Clementine Ford

[hazelnot]

I honestly feel like Clementine's take on marriage is based on a) her own partnership falling apart and b) WAAYYY too much time spent reading mums groups complaints about their tit husbands. Everyone knows horror stories about men who literally never change a nappy, can't be left alone with their own children, and complain their wives aren't earning any money while they run the entire household. Those women are in borderline (and sometimes outright) abusive situations and they do need help. But no one goes online to sing the praises of the partner who takes on night wakes, daycare drop offs, uses his parental leave and actually loves his wife! It just feels like the most sensationalised, black and white take.

This, but also c) being exposed to the worst of the worst way more than most. The nature of her work and the way she presents it attracts vitriol from the very worst subspecies of men. It must be impossible to cop additional flak like that and not have it further sour your (already pretty dismal) opinion of men.

I understand the point about it potentially being a tactic; that going extreme provokes consideration in the middle. I get that. And along that same kind of line of thinking, I understand there being a reason for her not to introduce balance or reason to her views. Like. I get it. It just grates me a bit - some of what she says, I roll my eyes and think, well, sure, but I know plenty of women who are useless or annoying in XYZ way, and can you imagine if a man came out and said it so plainly, over and over and over again? (I know, many do and have, but it's very differently regarded/received).

I think humans are complex creatures, most walking around programmed by whatever went on in their first seven years of life, and it's hugely diminishing (sometimes even damaging) to blame gender/the patriarchy alone. Especially when it's just blame-mad-blame with no light at the end of the tunnel. The only solution suggested is to leave men. I know it's not her job to be a support line or give all the tools, etc - and I know a lot of men are bleeping idiots - but it feels reductive? Like "Relationships with men are bad, point blank, and any woman who thinks she's in a good one is simply stupid or hasn't learned yet."

 

[leeeeleeee]

Agreed, pretty sure the whole point of tattle is to NOT be upfront about who you are.. There are many people here I suspect are 'influencers' or those spoken about but gosh this pile on for Laura is ridiculous

100% but when you are an influencer discussing a topic in which you are directly involved, pretending to be sometime else to drum up support for yourself. Nah.

 

[gooridoori]

I’d hazard a keen guess that @gooridoori is Laura La Rose. First post, a lengthy post about Clem, was at 5am Sunday morning; Laura actively posted a story on her IG between 5-6am that same day. It seems a rather focused time of day to be posting on tattle. Coupled with the range of @gooridoori posts only being Clem focused In addition to referring to being First Nations and their mob from Sydney, which is where Laura is from. Which is fine but just be up front about it either that.. or it’s a red herring because the obviousness seems sloppy.

Lol sure thing detective. I'm a Black woman that lives a few minutes walk from Clementine in Naarm. I use this site on the reg as already explained. If you were local and Black and knew her you would protect your identity too. I don't like her but I am far from alone in this and Ive spoken about loads of different things on this site, as recent as a few weeks ago from my norm account. Another person suggested this and its strange and tbh Laura doesnt seem like the type to use this site. I'm a single mum with a sick bub at the moment and don't have time for stupidity.
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yeah I remember the much worse content from the time, it really put me off her. I know it's not an easy division between the personal and the political when it comes to feminism... it just sounds to me like she couldn't communicate how she was feeling in her relationship, and really was blindsided by the demands of a newborn (this is why they tell you "this too shall pass"!!) and bailed out early. I really don't want to negatively judge anyone who decides that because heaven knows sometimes it's truly unworkable, but not everyone then tries to bankroll the experience into a book deal. I guess for me it's also NOT a new take at all - second wave feminists like Germaine Greer had a lot to say about rejecting marriage, but pop-culture feminists like Clem don't like to reference them due to the association with TERFs.

I agree. To digress a little my parents are not legally married but have been together for 46 years. They have had their ups and downs but still smitten. My sisters and I roll our eyes at them but its actually nice. Dad was more of the caretaker of us growing up and ran the household and did school runs while working more infrequently. Mum was busy working full-time, and saving the world. Its all we really knew for a long time and it was rad and it worked for all of us.
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So people should stay in unhealthy relationships because they have nowhere else to go??

That is basically what most women are forced to do most of the time. Often until they are murdered.

