Constance Marten and Mark Gordon #6

[KatieMorag]

She had no need to be homeless whatsoever. As a mother with a newborn (or about to have a newborn) she would have been offered safe (indoor!) housing. 100%. She chose her 'freedom' and lifestyle over her child, much as she did when she refused to take a covid test or wear a mask to be with her baby in hospital. She's a spoilt, entitled brat who won't be told no.

 

[Allmyownopinion]

In her police interview, Marten said she "didn't know what to do".

She said: "I’ve been debating whether to hand myself in, which I wish I did earlier but the whole media presence and everything is kind of terrifying a little bit. And also I kept the body because I wanted to have, wanted to have an autopsy done, I didn’t bury her because wanted her to have a proper burial but I couldn’t get a proper burial until I had an autopsy and obviously, yeah.

"So I’ve been carrying her around not knowing what to do really. I didn’t want to bury her in a forest, some random place, because I wanted her to have a proper burial."

This statement makes me so angry!!! It’s blatant lies. She’s seen first hand that her child is decomposing before her eyes, therefore knows full well an autopsy is pointless! She kept her body because she wanted to hide how she died. She referred to her child’s body as evidence ffs, she’s a very cunning woman who is well aware she killed her child & has done her very best to hide the evidence so it can never be proved she did so. Which is exactly what is happening now!

 

[KatieMorag]

Her baby dies and she's immediately thinking how to protect him. She only cares about him - it's disgusting.

I also think those 'anti SS' Facebook groups need to realise they are part of the reason this poor baby girl died. Their anti-authority lying bullshit has egged on this situation. Hope they're ashamed of themselves - but knowing the type that frequents these groups, they don't have the insight or emotional intelligence to realise what they've done.

 

[gimmethattea]

I have co slept with all 3 of my children and currently still do with my youngest, it wasn't always exactly to the safe sleep guidelines, but most the time we followed them.
Me and my partner don't drink, smoke or do drugs either and if any of us had had alcohol, we wouldn't sleep in the bed.

I know not everyone agrees with co sleeping and that's fine. I know people worry about the safety, but like a previous poster has said, if we didn't cosleep, we wouldn't have slept and I think I may have gone insane from sleep deprivation.

I have also taken children 1 camping (not younger than 5 months though) and have made sure they had enough layers to keep them warm, had sterilising tablets for the bottles, plenty of nappies and wipes, loads of extra clothes etc... It can be hard, but it can be done.

But there is no way I would have camped with a baby less than a month old. Those first few weeks are exhausting and I couldn't imagine anything worse than dealing with the recovery, the bleeding, caring for a newborn in those conditions.


I found their interviews weird. I can't quite put my finger on it, but it almost feels like they are making this whole ordeal to be like some fairytale love story and it just makes me feel quite ill, because we all know it's not.

 

[pommobear]

I totally believe her family are crap and her childhood was crap. Being rich doesn't mean your family know how to care for your emotional needs.

 

[MmmB777]

I’m sure I’m in the minority but after reading that.. imo I find it more likely that she got the idea to say baby died on her chest from these conversations with SS than it by chance happening despite her saying she knew and understood the risk previously. I still think it’s much more likely baby succumbed to inhabitable conditions and got hypothermia which I don’t think would take long for such a small baby being carted round outside in a baby grow. They would have had plenty of opportunities to act and save her. They were determined to live this type of lifestyle no matter what. I think they think the dying on her chest thing sounds better and more “accidental”.

 

[sebanna]

This makes it clear MG’s conviction wasn’t seen as a problem then - both parents refused a residential unit. So he was offered one or he couldn’t have refused.

While the defence makes out that CM and MG were prepared to do anything to keep their family together, the fact that they wouldn't do a covid test or accept a residential placement suggests that's not the case.

 

[Asterix]

Even when they had months to prepare, they couldn't assemble a baby 'kit' any better than a 14 year old would. No car seat, a snow suit that was way too big, no travel cot. They had 30 phones but not 30 cheap sleepsuits for changing a newborn living on the road. They were unfit to parent and didn't even seem to want to try.

