- Notice
bigmac22
Well-known member
So relieved that the right outcome has been reached - rest in peace Isabelle
Emsie
VIP Member
What in the world is happening? All these assaults on children. Why is everyone a pdf!
I am starting to think this less about sexual interest in children and more about dominance, violence, humiliation and power against females. I wish someone would study this more. But who has the stomach for it
I am starting to think this less about sexual interest in children and more about dominance, violence, humiliation and power against females. I wish someone would study this more. But who has the stomach for it
Nelly's mum
VIP Member
The flight mode method doesn't work for me so I'm grateful to anyone that posts the court reports, many thanksThe live updates can be found at the Northern Echo, however only available to read in full via subscription or by using the flight mode method explained previously by @zogsmum
Live updates from the Isabelle Welsh murder trial - Day 4
Good morning and welcome to Day 4 of live coverage from Isabelle Welsh murder trial.www.thenorthernecho.co.uk
Also, it says that CCTV caught her cutting herself with a knife on her arms and was going to claim Simpson did it whilst she was drunk etc. So I am not sure if she was actually abused by the father’s dad or was it a lie? Obviously don’t want to diminish it if she was. She’s lied so much to her about Isabelle’s state, it’s hard to see if it’s the truth.
If you have been a victim on domestic abuse, how are you not able to see that your child is being abused?? You’d be more protective and overly so?
Whether she was a victim of domestic abuse, she’s allowed a stranger abuse her daughter in the most vicious way. Of course her mum is going to throw Isabelle’s dad under the bus to protect her daughter.
Even if he wasn’t around much (he does have selfies of him and Isabelle on his Facebook and she seemed happy be in his company, compared to the constant crying with her new boyfriend), plenty of single mothers don’t abuse or allow their kids to be abused and eventually killed by their new boyfriends.
If you have been a victim on domestic abuse, how are you not able to see that your child is being abused?? You’d be more protective and overly so?
Whether she was a victim of domestic abuse, she’s allowed a stranger abuse her daughter in the most vicious way. Of course her mum is going to throw Isabelle’s dad under the bus to protect her daughter.
Even if he wasn’t around much (he does have selfies of him and Isabelle on his Facebook and she seemed happy be in his company, compared to the constant crying with her new boyfriend), plenty of single mothers don’t abuse or allow their kids to be abused and eventually killed by their new boyfriends.
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Happytobedivorced
Active member
Thank God- but it brings home how these things are happening repeatedly and ‘lessons’ are not being learned. RIP sweet little girl.
Shinythings
VIP Member
I do hope more comes out about this trial after the verdict as it's been hard to follow at times.
I hope justice is served for her. Like Preston, I hope heaven exists so she can be happy and free for eternity.
I hope justice is served for her. Like Preston, I hope heaven exists so she can be happy and free for eternity.
lovesthegossipmx
VIP Member
no parent would accept it normal for their child to sleep like that without waking rhem and checking
if im understanding this right i think isabelle was either unconcious or dead for many hrs and they knew it
if im understanding this right i think isabelle was either unconcious or dead for many hrs and they knew it
Emsie
VIP Member
Honestly the amount of people defending a wasteman dad is shocking! It's just another stick to beat women with. She doesn't let me see my kid. She can't actually stop you, come on. Just excuses.
But as I keep coming back to, and I want to make it clear. JW didnt kill Isabelle and he has a right to be angry, of course. Just that both things can be true.
Erling Haaland
Chatty Member
who in their right mind buys a young girl, the sole carer of a very poorly two year old, a crate!!!??The grandmother got shitty at the hospital when the medics were concerned about the broken leg & she didn’t want Isabelle to stay overnight - Grandmother obviously didn’t want social services involvement or anything that would have actually helped Isabelle escape the situation she was in.
Talked the talk slightly, but ultimately she didn’t give that much of a fuck about the baby & her being hurt, consciously averted her gaze from what was obviously happening & even enabled it by buying AW 10 cans of “Wife Beater”
I’m so sick of all these vile POS bluefoxglove
New member
Grandmother has some questions to answer here. Imagine having those thoughts and not taking any action beyond having a chat with your chaotic, complicit daughter. Between grandmother and the complacent ‘no concerns’ health visitor, Isabelle was let down by more than just the so-called mum and partner.
