Train strikes

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Folkevermore

Folkevermore

IngressUK said:
Why are the public being angry with the wrong people?

The TSSA and ASLEF have both settled and agreed with the latest offer made. It is only RMT who hasn't.

It is now at the stage where your losses from days off through strikes will not be made up with a pay increase.

Why is you think you are entitled to more than everyone else? Most people in the real world will not be getting anywhere near the rise even the TSSA and ASLEF have settled on. So why do the RMT think they are entitled to even more?

Carry on and well likely see 'Beeching II' on the railways. In which some routes and services will be cut. In addition, the passenger numbers are not what they once were - further strengthening any case for cuts. Redundancies will then be compulsory and the RMT won't be able to do a damn thing about it.

I'll also add that there are some truly rude people who work on the railways. If you don't like dealing with the public, then don't work in a job that puts you in contact with them.

I have been nothing but polite and friendly in my dealings with railway staff, however that is not always reciprocal.
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I think you’re under the impression that I’m an RMT member or that I’m in a role that comes under RMT - I’m not.

People are happy with the payrise being offered. You keep mentioning the pay but that’s not this main issue at hand and it’s not why the deals are being rejected.
Some of the changes to T&Cs are ridiculous. Yes TSSA have accepted deals (I don’t actually think ASLEF have but train drivers are a different kettle of fish anyway and I think they get pandered to a lot by rail companies) and the changes were minor compared to what they’re proposing for RMT members.

Also TSSA where I worked previously settled on a 4% payrise for us which is actually way below the country average for 2022 (6.4%) and our first payrise in over three years. I left my old role because the salary no longer was enough to cover basic living expenses. When you look at the level of inflation over the last few years my filing job when I left uni was actually better paid in comparison than the pay for the complex work I was doing

As with all industries you have people who are good at and bad at their jobs, but it’s hardly fair to say “someone was rude to me a few times so duck them”.
 
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CrackingOwlSanctuary

CrackingOwlSanctuary

ASLEF definitely havent accepted a deal. TSSA haven't accepted either, they have just put the vote out to members today with no advice on whether to accept or decline. Also odd there is always this line about 'people in the real world won't get anywhere near the pay rise the railway are asking for'. 5% backpaid to April 2022 and 4% from April 2023 contingent on conditions being met. My partner works in a non unionised workplace and has had a payrise a substantial bonus every year despite that industry being affected by the down turn. The railway havent had a pay rise in nearly four years now I think? There are plenty of unionised workplaces in other UK industries that have already been offered and accepted far higher pay rises with no strings. Luton Airport workers got a backdated pay rise of 28%! Liverpool dockers got 18%! No-one on the railway is asking for that.

They are asking for a pay rise that at least brings their wages in line with what they were in real terms in 2019, or at least close to that. Beeching II? I know for a fact that despite the headlines about passenger numbers they are actually near to pre pandemic levels, as is retail profit. Remember, the government tells you the railway is not fit for purpose and no-one uses it, then claims strike days cost the economy a fortune. How does that work if no-one is using the trains? The head of the restuarant and hoteliers association was on the radio last strike day saying he estimated the strikes had cost his industry billions. Again, how is that if no-one uses the trains?

I'm like a broken record here but it seems the government messaging has been so strong people are unable to see past it:

The railway unions aren't rejecting the government pay offers because they want more money, they are rejecting them because of the attached conditions.

The first round of pay negotiations by all accounts the RMT thought they were getting somewhere, and then at the last minute the government slipped in Driver Only Operation as a condition! Why would a union that is majority non drivers accept an offer that effectively did away with their jobs? The same for booking offices closing, the elderly and vulnerable will suffer when there is only an electronic ticket machine available to help them at the station. Why would booking office staff vote yes to a pay rise that essentially gets rid of their job?
 
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PinkandTwinkly

PinkandTwinkly

CrackingOwlSanctuary said:
The railway havent had a pay rise in nearly four years now I think? There are plenty of unionised workplaces in other UK industries that have already been offered and accepted far higher pay rises with no strings.
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Yep July 2019 was last raise so 3.5 years

5% for 22 (with backdated pay) and 4% for 23 raise (comes July )
Works out a 9.2 over the 2 years (on my 40k) which it's below the inflation rise in that time

Im happy ours has been agreed, but it's still below inflation and comes with some "restructuring" to pay for it
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And before anyone says they'd be happy with 40k, remember it's not for a nice 37hr a week 9-5 Monday to Friday day role.

