Gender Discussion #104

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God that’s a horrifying thought. But it must happen so regularly, the schools might barely bat an eyelid. None of our business, cultural relativism etc etc.
a different but similar issue, but there’s a podcast called I’m Not a Monster about Shamina Begum, there might even be a series of the same name now.

They discuss just how many warnings the school (and maybe family? I can’t remember) had about her and her friends doing exactly what they did. From memory, I think they were able to get to Syria in the first place through an older girl at the same school who had already made the journey.

not defending what she did, but from the podcast I got the impression that she had all the traits that made her vulnerable to being exploited/manipulated. Naive, stupid and very selfish. She would not have been the kind of 15 year old who could apprehend the colossal consequences of her actions, and she’s now so traumatised (if she’s still alive) that I doubt she ever will.
 
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God that’s a horrifying thought. But it must happen so regularly, the schools might barely bat an eyelid. None of our business, cultural relativism etc etc.
I work in school as support staff and all staff have annual training on this situation, on the process to alert Social services or Police if there's immediate danger but I do wonder how many children are failed by the system.
 
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a different but similar issue, but there’s a podcast called I’m Not a Monster about Shamina Begum, there might even be a series of the same name now.

They discuss just how many warnings the school (and maybe family? I can’t remember) had about her and her friends doing exactly what they did. From memory, I think they were able to get to Syria in the first place through an older girl at the same school who had already made the journey.

not defending what she did, but from the podcast I got the impression that she had all the traits that made her vulnerable to being exploited/manipulated. Naive, stupid and very selfish. She would not have been the kind of 15 year old who could apprehend the colossal consequences of her actions, and she’s now so traumatised (if she’s still alive) that I doubt she ever will.
I believe the she is still alive and kicking. I read that she had been trying to get back into the UK using a false name and an illegal immigration route. She got found out, but this was recent . She's incredibly manipulative and dangerous according to one of the intelligence officers who has had dealings with her (IIRC).
 
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I believe the she is still alive and kicking. I read that she had been trying to get back into the UK using a false name and an illegal immigration route. She got found out, but this was recent . She's incredibly manipulative and dangerous according to one of the intelligence officers who has had dealings with her (IIRC).
I saw an interview with Shemima Begum and she was incredibly unrepentant. Everybody's fault but her own. And quite scarily unbothered by the appalling things she'd witnessed

Like a bucket with human heads in it.

Whether that is all a product of her being traumatised who knows - but arguably it could make her quite a dangerous person.
 
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I saw an interview with Shemima Begum and she was incredibly unrepentant. Everybody's fault but her own. And quite scarily unbothered by the appalling things she'd witnessed

Like a bucket with human heads in it.

Whether that is all a product of her being traumatised who knows - but arguably it could make her quite a dangerous person.
Yes. She said it didn't faze her!
 
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I saw an interview with Shemima Begum and she was incredibly unrepentant. Everybody's fault but her own. And quite scarily unbothered by the appalling things she'd witnessed

Like a bucket with human heads in it.

Whether that is all a product of her being traumatised who knows - but arguably it could make her quite a dangerous person.
yes, I was struck both by how unrepentant she was, and how she only started questioning her loyalty to ISIS because of how they treated her, not those they persecuted and terrorised.
 
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I’m afraid I have very little sympathy for Shamima Begum. I know people love to say she was just a child and she was groomed, but she’s also an extremist. Both things can be true.
 
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I’m afraid I have very little sympathy for Shamima Begum. I know people love to say she was just a child and she was groomed, but she’s also an extremist. Both things can be true.
no I definitely agree - I suppose my (poorly made) point was all kinds of things can go wrong when red flags are ignored.
 
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no I definitely agree - I suppose my (poorly made) point was all kinds of things can go wrong when red flags are ignored.
I didn’t think your point was poorly made at all! In fact you raised a very good point, which is that naive, stupid and easily led young people can turn to extremism surprisingly easily, and all that’s required is a family and peer environment that supports it.

Many such examples when you look at British born Islamic terrorists over the last 20 years.
 
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I’m afraid I have very little sympathy for Shamima Begum. I know people love to say she was just a child and she was groomed, but she’s also an extremist. Both things can be true.
I wouldn't trust her as far as I could thrown her with a broken arm and a slipped disc.
 
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My younger two went to high school in the mid late 2000s in a highly diverse area and there was always a sizeable clump of girls who would just be withdrawn suddenly in Years 9 and 10, my daughter was in the same friendship group as two of them and didn't even get to say goodbye. The official reason given that they were off to spend a year/live with relatives in Pakistan/Bangladesh. Of course all the chat among us parents was that they were being sent to Pakistan to be married off and then the plan was return to Britain one day bringing the husband, children and his mother/his side of the family. I always wondered whether the school did any follow up but I suppose they would just take it at face value that they were going to complete their education with family in another country. Also, what could a school do really. "Yes hello British Embassy in Pakistan, we think Shamila from Year 9 might have been trafficked can you check on her?" - literally nothing they could do really
This happened in my high school in Los Angeles. A gal in our dance class, she was lovely, she suddenly disappeared. Dad was very upset she was dancing and there were boys in the class. We were about 17. I heard later she did go back to Pakistan, I assume forced to do so. I think of her a lot. :( Same time as your younger two, a bit older, mid-late 2000s.

