband works for a waitrose. Before furlough was introduced it was rumoured that all the JL staff would work in waitrose stores to help out. They have now all been furloughed while all the waitrose staff work. There was a bit of a disgruntled wave through the ranks as people felt that they were still working while others were staying at home being paid despite working for the 'same' company. It's a tough one and one that businesses have to make their own call on.

I for one am greatful he is still working as I have no wage coming in and his wage along can just cover our outgoings. In this climate I am just grateful he has a job and I should be going back to mine.

 

[mummy2under2]

oh my gosh where did I say I viewed furlough as a holiday, don’t put words in my mouth please!

I have furloughed staff where they are shielding for 12 weeks as opposed to putting them on SSP. because this is the RIGHT thing to do as you rightly picked out, SSP is not enough to live off.

I have furloughed staff on BASIC salary. this because it’s a damn site more than SSP and it’s still a good wage to live on. The issue I have is that the staff working are resentful IF the staff furloughed are able to have overtime added to their furlough wage.

I am in a situation where I have a member of furloughed staff demanding his overtime is taken into consideration for his 80% pay. I am saying I’m in a moral situation where out example say 30 drivers only 5 are furloughed. The other 25 are working as much as they can. They are working to enable our customers needs are met and to keep them employed and ticking over.

Because we have a vast amount of staff I am trying to keep employed, the overtime is spread. Usually we’d have tonnes to give out but as everyone is quite aware, not much can happen right now. The way they are paid is difficult. They were TUPE’d to us, so they have a basic salary but their pay varies week to week as they are able to pick up overtime a lot which is why I raised the question.

As a business I am doing my damned best to keep people employed, the economy in our industry moving in the small part we pay, and a lesser strain on the government.

Don’t make me out to not give a crap about my staff when I’m doing all I can to keep them all paid, and keeping them in jobs.



thank you, I agree. the pay structure is so difficult (we didn’t implement it) so they get basic salaries but it’s topped up a lot by overtime

currently we are doing a 80% of that basic wage which I believe is right but we have one who is demanding more and more and it’s stressing me out, hence my comment on the gov stating that shielding employees are entitled SSP as general rule (you can furlough if you choose to)

Don't take what most say on here to heart.
Most people don't have their own business and/or have no idea what it's like to make these decisions.
They can only see it from the employee point of view where they think everyone should be paid full wage for as long as needed because 'SSP isn't enough'.
As an employer... I can relate that we know SSP is bleeping tit, but we also have to do what we need to, to keep the business going and alongside advice of the government, SSP is sometimes required.

I think you need to try and push back with the difficult one as much as you can, explain in plain English that you're doing it as a gesture of good will, not because you have to.

Good luck

 

[grumpycat]

Don't take what most say on here to heart.
Most people don't have their own business and/or have no idea what it's like to make these decisions.
They can only see it from the employee point of view where they think everyone should be paid full wage for as long as needed because 'SSP isn't enough'.
As an employer... I can relate that we know SSP is bleeping tit, but we also have to do what we need to, to keep the business going and alongside advice of the government, SSP is sometimes required.

I think you need to try and push back with the difficult one as much as you can, explain in plain English that you're doing it as a gesture of good will, not because you have to.

Good luck

thank you this is what we are currently doing, I was just unsure if anyone had been in a similar situation that might be able to offer some sound advice. it’s all un chartered waters and it’s hard to know if you’re being reasonable or not when you’re in the situation

Furlough is never going to be ideal for everyone, my husband works for a waitrose. Before furlough was introduced it was rumoured that all the JL staff would work in waitrose stores to help out. They have now all been furloughed while all the waitrose staff work. There was a bit of a disgruntled wave through the ranks as people felt that they were still working while others were staying at home being paid despite working for the 'same' company. It's a tough one and one that businesses have to make their own call on.

I for one am greatful he is still working as I have no wage coming in and his wage along can just cover our outgoings. In this climate I am just grateful he has a job and I should be going back to mine.

exactly this.

we are trying to ensure all of them have jobs to come back to whilst explaining to some that we have to do what we are being asked (by shielding those who need it) and it’s a very hard situation to control that wave when the upset inevitably comes. by god do I wish the responsibility was off my shoulders!