Ray_of_Sunshine
VIP Member
There’s never a shred of intelligence to be found between these people it’s always the same in every one of these cases and always to the detriment of the children. 10 cans of Stella isn’t light work! It’s not a couple of beers to unwind with after a long day. Why did they not question why a young woman is requesting that in the first place? They then decided to enable it by buying it for her knowing she’s on her own with a little girl in her care. Then add a new boyfriend moved in that they’ve never metYes, they thought she was on her own with a two year old, but bought her 10 cans of Stella
Also, the Nan said wtte that Isabelle looked like an abused child, she knew something wasn’t right but did nothing about it
More people need to act on behalf of defenceless babies and youngsters, instead of crossing their fingers and turning the other way.
Madness.WurstHunde
Member
Thank you @OGJessicaFletcher for posting the updates.
How is “intimidating hospital staff” just allowed to happen? Every GP surgery and ED I’ve ever been in has signs up saying that staff have the right to work without being abused, and anyone who does will be removed at the very least.
How is “intimidating hospital staff” just allowed to happen? Every GP surgery and ED I’ve ever been in has signs up saying that staff have the right to work without being abused, and anyone who does will be removed at the very least.
Lynn’ssnazzycardigan
VIP Member
The updates are unclear to me and difficult to understand. If the injuries are only from when she got with HS then I think he was the main violent one and she didn’t stop him. But if some are older than that then I think he’s probably taken advantage of the situation, knowing Isabelle was already being treated foully and with contempt so he’s just felt like she was fair game. Can they get done for joint enterprise or does it have to be one murder and one CAD? The jury have to be sure to convict and to avoid any chance to appeal. I hope to God they get justice for this little girl. She must have been so lonely and frightened. Seems they weren’t even feeding her properly. AW totally unfit to be a parent and then invites a predator into their home. Family seeing her deteriorating and doing nothing but turning away. Nobody cared enough to help her. No professionals took the time to see if she was ok. I think of my own children at that age, so trusting and loving, reaching their little hands out and my heart breaks for Isabelle.
Its_Me
VIP Member
100% I don’t think she had a very nice life even before he came along despite the stupid grandmother claiming she was well looked after
Readingthecomments
Well-known member
How were the multiple leg fractures not picked up on x-Ray when she was taken to hospital for the limp?
Can’t imagine the pain she was in with multiple fractures, poor girl.
Can’t imagine the pain she was in with multiple fractures, poor girl.
Lynn’ssnazzycardigan
VIP Member
Thanks for the correction. I did read it at the time but it must have got mixed up in my memory. My impressions change all the time, I started out feeling very sorry for the grandparents (obviously still do for their terrible loss and the regrets they must have). I was very generously giving the benefit of the doubt to AW as well for her reaction there because nobody knows how they would be in such circumstances. The more that’s reported though the worse they all seem. I get the impression AW was a literal raging alcoholic and the grandparents must have known that. I don’t think we’ve heard much about Isabelle’s dad. It seems he’s been accused of DV against AW so kind of got a free pass as to why he hasn’t done anything to help Isabelle, (the cynic in me assumes he will say he tried everything to see her but wasn’t allowed). If that’s true it seems like AW another one of these women who lurches from one abusive man to the next dragging the poor kid(s) along for the journey. And yes I am aware of patterns of domestic abuse and that I could be accused of victim blaming but at some point people need to have self awareness and take accountability for their own bloody choices. Spoiler for merail. Having left an abusive man myself I didn’t think I would even bother getting another man because how could you trust someone around your kids when their own dad was dangerous. When I did find someone it was a very long time before he could even meet them let alone move in or spend any time with them without me present.
OGJessicaFletcher
VIP Member
Day 8 - Part 1
Read bottom up…TW medical evidence.
12:36pm 06/07/26
Agreed facts
Paul Abrahams, junior counsel for the prosecution, is now taking the jury through a series of facts agreed between all parties involved in the trial.
The barrister is dealing with the arrest of Alexandra Walker and Harrison Simpson in the early hours of the morning.
He tells the jury that police seized two video cameras from inside Walker's Thornaby home.
The jury hears how Simpson was interviewed on three occasions and he made no comment to all questions put to him about the physical and sexual abuse of Isabelle.