I'm active in beauty/makeup spaces or just stuff for women over 30 and it irritates me how many men are in these subs and how much attention they get. I don't want makeup advice from a dude. I don't want advice about dealing with skincare, aging, for women, from a man. You can't say boo to a goose about it or you get banned. It seems like there are no female-only spaces online I can find.
 
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I’m afraid I have very little sympathy for Shamima Begum. I know people love to say she was just a child and she was groomed, but she’s also an extremist. Both things can be true.
Let's be honest, pretty much every terrorist has been groomed, most of them from early childhood, that doesn't make them any less dangerous.
 
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I didn’t think your point was poorly made at all! In fact you raised a very good point, which is that naive, stupid and easily led young people can turn to extremism surprisingly easily, and all that’s required is a family and peer environment that supports it.

Many such examples when you look at British born Islamic terrorists over the last 20 years.
I think cults are organised abuse. And like abusive individuals, cults know how to identify, target, and ensnare people who are vulnerable and seeking belonging. Examples of this are as wide ranging as Scientology, trans, Jehovah Witness, Charles Manson's group, Aum Shinriko, the Dami Mission.

There are also groups that can become cult like in their behaviour if safeguards are disregarded. I would argue that extreme Rightism, extreme Leftism, climate apocalypse and even some 12 Step Groups can fall into this.

Radical Islam is difficult to class purely as a cult because unlike Christianity, Islam has not undergone 2 Reformations, and has not accepted a full separation of church and state in many countries. Therefore on a strict Koranic interpretation, such activites as martyrdom, tricking and destroying unbelievers who refuse to convert, taking up to four wives, women being worth less than men, taking female kafir slaves (the grooming gangs) are all correct beliefs and activities. HOWEVER. Against that we can look at secular Islamic countries such as Indonesia, Albania, Kosovo, the 'Five Stans' etc where radical Koranic interpretation has been successfully separated from politics. This is why I say Islam isn't the problem. Only racists would seriously claim that. Interpretation is the problem. The radical interpretation of ISS, Hezbollah, Boko Haram, Hamas (all funded by Iran btw) are cult like and are a problem.

Shamima Begum was a vulnerable person who fell under the sway of a cult. But I don't believe she should be granted sanctuary or absolution just because she's vulnerable. People can be both vulnerable and dangerous. I think Shamima's one of those. Also Axel Rudukabana. Or Sally Anne Jones aka Umm Hussain al-Britani. And because they're so dangerous, they shouldn't be in our society.

A number of Muslim or former Muslim activists such as Ayan Hirsi Ali have theorised that second gen immigrants ie British born Muslims are more vulnerable to becoming extremists than their first gen parents who are more secularised and integrated. And these parents are often baffled and heartbroken at their children's behaviour. I think this is an avenue which Government should explore more thoroughly.
 
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I was reading an article about microchimerism.

"Microchimerism is the presence of a small number of genetically distinct cells (often from a fetus in a mother, or vice versa) residing within a host, typically persisting for decades after pregnancy. These foreign cells can migrate to various tissues—including the blood, heart, liver, and brain—where they can act as stem-like cells for tissue repair. While they can contribute to autoimmune diseases and cancers, they also aid in maternal immune tolerance."

I wonder how that works with surrogate mothers? Whether or not the baby is biologically related to the mother, I suspect the cell transfer from the baby will still take place.
Microchimerism is just another reason why surrogacy is morally wrong IMO. Its playing God and messing with nature. Its Frankenstein territory and humans really shouldn't be going there.

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Well this is just anecdotal but it did happen where I worked. A woman had post-partum cardiomyopathy. This is a little known and very small risk with any pregnancy, (I’m guessing nobody cares if it happens to, or cares to warn surrogates). I saw it lots of times over my career. It can be a short illness or it can lead to irreversible heart failure. This woman had 5 children all with different fathers. She was not able to get a transplant because she had such a complex antibody profile, thought to be from all the different strands of DNA she had been exposed to in her pregnancies. It crosses my mind sometimes when thinking about surrogacy. It would be a very rare scenario but one thing I learned through all my years of nursing (and life in general) is that if crappy bad luck can happen then it sometimes will. I’m sure every woman here who has been pregnant has experienced some impact on her health, whether it’s short or long term, and sometimes it is life changing or worse. It’s morally repugnant to expect another woman to carry that risk so you can have a child because you can’t or don’t want to.
 
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So many members of the LGB community want to get rid of the T. They’ve been speaking up about the sick behaviours that some of these freaks want to bring into the pride flag, believing it will somehow protect them and give them an excuse for their frankly abominable behaviours. Now it’s happening in the US and they’re proudly saying they’re attracted to kids! I’m sickened.
 