We work 364 days a year, 264 days a year, on a rolling roster covering 24 hrs a day
Salaried so not OT, or unsociable hrs pay. (I was lucky with seven nights boxing day to 2nd Jan this year
 
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Nannycaff54

Nannycaff54

I’m really confused. The RMT have said they have called next Thursdays strike off but articles are saying that there are still strikes in 14 regions. Does anyone know if there will be any Southern network trains on that day please or does it mean another day of no travel
 
Nannycaff54

Nannycaff54

PinkandTwinkly said:
RMT have called off the Network Rail strikes they have not called off the strike action for the Train Operating Company employed staff so with Southern/GTR there will be disruption as OBS, Grds, Platform staff etc will all be on strike still.
Whilst It shouldn't be as disruptive as with signal staff on strike, it's been very short notice so I expect a very reduced service still. The advise on the website is still not to travel for the four days
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Thank you so much PinkandTwinkly for making it clearer for me. x
 
CrackingOwlSanctuary

CrackingOwlSanctuary

There is no way a plan could be reverted at such short notice from the Network Rail strike suspensions. The crew are still on strike those dates.
 
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Folkevermore

Folkevermore

conrea37 said:
Where did you move to? We’re not big fans of planners where I work 😅
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I’m still a planner, but working on the development of the future timetable possibilities for a huge railway infrastructure project… you can probably guess which 🤣
It’s far more interesting
 
CrackingOwlSanctuary

CrackingOwlSanctuary

Folkevermore said:
I’m still a planner, but working on the development of the future timetable possibilities for a huge railway infrastructure project… you can probably guess which 🤣
It’s far more interesting
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Does it rhyme with IVU? ;) Because that 'clever' system could scupper reverting stuff for next week's SX plan :rolleyes:
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gossipgirlxxo said:
What do we think this means? Hope for the near future?? 🤞🏻
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My reliable source thinks they have rejigged the offer to start as 5% rise backpaid to April 22 no strings because they think people will just vote for the cash like TSSA did.
 
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PinkandTwinkly

PinkandTwinkly

CrackingOwlSanctuary said:
Does it rhyme with IVU? ;) Because that 'clever' system could scupper reverting stuff for next week's SX plan :rolleyes:
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My reliable source thinks they have rejigged the offer to start as 5% rise backpaid to April 22 no strings because they think people will just vote for the cash like TSSA did.
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Looks like it.

My understanding is 5% or 1750, with no agreement to accept any changes at this time.

Then stage two will be each TOC negotiationing with workforce /company council about their specific changes rather than an an national agreement.

Which makes a lot my sense as each TOC is different in the changes. For example the Grds grade at my TOC have already sold a lot of their T&Cs in previous pay deals (as are still in a current pay deal)

I think RMT have said a "pause" rather than a end or resolution
They'll still re ballot for strike action tho im sure .
 
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Lonette

Lonette

I haven't travelled anywhere for three years and the rail strikes are a lot to do with that.

I was fine with not travelling during the various lockdowns as I don't do it much anyway but now things are supposedly bad to normal and it's still far harder than it should be to travel by rail because of the strikes, I do find msyelf getting very angry and resentful at those responsible. They earn a lot more than most people but any time they feel the slightest bit disgruntled, they have a fit and hold the country to ransom. I theory I fully support people striking to maintain a safe workplace and fair pay but I think many have just got too greedy and demanding now.
 
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Folkevermore

Folkevermore

Lonette said:
I haven't travelled anywhere for three years and the rail strikes are a lot to do with that.

I was fine with not travelling during the various lockdowns as I don't do it much anyway but now things are supposedly bad to normal and it's still far harder than it should be to travel by rail because of the strikes, I do find msyelf getting very angry and resentful at those responsible. They earn a lot more than most people but any time they feel the slightest bit disgruntled, they have a fit and hold the country to ransom. I theory I fully support people striking to maintain a safe workplace and fair pay but I think many have just got too greedy and demanding now.
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For the ASLEF strikes I get why your angry - train drivers earn a lot and are very privileged. Please don’t feel that way about RMT staff though - I know a lot of people who are in the RMT union and earn less than 25k in London
 
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Lonette

Lonette

Folkevermore said:
For the ASLEF strikes I get why your angry - train drivers earn a lot and are very privileged. Please don’t feel that way about RMT staff though - I know a lot of people who are in the RMT union and earn less than 25k in London
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Thanks, the distinction is important and I agree entirely.

The extremely well-paid already drivers are the bad guys here.
 
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