Walker was also interviewed on three occasions - transcripts of those were read to the jury last week.
12:25pm 06/07/26
Cross examination
Mr Lumley KC is the first to cross examine the expert witness.
He quizzes Professor Freemont about the fracture timings and the accuracy without video or witness evidence.
He confirms people across all ages heal at different rates.
The barrister asks about the fractures aged between three to six weeks discovered on Isabelle's body and the professor confirms that it's likely that they happened in the same incident by a single person.
Professor Freemont confirms that is the case for all of the timeframes.
Mr McKone KC has no questions for the expert witness and there is no re-examination from Mr Wright, prosecuting.
12:17pm 06/07/26
Hearing resumes
Professor Freemont will resume his evidence following a short break in proceedings.
The medical expert will be cross examined by defence barristers Nicholas Lumley KC, for Harrison Simpson, and Mark McKone KC, for Alexandra Walker.
11:48am 06/07/26
Likely causation
Professor Freemont is now dealing with the likely causation of Isabelle's injuries.
He says the likely cause of the injuries to her limbs were at the ends of the bones and the the most likely cause is 'pulling or twisting' on the limbs affected.
When asked what level of force should we be thinking about, he says, 'these fractures are not seen in the usual day of a child or in boisterous play - they are beyond those types of activities'.
Dealing with the 'callus' injuries where the child's bone has been 'bent and released', he says there is a small amount of damage which initiates a healing response.
He says the skull fracture was a long linear fracture, around 6cms long, they are used caused by a direct impact on a child of this age - something hitting the skull or the skull hitting something.
"You are looking at really significant force," he says.
He says there can be a correlation with the twisting and pulling fractures to the limbs, the spinal fractures and the skull fracture.
'There was twisting and pulling at the same time that the skull impacted on a hard surface', he says.
The medical expert says there was a lack of history for some of the injuries which is a 'red flag' for a set of fractures to be non-accidental but in this case there were three red flags.
11:37am 06/07/26
Further injuries
Professor Freemont is now dealing with Isabelle's foot injuries which were between eight to 24 hours and three weeks.
He says Isabelle had a crack to the neck of her femur which occurred between three and six weeks before her death.
On her left tibia, there was fracture near her knee which was eight to 24 hours old and there was matching damage to her fibula.
When asked whether he believed the injuries in the same time periods were likely to have been caused during the three time frames.
"She sustained at least three episodes of trauma to her bones," he says.
Professor Freemont says Isabelle also had a significant fracture to her skull.
There were 21 separate fractures spread across three different timescales eight to 24 hours, three to eight days and three and six weeks.
He says: "All of these fractures were non-accidental."
11:29am 06/07/26
Limb fractures
Mr Wright is now dealing with the fractures to Isabelle's legs and arms including some that were three to eight weeks old.
Professor Freemont says the healing process takes six months to heal completely and what he saw in the legs and arms were markers to indicate when they occurred.
He explains that children's bones grow from the top and bottom were two different tissues form and there were 'red flags' in Isabelle's injuries were non-accidental.
Jurors are now looking at a diagram of the toddler's injuries.
Starting at the right leg, the medical expert says the fracture was close to her knee joint which was eight to 24 hours old at the time of death.
He says there was evidence of a healing reaction on her bone which may not be an actual fracture because children's bones are more flexible and springy than those of an adult.
The jury hears how she had a fracture near her ankle which were older - three to six weeks at the time of her death.
On her right leg, there was a small fracture which was eight to 24 hours old at the time of death, he says.
He says that there was also evidence of injury caused more than three weeks earlier.
Professor Freemont says there was evidence that one of Isabelle's fractures had occurred on the same place on her bone.
11:17am 06/07/26
Spinal injuries
Mr Wright asks what mechanism would have been required to cause this type of injuries.
He says it would require a 'very forceful slam to the bottom of the pelvis or to bend the spine forwards beyond the normal limits of the spine'.
Professor Freemont ruled out accidental injuries due to number and type of injuries to the vertebrae.
"I believe that these are inflicted injuries," he says.
He tells the jury that the older injuries were likely to have been caused in the same way.
"Nowhere was I able to find any evidence that this number of fractures had been seen previously," he says.