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So many members of the LGB community want to get rid of the T. They’ve been speaking up about the sick behaviours that some of these freaks want to bring into the pride flag, believing it will somehow protect them and give them an excuse for their frankly abominable behaviours. Now it’s happening in the US and they’re proudly saying they’re attracted to kids! I’m sickened.
The pedalos have been trying to ride the coattails of the LGB movement for decades tho. You had PIE in the 1970s and also the movement has its very own philosophers and literary icons like Foucault and Isherwood, both out and proud pedalos.

I really do feel like when this tit is finally over lesbians in particular are due a MAHOOSIVE apology. Since they were the first ones in the early/mid 2010s to be standing up and saying, Trans ideology is illogical, it's misogynistic, it's a gateway to medical and sexual abuse, it's homophobic. The late great Magdalen Berns, Julie Bindel, etc etc. And they were shouted down and insulted in really very old school misogynist and lesbophobic ways. Even by gay men.

It's a mad betrayal to me because as I said when the AIDS crisis hit, lesbians were absolutely on the front line in San Fran and NY the initial epicentres of the disease (like, thanks, Gaetan Dugas), fundraising, nursing, protesting, lobbying Federal agencies etc. Even though lesbians are the group least likely to get AIDS.

And so when in the 2010s, lesbians were hit with a crisis in the form of an ideology which explicitly sought to erase them, you'd have thought gay men would have dykes' backs.

Wouldn't you?

(if i sound bitter it's cos I AM. it's just another example of women taking on all the organisational, caring and emotional labour roles for zero recognition and zero esteem)
 
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I've recently been joining some les Facbook groups centred around making friends/organising meetups etc, and it's amazing how many of them are centred around affiming men and their fetish for invading les spaces.

Constant "trans women are women" posts with hundreds of simpering comments, most of the group descriptions will say "this is an inclusive group, trans women are welcome" and stating you're not welcome if you don't agree. Also lots of comments along the lines of "Don't forget he/him lesbians are valid too" from women who have decided they're trans men but also still lesbians.

I went on a meetup with a few older lesbians recently, which gave me a bit of hope as they were very much of the opinion that this is all absolute lunacy and is decimating our community. Even then, the conversation started off very tentatively with "I hope this doesn't offend anyone.." I wonder how much of this is simply lesbians feeling as though they have to go along with it for fear of being ostracised, and how much of it is genuine. I sometimes feel incredibly disheartened and like we're fighting a losing battle.
 
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On TV psyops I’m watching an old episode of CSI from 2003 and there is an episode all about trans surgeries and various trans characters, there are some actual trans actors but three of the major supposedly TIMs are played by women. They’ve given them dodgy prosthetics around the face but the bikini shots and the voices don’t lie. So manipulative - I remember thinking at the time they used women instead of trans to make it more believable.

also has surrogacy involved - it’s all kinds or wrong and we’ve been fed this via media for 20 plus years
 
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On TV psyops I’m watching an old episode of CSI from 2003 and there is an episode all about trans surgeries and various trans characters, there are some actual trans actors but three of the major supposedly TIMs are played by women. They’ve given them dodgy prosthetics around the face but the bikini shots and the voices don’t lie. So manipulative - I remember thinking at the time they used women instead of trans to make it more believable.

also has surrogacy involved - it’s all kinds or wrong and we’ve been fed this via media for 20 plus years
The reason why the trans movement has needed such heavy astroturfing and media psyops is because in the average person's mind, trans women are cross dressing pervo men who are antisocial degenerates and possibly active abusers of women and children.

On this, as on so many other matters, the average person on the street is smarter, wiser and more intuitive than woke progressive cultural elites with acres of social capital, umpteen useless expensive degrees and an obsession with social engineering.
 
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The pedalos have been trying to ride the coattails of the LGB movement for decades tho. You had PIE in the 1970s and also the movement has its very own philosophers and literary icons like Foucault and Isherwood, both out and proud pedalos.

I really do feel like when this tit is finally over lesbians in particular are due a MAHOOSIVE apology. Since they were the first ones in the early/mid 2010s to be standing up and saying, Trans ideology is illogical, it's misogynistic, it's a gateway to medical and sexual abuse, it's homophobic. The late great Magdalen Berns, Julie Bindel, etc etc. And they were shouted down and insulted in really very old school misogynist and lesbophobic ways. Even by gay men.

It's a mad betrayal to me because as I said when the AIDS crisis hit, lesbians were absolutely on the front line in San Fran and NY the initial epicentres of the disease (like, thanks, Gaetan Dugas), fundraising, nursing, protesting, lobbying Federal agencies etc. Even though lesbians are the group least likely to get AIDS.

And so when in the 2010s, lesbians were hit with a crisis in the form of an ideology which explicitly sought to erase them, you'd have thought gay men would have dykes' backs.

Wouldn't you?

(if i sound bitter it's cos I AM. it's just another example of women taking on all the organisational, caring and emotional labour roles for zero recognition and zero esteem)
It’s always been the end game

 
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