Lucy Letby Case #14

[MmmB777]

Do we think court finished early again? Can’t see any updates since middayish?

 

[candyland_]

Absolutely. And staggeringly it’s not just her shift correlating- on an extremely large amount of these charges she was there giving an intervention just before or she is found on her own with the victim (again a theme of these crimes). There are some horrifying examples of this as we go on. She is found in the dark with a baby just standing there letting the baby desaturate. There is a baby that is heavily sedated (extremely unlike to have pulled own breathing equipment out) and she is found with the baby on her own while it desaturates with its breathing tubes having been pulled out, standing there doing nothing. It’s too much. Way, way too much you have to explain away in each scenario and then there are two concrete poisonings. It fits completely and she can not be this unlucky.

There was also a monitor found to be switched off.

And this week there was a nurse that gave evidence saying that she heard an alarm go off for an unknown baby and LL told her off for seeking help. Was she going to stand there and just watch the baby desaturate?

I think she had been harming babies in very small ways that went unnoticed and she’s built up to what we’ve been hearing over the past month.

 

[Allmyownopinion]

Sorry to ask in the middle of debate but I’ve missed a whole thread, came back late to this & need to ask what the “fella” references are as feel like I’m missing something big, it’s on nearly every comment

 

[dual2099]

He was well-loved around the community as far as I'm aware, he was my Grandma's doctor and even after it all came out she still never said a bad word against him. I suppose people never want to assume the worst of someone.

Yes, I heard this. A well respected doctor. So it just tells you , you simply cannot tell.

 

[Tofino]

Fellas, as I was looking at wiki for something else, I happened to see this. It explains I think why there was some confusion yesterday in the reporting about who actually was the designated nurse for baby D, it was LL but only until 10.45pm when another nurse became the designated nurse for D

I read that as being for the mystery baby with the unconfirmed location and not baby D?

I meant to post this last night but Caroline Oakley confirmed she was designated nurse.

She confirms she had direct involvement with Child D on the night shift from June 21-22, and was her designated nurse during that shift.

 

[just_nicole]

Fellas, as I was looking at wiki for something else, I happened to see this. It explains I think why there was some confusion yesterday in the reporting about who actually was the designated nurse for baby D, it was LL but only until 10.45pm, then different nurse became the designated nurse for D

That was for a 3rd baby who's location was unconfirmed, LL was designated nurse for 2 babies in room 1 (Not Child D) and a third in an unknown room, sorry fella not intended to shoot you down on it, just know it's confusing

 

[OldBlondie]

I read that as being for the mystery baby with the unconfirmed location and not baby D?

I meant to post this last night but Caroline Oakley confirmed she was designated nurse.

She confirms she had direct involvement with Child D on the night shift from June 21-22, and was her designated nurse during that shift.

I’ve deleted my post, you’re totally right thanks for spotting that so quickly. Ah so it was CO that was definitely the designated nurse. It was only really the Faily Mail that seemed to be posting conflicting bits, all other reports matched. Thanks again Fella

 

[PenelopeTitsDrop]

Sorry to ask in the middle of debate but I’ve missed a whole thread, came back late to this & need to ask what the “fella” references are as feel like I’m missing something big, it’s on nearly every comment

It's a long story based on someone saying somebody was "not a nice fella" all indignantly. It made everyone chuckle. As we are all nice fellas on here, fella is used to indicate we may disagree with each other but we still like each other. Ok, fella?

 

[OldBlondie]

That was for a 3rd baby who's location was unconfirmed, LL was designated nurse for 2 babies in room 1 (Not Child D) and a third in an unknown room, sorry fella not intended to shoot you down on it, just know it's confusing

thanks Fella, realised and deleted

 

[PenelopeTitsDrop]

That was for a 3rd baby who's location was unconfirmed, LL was designated nurse for 2 babies in room 1 (Not Child D) and a third in an unknown room, sorry fella not intended to shoot you down on it, just know it's confusing

How can the location be unconfirmed, that blows my mind that they didn't know. Gives me visions of the baby out the back having a fag, dragging its incubator into the smoking shelter with it!

 

[Hannah_204]

I think it's also important to remember that the way someone behaves/acts is not evidence. I feel the jury will struggle to fully grasp this. I agree that on the actual evidence reported in the media so far, it doesn't meet the legal standard for guilty verdicts.

I find it interesting that according to what we have read so far, that it wasn't always the sickest babies that were targetted - or that's what we are to believe if she is guilty. I also don't understand why some babies are said to be attacked multiple times until they die, and others whilst attacked multiple times aren't. To me, this makes no sense whatsoever if she is guilty.

Also (and I fully admit I am struggling to keep each baby and circumstances straight in my mind) if baby B was still in the unit having survived an "attack", and the same time as baby C & D were in there, I don't understand why a cold hearted killer would "allow" him/her to live and not "attack" him/her (baby B) again? Why move on to other babies? I may be remembering wrongly, but at the time one of the other babies (C or D) was being "attacked" wasn't baby B in the same room as LL? In fact wasn't she baby B's designated nurse?