11:12am 06/07/26
Broken bones
Professor Freemont says he identified fractures in Isabelle's vertebrae at the top and bottom of her spine which were caused between eight and 24 hours before she died.
He explains that he is able to age the breaks through investigating clotting and bruising markers through a microscope.
The jury hears there were also older fractures along the toddler's thoracic and lumbar sections of her spine which were aged between three to eight days before death.
He says he is was able to age the fractures by examining the healing process of the vertebrae but was unable to ascertain whether they all occurred at the same time.
Dealing with the most recent fractures, Professor Freemont says they occurred at the same time.
Turning his attention to the older injuries, he says: "Nearly or all of them occurred at the same time, two could have been at a different time but I could not be certain."
Mr Wright asks the professor about the fractures. He says they were all to the front of vertebrae which is extremely rare.
"I have never seen this number of fractures ever before," he says.
10:59am 06/07/26
Expert analysis
Professor Freemont tells the jury that he inspected a series of x-rays before determining which bones and fractures to investigate under a microscope.
The medical expert says he examined a large section of the toddler's spine, the radius bones in her lower arms, the tibia and fibula in both legs, bones in her left foot, the left femur, and her skull.
The specialist says there was no evidence of any underlying medical disorder that could have weakened Isabelle's bones.
He says there was a reduction in the number of blood cells in her bone marrow which can be associated with malnourishment but did not offer a definitive opinion on the cause.
10:49am 06/07/26
Medical evidence
The first person to give evidence this week is Professor Tony Freemont, a specialist pathologist, has expertise in identifying, and aging fractures to the bones.
He tells the jury that he is an expert determining the cause and age of broken bones and examined Isabelle Welsh's body following a post mortem.
Richard Wright KC, prosecuting, is taking the pathologist through his evidence.
10:36am 06/07/26
Evidence recap
You can read a recap of Friday's evidence here - Thornaby mother denied murdering her two-year-old daughter
Read bottom up…TW medical evidence.
12:36pm 06/07/26
Agreed facts
Paul Abrahams, junior counsel for the prosecution, is now taking the jury through a series of facts agreed between all parties involved in the trial.
The barrister is dealing with the arrest of Alexandra Walker and Harrison Simpson in the early hours of the morning.
He tells the jury that police seized two video cameras from inside Walker's Thornaby home.
The jury hears how Simpson was interviewed on three occasions and he made no comment to all questions put to him about the physical and sexual abuse of Isabelle.
Walker was also interviewed on three occasions - transcripts of those were read to the jury last week.
12:25pm 06/07/26
Cross examination
Mr Lumley KC is the first to cross examine the expert witness.
He quizzes Professor Freemont about the fracture timings and the accuracy without video or witness evidence.
He confirms people across all ages heal at different rates.
The barrister asks about the fractures aged between three to six weeks discovered on Isabelle's body and the professor confirms that it's likely that they happened in the same incident by a single person.
Professor Freemont confirms that is the case for all of the timeframes.
Mr McKone KC has no questions for the expert witness and there is no re-examination from Mr Wright, prosecuting.
12:17pm 06/07/26
Hearing resumes
Professor Freemont will resume his evidence following a short break in proceedings.
The medical expert will be cross examined by defence barristers Nicholas Lumley KC, for Harrison Simpson, and Mark McKone KC, for Alexandra Walker.
11:48am 06/07/26
Likely causation
Professor Freemont is now dealing with the likely causation of Isabelle's injuries.
He says the likely cause of the injuries to her limbs were at the ends of the bones and the the most likely cause is 'pulling or twisting' on the limbs affected.
When asked what level of force should we be thinking about, he says, 'these fractures are not seen in the usual day of a child or in boisterous play - they are beyond those types of activities'.
Dealing with the 'callus' injuries where the child's bone has been 'bent and released', he says there is a small amount of damage which initiates a healing response.
He says the skull fracture was a long linear fracture, around 6cms long, they are used caused by a direct impact on a child of this age - something hitting the skull or the skull hitting something.
"You are looking at really significant force," he says.
He says there can be a correlation with the twisting and pulling fractures to the limbs, the spinal fractures and the skull fracture.
'There was twisting and pulling at the same time that the skull impacted on a hard surface', he says.