 

[SELdnGal]

If she's found guilty what does that mean for cosleeping? If you're cosleeping with your child and they die are you neglectful? Because that doesn't seem right.
Even though I know the reason they were cosleeping is to keep her warm because they were living in a tent ... I dunno I'm starting to doubt that she will be found guilty.
Like it's neglectful to live in a tent but it's not neglectful to try and keep your baby warm. I get it, shouldn't have been living in a tent but if you are isn't the best thing to try and keep warm. Araghhh this case has got me swinging like a pendulum.

But she wasn't co-sleeping, was she? From her interview it sounds like she was sitting on the floor of the tent upright with her baby in her jacket and she suffocated her.

That's very different to lying in a bed cosleeping. But there were SO many factors that made what they did neglectful. She was a newborn baby, in a TENT, in minus temperatures, with nothing to actually sleep inside. It doesn't even sound like they had a baby carrier that she was placed in. They were already travelling around with her ina car, without a car seat, which is neglectful. She'd had no medical care. They have no idea if she potentially had anything underlying that might make her more susceptible to SIDs.

But it wasn't SIDs, her death was entirely foreseeable. If she hadnt died that night, she would eventually have passed away - they had very little food and supplies. There were SO many ways she could have died because of their carelessness - a car crash, from the cold, starvation...the list is almost endless.


This case won't have any reflection on cosleeping families - cosleeping families usually mitigate the risks. They seemed to exacerbate the risks.

But honestly, I just don't get WHY. They had the means to really care for her. And it was clear even before the car set on fire they weren't doing that.

 

[jammybee]

You know I object to this “cremation” word. It’s setting the body on fire - sorry. We don’t say any other killers cremated the bodies of their victims. I don’t know why we’re sanitising it really, CM called it cremating to minimize how horrendous it sounded. Just glad she didn’t go through with it. Although carrying the remains around in a lidl bag is no better I guess.
Not specifically aimed at anyone just us in general. It was bugging me

 

[willowxxxx]

In the daily Mail podcast it was reported she said one of the reasons she pretended to be an Irish traveller is because she thought she would be more likely to get a council house.
She would unlikely qualify for a council house herself as they would look at her bank statements and see she has the means to secure and pay for her own housing. I know we are focusing on her getting the regular 2.5k monthly income from the trust fund but she did get nearly 50k in the month just before she went missing seems she can just request large amounts of money when ever she wants.
Why is this privileged, educated, financially stable woman pretending to be a Irish traveller to get a council house?
I'm coming to the conclusion this is all just one big game and act of rebellion towards her family and she loves the taboo of living like a "commoner" In her eyes. And would probably love the thrill of a Private investigator reporting back to her aristocratic family she's living on an estate somewhere.
It just shows as well how out of touch she is if she thinks it's just that easy to get a council house. The waiting list is 8 years long where I live ... also as some one who definitely does not come from such privilege and has been in a position where I really have had to seek help to keep a roof over my head I just think what an entitled little madam trying to scam the system and take a home off someone who actually needs it.
It's like she enjoyed giving the impression of being poor and disadvantaged. But obviously not enough to you know be it for real and give up her trust fund!

 

[AManWalksDownTheStreet]

I have Pulp’s Common People running through my head while reading this thread now…

 

[Hyacinthsquash]

I just can’t fathom why they put rubbish on top of her in the bag. I can maybe understand the reason for the soil.. but empty cans etc.. awful.

 

[MmmB777]

There’s co-sleeping and there’s co-sleeping.
If you’re off your face on drink or drugs while co-sleeping that’s an obvious aggravating factor. Likewise if you’re in a tent at -4.3 degrees.
I’m not really buying her story, especially as MG has said they were thinking of handing the baby in the day before they say she died.

I think both of them sound like they’re completely bullshitting to be honest. Umm arrrr you’ll have to ask him ummm he might tell you something different…some of the way she describes things is just totally not how a grieving person would imo. Calling her “it”, describing pouring petrol on her as a cremation one minute and calling it hiding the evidence the next. I don’t see love anywhere.