Child D's mother being left 60 hours after waters broke is also a massive red flag. If you have read the Ockendon Report then you will see why. In fact it might be useful to people here to read that report to gain insight into what happens to women and babies when antenatal and postnatal care is not up to standard. It seems to me that the evidence is there that this little one may not have made it in any event. The description of the birth and time shortly afterwards is horrific and the Dr appears to admit this and recognise it.

With my legal hat on, I think it is significant that one of the murder charges was dropped as the prosecution had no evidence. I am also still very interested in hearing how many "collapses" and deaths there were in the same time period that she was not on shift for. What are the details of these other incidents that were included in the numbers but aren't making up the case against her.

Based on the evidence we’ve heard so far I think she chose her victims based on the parents.
I think then in came down to opportunity. So she created the opportunity in some situations by changing rooms etc sometimes she went where she shouldn’t.
I think with attempts sometimes she got the opportunity to try again but I can imagine baby b had a lot of people looking out for them after baby a was lost and near miss with baby b.

 

[OldBlondie]

BBC round up from today https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-63569131

*edited to add not very much new info, so wondering if today was a very short day in court with only one witness, and that’s why no mark or any other live reporting other than Mersey hack

 

[just_nicole]

How can the location be unconfirmed, that blows my mind that they didn't know. Gives me visions of the baby out the back having a fag, dragging its incubator into the smoking shelter with it!

Yeah I know, I thought the similar but you worded it much better then I ever could apparently it happens when babies are moving between rooms ect

 

[freaknasty]

Glad I wasn’t sat refreshing today fellas, almost nothing happened!

 

[Cheddar Chalpupa]

I think the clusters in Facebook searches are interesting, where she’s searched for 3 sets of parents in a row.

For example, on the 5th October she searched for the parents of baby I, twins E and F, and then baby H. All in quick succession. Why?

Baby I did not die until 23rd October (there had been one attempt before the mentioned search), and baby H survived (2 attempts in Sept) So why is she searching them all at the same time? If she’s innocent, why does it appear that in her mind, there is a link between them?

This was before suspicions were raised and she was moved to day shifts. So I don’t see why an innocent person would link these 3 families at this point.

I thought about this a couple of weeks ago, i've just gone back and found my post because I couldn't remember how on the surface there is nothing in common between them, so it was:

1) a baby she directly looked after that died.
2) a baby she was not directly looking after who died.
3) a baby she was not directly looking after who did not die.

Maybe you could say 1&2 have in common that they died on the same ward, but why does the 3rd baby connect to the others in her mind. (well, I know why I think they connect, because I think she is guilty)

Lucy Letby Case #2

I wouldn't say attractive but in some of those pics from when she was nursing she has what I'd describe as a bit of a (hate to say this) baby face - full cheeks, rounded kind of features and something about her smile makes her look quite young and unassuming. A few have asked if she had a...

tattle.life

 

[PenelopeTitsDrop]

Yeah I know, I thought the similar but you worded it much better then I ever could apparently it happens when babies are moving between rooms ect

Ah right, that makes more sense. Smoking cessation not needed then. Phew!

 

[SamPam]

Sorry to ask in the middle of debate but I’ve missed a whole thread, came back late to this & need to ask what the “fella” references are as feel like I’m missing something big, it’s on nearly every comment

It's the fella giving evidence now. No idea why he's not nice though.

 

[EffingDust]

I really believe she's guilty. I think she's an incredibly sly, spiteful, calculating individual and gets off on the attention and drama of it all. She enjoys watching the parents grieve. Not sure if she's a psychopath, more likely a sociopath or a narcissist with a personality disorder. She's done this, I have no doubt about it.

I agree, and I think in the fullness of time we will see evidence or suggestion that she was perhaps motivated by jealousy of the babies themselves, and the doting they received from their parents and staff.
LL strikes me as someone who will have been fawned over by older colleagues and her family. I know we’ve joked a lot about her appearance and older dress sense, but she strikes me as the sort who will have been praised through childhood and early adulthood for being “mature for her age”, “not like other young people”. Something can happen with people like that as they get to late 20s and 30s; the goalposts of what makes you “sensible” and “mature” shift, they stop getting praised for it as others have caught up with them, and suddenly things like having a family of your own start to be what you get praise and attention for, not being dedicated to study or enjoying a Peacocks tankini. I find those sorts of people either grow up and move on, or get into this weird perpetual adolescent state where they are jealous of other young people for enjoying normal things and for the attention they get.
I can’t really express it that well, hopefully the fellas here understand what I’m getting at

 

[Aberscot]

Do we think court finished early again? Can’t see any updates since middayish?

Andy Gill on twitter has just updated? Dr Evans on stand

 

[Haveyouanywool]

All of these babies were not expected to die. A few babies, I’m surmising, would be expected to die, due to overwhelming infection, damaged lungs etc. They may have been DNAR.
Hastening them along a bit would not have been so difficult, or suspicious, but it wouldn’t have created the drama, and attention, in the moment, and after. It wouldn’t have given that God like feeling of deciding, as they were dying anyway.
Quite horrible describing it so coldly but just trying to rationalise.