The medical expert says there was a lack of history for some of the injuries which is a 'red flag' for a set of fractures to be non-accidental but in this case there were three red flags.
11:37am 06/07/26
Further injuries
Professor Freemont is now dealing with Isabelle's foot injuries which were between eight to 24 hours and three weeks.
He says Isabelle had a crack to the neck of her femur which occurred between three and six weeks before her death.
On her left tibia, there was fracture near her knee which was eight to 24 hours old and there was matching damage to her fibula.
When asked whether he believed the injuries in the same time periods were likely to have been caused during the three time frames.
"She sustained at least three episodes of trauma to her bones," he says.
Professor Freemont says Isabelle also had a significant fracture to her skull.
There were 21 separate fractures spread across three different timescales eight to 24 hours, three to eight days and three and six weeks.
He says: "All of these fractures were non-accidental."
11:29am 06/07/26
Limb fractures
Mr Wright is now dealing with the fractures to Isabelle's legs and arms including some that were three to eight weeks old.
Professor Freemont says the healing process takes six months to heal completely and what he saw in the legs and arms were markers to indicate when they occurred.
He explains that children's bones grow from the top and bottom were two different tissues form and there were 'red flags' in Isabelle's injuries were non-accidental.
Jurors are now looking at a diagram of the toddler's injuries.
Starting at the right leg, the medical expert says the fracture was close to her knee joint which was eight to 24 hours old at the time of death.
He says there was evidence of a healing reaction on her bone which may not be an actual fracture because children's bones are more flexible and springy than those of an adult.
The jury hears how she had a fracture near her ankle which were older - three to six weeks at the time of her death.
On her right leg, there was a small fracture which was eight to 24 hours old at the time of death, he says.
He says that there was also evidence of injury caused more than three weeks earlier.
Professor Freemont says there was evidence that one of Isabelle's fractures had occurred on the same place on her bone.
11:17am 06/07/26
Spinal injuries
Mr Wright asks what mechanism would have been required to cause this type of injuries.
He says it would require a 'very forceful slam to the bottom of the pelvis or to bend the spine forwards beyond the normal limits of the spine'.
Professor Freemont ruled out accidental injuries due to number and type of injuries to the vertebrae.
"I believe that these are inflicted injuries," he says.
He tells the jury that the older injuries were likely to have been caused in the same way.
"Nowhere was I able to find any evidence that this number of fractures had been seen previously," he says.
11:12am 06/07/26
Broken bones
Professor Freemont says he identified fractures in Isabelle's vertebrae at the top and bottom of her spine which were caused between eight and 24 hours before she died.
He explains that he is able to age the breaks through investigating clotting and bruising markers through a microscope.
The jury hears there were also older fractures along the toddler's thoracic and lumbar sections of her spine which were aged between three to eight days before death.
He says he is was able to age the fractures by examining the healing process of the vertebrae but was unable to ascertain whether they all occurred at the same time.
Dealing with the most recent fractures, Professor Freemont says they occurred at the same time.
Turning his attention to the older injuries, he says: "Nearly or all of them occurred at the same time, two could have been at a different time but I could not be certain."
Mr Wright asks the professor about the fractures. He says they were all to the front of vertebrae which is extremely rare.
"I have never seen this number of fractures ever before," he says.
10:59am 06/07/26
Expert analysis
Professor Freemont tells the jury that he inspected a series of x-rays before determining which bones and fractures to investigate under a microscope.
The medical expert says he examined a large section of the toddler's spine, the radius bones in her lower arms, the tibia and fibula in both legs, bones in her left foot, the left femur, and her skull.
The specialist says there was no evidence of any underlying medical disorder that could have weakened Isabelle's bones.
He says there was a reduction in the number of blood cells in her bone marrow which can be associated with malnourishment but did not offer a definitive opinion on the cause.
10:49am 06/07/26
Medical evidence
The first person to give evidence this week is Professor Tony Freemont, a specialist pathologist, has expertise in identifying, and aging fractures to the bones.
He tells the jury that he is an expert determining the cause and age of broken bones and examined Isabelle Welsh's body following a post mortem.
Richard Wright KC, prosecuting, is taking the pathologist through his evidence.
10:36am 06/07/26
Evidence recap
You can read a recap of Friday's evidence here - Thornaby mother denied murdering her two-year-old daughter