They had obviously discussed and agreed to not disclose anything, again not really the behaviour of innocent people. “Be good” but she broke the pact didn’t she once the body was found because she was scared Daddy Dickhead would get the blame. I do find it interesting where Cuntstance’s word is taken as gospel (such as her parents investigating her) but we hear her lie so often- baby was so well provided for in her flimsy baby grow lobbed in an inappropriate buggy etc etc. She’s not truthful and that should speak volumes.

Baby was zipped up in that coat because she had no hat as we know. She would have been absolutely freezing even in a mild winter. I read today about a man that died outside in October, hypothermia and his organs just shut down. She was heard screaming on many occasions. Several strangers had more concern for that baby than her own parents. They watched her be uncomfortable, upset, cold and did nothing. I still think it was more important to them to be together and not get caught than whether their baby died or not.

 

[Tofino]

If my child was on trial for anything I would absolutely attend in person to hear it for myself. I would never stop loving my child (that’s what unconditional love means) but it would not mean I think they are innocent and would blindly support them no matter what they had done.

 

[HotesTilaire]

A headstrong woman who is no shrinking violet is always wheeled out as a reason why she can’t have been abused
Anyone can be taken in by an organisation that is designed to take people in. Anyone can end up in an abusive relationship. Anyone can fall victim.
Especially a poor little rich girl seeking meaning in life, love and acceptance. And one dealing with metal health problems.

 

[iieee]

All 4 kids removed in January 2022 then she's pregnant again with Victoria within months of this. They just didn't care and had no interest in listening to any advice.

The description of the children being upset is heartbreaking and mirrors cases I know. Claim to love their children but can't be bothered to show up to see them.

They were warned repeatedly that their lifestyle could lead to the death of their child, and now that it has, they want to blame the death on the people that tried to stop them. I am speechless.

 

[gimmethattea]

It will be interesting, if the details of why CM and MG were deemed unfit to parent, comes out. In the podcast CM makes out it was all due to her falling out of the window, but it looked like it took two years between the children first being taken and put up for adoption. CM said in the police interview that she feels her children were taken unlawfully and she feels angry at the way the media were used to hunt them down. Nowhere in the interview does she say she regrets not handing Victoria to social services.

Without full on outing myself, I have reported people I know to social services. The person I reported would regularly be in an on and off relationship with her boyfriend, who when they split, she would explain the abuse he put her through on social media. This relationship has been going on for years. God knows what else was happening that they weren't sharing online.

I had screenshots of every single post when I reported them and I reported it when they reconciled. Apparently, I wasn't the only one as they uploaded a few posts talking about working with social services, them saying how she was an amazing mum etc...

Despite everything that has happened and all the abuse, her kids are still living with them.

Social Services wouldn't have removed her children based on that incident alone. There must be a lot more that we don't know and may never know in order to protect those children.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

Friends and family I think

One here from a friend https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...missing-aristocrat-mark-gordon-b2279865.html#

And one from her dad (not sure he’s reliable!) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/napier-marten-statement-constance-b2281272.html

This is going to sound harsh and I’m sorry, definitely don’t want to incite war on my fav tattle thread lol:

This is where I think her social class/privilege is really pertinent. Because sorry but that article is just ridiculous, but because she’s rich and white and pretty her victimhood is held up by friends & media. If this was a working class woman she’d just be written off as a crackhead doing crackhead things - just no way would you have media outlets bending over backwards to excuse her/prefab a line of defence.

Also sorry but eating some bloke’s left overs is top line on the cult’s alleged abuse of her? Give me strength!

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

This 100% this! Tears in my eyes- this!!!
I spend my working life supporting over tired stressed new parents and I will recommend co-sleeping safely to nearly all of them and I won't stop!

I’m really grateful for all the sensible pro co sleeping comments on this thread (also, your job sounds fab and like something I would have benefitted from in the professionals I contacted as a pregnant then new mum!!).

The global majority safely co sleep with their children, it’s only a very modern phenomena where parents sleep separately from newborns or infants. CM and MG wouldn’t even be a footnote in cosleeping’s story because they were not practicing it, behind a cut as it’s grim but from initial accounts/attitudes it appears to me as if they were just stuffing a baby’s body into whichever piece of clothing or lidl bag for life concealed her with no consideration for what her needs (sleep or otherwise) were