 

[Bbbbefc9]

I do really feel for you! We used to live in a flat once and the downstairs cigarette smoke used to come up through our boiler cupboard in the hallway! I literally couldnt get rid of the smell

It’s horrendous isn’t it. Deffo moving once this is all over! X

 

[Blisfullmind]

It’s horrendous isn’t it. Deffo moving once this is all over! X

I dont blame you moving. I was glad when we moved!

 

[Suzesnooze]

i apologise, the way you worded it was as if it was aimed that I viewed it. it’s a horribly stressful situation and I’m very grateful for the Furlough scheme but by gosh is it much more difficult than it’s laid out

I think that employee of yours is being rather selfish plus it sounds like he expected you to make up the extra 20% so he was on full pay but that is at the company's discretion. My Company have had quite a few people TUPE'd over and they are always quite 'shirty' about everything. Is it possible to seek help from an HR company? Where I work, we pay a monthly fee to an HR company to help us with things like that as we don't have our own HR section as it's a small company?

I'm furloughed at the moment and very happy with my 80% but there are still staff working and earning their full pay. I can imagine some staff do think 'lucky for them not having to work and still being paid' which is what I think the poster meant that I'm off doing nothing like a 'holiday' while other staff still have to work.

 

[bubbletea123]

Well I am feeling quite relieved. I am on the depo provera birth control injection as it is the only thing that stops my endometriosis pain. My next injection is due in 3 weeks and I was worried that the Dr wouldn't see me for it. I just called and luckily they're still doing them and I got an appt booked.

 

[KateESJ]

My work's furlough is averaged out over the last 12 months for everyone on hourly- I got my payslip today and should be paid tomorrow. So mine is lower than a lot of the people I work with because they reguarly work more than I do or pick up extra shifts, I can't do that for either of my jobs due to childcare. It's annoying that mine is lower but they'd be getting more than me anyway if we were working so I can hardly be annoyed by it. I'm very grateful to be getting anything at all. I was so terrified I'd be stuck with nothing but the scheme is a life saver.

I understand that it could be disheartening for people still working seeing other people being furloughed but I'm also sure most of the furloughed staff would rather be working right now.

 

[TwooTwooTwitTwitTwoo]

Well I am feeling quite relieved. I am on the depo provera birth control injection as it is the only thing that stops my endometriosis pain. My next injection is due in 3 weeks and I was worried that the Dr wouldn't see me for it. I just called and luckily they're still doing them and I got an appt booked.

I've been seriously worried about this. My next one is due in early June and I don't think my GP is doing them. It's the only contraceptive I can take and it also helps me manage another health condition. I'm hoping by June they will be offering appointments again.

Pleased to hear you'll be able to have one though!

 

[grumpycat]

I think that employee of yours is being rather selfish plus it sounds like he expected you to make up the extra 20% so he was on full pay but that is at the company's discretion. My Company have had quite a few people TUPE'd over and they are always quite 'shirty' about everything. Is it possible to seek help from an HR company? Where I work, we pay a monthly fee to an HR company to help us with things like that as we don't have our own HR section as it's a small company?

I'm furloughed at the moment and very happy with my 80% but there are still staff working and earning their full pay. I can imagine some staff do think 'lucky for them not having to work and still being paid' which is what I think the poster meant that I'm off doing nothing like a 'holiday' while other staff still have to work.

I agree! I’m glad you are happy with your situation. Absolutely everyone else is apart from one.
we have an accountant who deals with most things but we kind of blur the line into employment law so as far as our accountant is concerned, we are doing what is right as if he had zero work he’d still get paid 40 hours for sitting in the yard if you see what I mean, because that’s what their contract states is their base pay.

it’s so easy to think the grass is greener on the other side! Those working resent those furloughed as they think it’s a free holiday and those furloughed are resentful of those working because they’re not climbing the walls and able to have a change of scenery.

there is no perfect scenario for anyone is there?
As I think @50sGirl poster earlier, ‘we are all in the same storm, but not in the same boat’

 

[Suzesnooze]

Rishi is speaking in the House of Commons and offering more 'freebies'!

A micro loan scheme for businesses to apply for 'bounce back loan's' and the government will pay the interest for the first 12 months.

 

[50sGirl]

“Chris Whitty will you please sign my Chris Whitty Appreciation mug and tea towel please?”

You have a tea towel too? I’m surprised you've not had it made into a pair of knickers!

 

[coconochanel]

Who knows

Groundhog day thats what!