I was just thinking this as well after hearing it on the podcast!
so she took the blood at 5am and made it seem like it was getting back to normal and then the other nurse didn’t take the bloods again for 3 hours basing off LL’s result…
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so she took the blood at 5am and made it seem like it was getting back to normal and then the other nurse didn’t take the bloods again for 3 hours basing off LL’s result…
The hospital did initiate an investigation at the time but the scope only extended to accidental wrong patient administration etc, it did not cover foul play.
I know in hindsight we can say, well why the hell not, but they couldn’t have considered there might be a murderer among the staff.
@slingo16 Testing blood sugar levels and insulin levels are two very separate tests. Blood sugar levels only indicate that something is going on and a patient needs to be treated accordingly, ie, either through synthetic insulin or dextrose. There is no way the hospital would have known had they not requested the Insulin/c -peptide levels as this is not routinely done.
Moreover, had baby F passed away from hypoglycaemia, before they managed to intervene, they would have assumed from the readings that it was due to naturally occurring hypoglycaemia. Equally, If they didn’t investigate after or view it as suspicious at the time, it is likely the bloods taken to test their blood sugar would have been long gone!
Also they may not have known how to interpret the results or even understand them. They only know now that baby F was poisoned with synthetic insulin after a specialist has looked into the case. They did not know at the time.
Moreover, had baby F passed away from hypoglycaemia, before they managed to intervene, they would have assumed from the readings that it was due to naturally occurring hypoglycaemia. Equally, If they didn’t investigate after or view it as suspicious at the time, it is likely the bloods taken to test their blood sugar would have been long gone!
Also they may not have known how to interpret the results or even understand them. They only know now that baby F was poisoned with synthetic insulin after a specialist has looked into the case. They did not know at the time.
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It’s a lot to get your head around. It’s truly horrific when you are faced with the fact somebody did this. However, the more we hear the more damning it is.
In the beginning I was very open minded. She could have been set up, it could be a huge cover up, she could be the fall guy, who knows? But those thoughts have gone now and I can only know from what I am reading and hearing I can’t really see how this is just all unfortunate, unless she’s really being set up. But why?
Yes, she looks normal. She looks friendly, she looks very average. You would not think she could hurt a fly is you met her as a nurse.
But sadly she is not the first and won’t be the last.
There are plenty of serial killers who are were well liked, good looking, considered charming and even held down jobs and perfectly normal lives on the surface. But human beings are complicated, and the the most part as you’ve said most people could never get past the ‘thought’ of doing something so heinous. Most people will think it, but will never do it.
We know nothing about her background. Her life, her childhood, how she related to other people, a few Facebook pictures rarely tell the story.
I will never say whether I think she did it or not. All I can think is to my mind the evidence so far is damning.
I’m sure profilers and criminology know what to look for in terms of patterns, even her texts. They will see things we don’t.
It’s definitely a complete head f***k
When are we gonna get to hear about her background / childhood, if at all? Also will any psychiatric reports coming? (If anyone knows?)
Dbbdsbm
Why did they do the test in this case? I can’t remember
You say they don’t often test insulin and c peptide levels,
Why did they do the test in this case? I can’t remember
There’s a great wiki at the top of the thread. The pink button.
Also, someone usually posts the link to the Chester Standard live updates, if they’re happening.
Maybe in the defence’s case? Not sure about psychiatric reports.
I don't think I've ever entirely understood what this means tbh.
Google tells me unless they are certain of guilt from the evidence given a jury have to find a defendant not guilty.
What does reasonable doubt versus doubt actually really mean, in basic terms?
I can’t be 100 percent sure but If I was to hazard a guess, it was because of how baby F was responding to treatment (or wasn’t) and the length of time of the hypoglycaemia 17 hours!. Luckily, he survived, and by the time the test came back he was okay and went home not long after. They were advised to look into this further and send it for further testing, but they didn’t. I guess this isn’t ideal, but because he was okay they moved on.
And what you need to remember is this test was only requested after baby F had been poisoned for around 15 hours and not long before he recovered! What if he had passed away before this ? Within those 15hours ? They wouldn’t have known.
I’d be interested to know that. But she’s obviously been deemed fit to stand trial, there doesn’t seem to be any diminished responsibility in regards to her mental health otherwise this would have been bought up ? I could be wrong - anybody legal clarify?
Because they couldn’t understand why Baby F’s blood sugars were remaining constantly low when he was being given frequent dextrose boluses, and continuous sugars, to counteract this. They were probably looking for a rare natural cause.
It’s a specialist test and the results didn’t come back for a week.
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The judge will give them very thorough instructions during his summing up as to how the jury can reach their verdicts. The multiple charges need to be judged separately.
Common sense also needs to be applied.
Common sense also needs to be applied.
When a baby is showing signs of being unwell nearing crashes or is having crashes and isn't responding to the usual treatment, further tests outside the normal scope will be run. Which is why they'll of began looking a c-peptide, insulin and other things for this baby
And also the prosecution are saying she falsified the notes round 5am to make the blood sugar levels look much higher than they actually were
. And I think docmum explained that although the blood sugars would be regularly checked, checking insulin is a specialised test that has to be sent away. So she was right in thinking they wouldn’t know about the insulin in the blood until much much later. And I agree she thought she would have killed F, and therefore it would have been impossible to know about the insulin, luckily for his family and the trial he survived
So the lack of smoking gun evidence could be a doubt, but because the evidence shows x,y & z have absolutely happened and a,b&c puts her at the scene then they can find her guilty based on that?
The thing about BM discrediting every single witness is, at what point do you believe that it is just him discrediting rather than what they’re saying being incorrect? As in if he only discredited one or two experts, you would maybe agree that some of what they’re saying isn’t quite correct, but when he’s doing the same with every single one of them, who are all highly esteemed top fellas in their respective fields, it just makes the discrediting look weaker to me
More tell take signs of a true psychopath
Had the insulin poisoning worked like she thought it would, it would have been untraceable. With air there’s some left in vessels as we’ve seen on X-rays, plus the skin discolouration. Interestingly the next time she uses insulin she uses a much higher dose. We are going to hear about a different method again next for G, I believe she’s using crueler methods, not just to go undetected, but due to her also becoming more sadistic
Is that the reason that’s been given or is that just what you think has happened? I’ve had a few similar replies to this question, what rare natural causes could they have been looking for? Is it not possible they suspected foul play? given the “bad run”
That's the reason
They had to send the test off to be measured by specialist equipment not every hospital has.
Foul play or not, if it occurred even now on any adult or neonatal unit the bloods would be sent off for specialist testing.
You're always going to suspect foul play last, even when your workplace has had a bad run.
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