The housing crisis and men being rubbish partners are 2 very separate issues. Clementine doesn't have to vocal about every single social issue, no one does.

Clementine has had work done, it's obvious, but I have too. And Clem is honest about it. She is obviously in a far more privileged position than me, and most single parents, when it comes to beauty treatments. But she is honest about having work done which is polar opposite to most influencers.

She has changed a lot since I've followed her, but overall her message hasn't changed. She's remaining steadfast in her beliefs which is refreshing is a sea of IG personalities with zero substance. I don't agree with everything she says and I don't follow her closely as I used too, but I have gotten a lot out of her content over the years. And I too loved her last book "How We Love"

Thats not what I meant at all. I was highlighting her privilege to be focussing on something so naff during a housing crisis and suggesting women leave their husbands as if its just that easy. Its not easy for a lot of reasons, money being one of them! It just feels very off to me.
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Co-parenting does make you a part-time parent.

You only just joined tattle on the weekend and you've only spoken about Clementine with all this "inside info", you found this excerpt from her book that you know was written elsewhere even though that seems illogical.

That article is fairly harmless imo and not something awful for their son to read. It feels like an honest depiction of her experience and I am sure his father has his own experience that he speak to their son about.

Your Clementine hatred feels quite specific and coincidental given the other stuff going on with the other writer.

Go join a Clementine fan club or something.
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Co-parenting does make you a part-time parent.

You only just joined tattle on the weekend and you've only spoken about Clementine with all this "inside info", you found this excerpt from her book that you know was written elsewhere even though that seems illogical.

That article is fairly harmless imo and not something awful for their son to read. It feels like an honest depiction of her experience and I am sure his father has his own experience that he speak to their son about.

Your Clementine hatred feels quite specific and coincidental given the other stuff going on with the other writer.

Go join a Clementine fan club or something.
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Okay but just let her be? This is a tattle thread on Clem not a rave about.

Thanks mate. Id love to say that I am Laura but I really am not. I have met Laura once when she taught a workshop in Melbourne. I have met Clementine a handful of times and seen her around for years. I am a Black woman and some fools on here don't understand that making comment from my normal account is a recipe for Clementine trawling through here and piecing together who I am but honestly I don't even want to weigh in at all now,
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Oh agree the point is to be anonymous, however the user accused another user of being clementine Ford and also wholeheartedly denied being Laura, all while trying to extend this whole thing with screenshots and article links etc etc.
it seems really thinly veiled and specific in its focus, mainly I find it detracts from the thread. Im not piling on Laura, if you read my previous posts you’ll see my view on the Clem / Laura thing.

do any of you live in the city outskirts suburbs of Melbourne? because the stuff I have in here is commonly known. its a small city and Clementine is known and disliked by many. No one is piling on "Laura" because I am not Laura loll this is so silly
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yeah I remember the much worse content from the time, it really put me off her. I know it's not an easy division between the personal and the political when it comes to feminism... it just sounds to me like she couldn't communicate how she was feeling in her relationship, and really was blindsided by the demands of a newborn (this is why they tell you "this too shall pass"!!) and bailed out early. I really don't want to negatively judge anyone who decides that because heaven knows sometimes it's truly unworkable, but not everyone then tries to bankroll the experience into a book deal. I guess for me it's also NOT a new take at all - second wave feminists like Germaine Greer had a lot to say about rejecting marriage, but pop-culture feminists like Clem don't like to reference them due to the association with TERFs.

Thank you for validating what I said while others attack me and accuse me of being someone Im not. I have close friends who know Clementine and her partner and I heard how much he suffered throughout that time but all the Clementine stans can't see past their rose coloured glasses for a second to see how some authors use their public platforms to their advantage.
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Lol sure thing detective. I'm a Black woman that lives a few minutes walk from Clementine in Naarm. I use this site on the reg as already explained. If you were local and Black and knew her you would protect your identity too. I don't like her but I am far from alone in this and Ive spoken about loads of different things on this site, as recent as a few weeks ago from my norm account. Another person suggested this and its strange and tbh Laura doesnt seem like the type to use this site. I'm a single mum with a sick bub at the moment and don't have time for stupidity.
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I agree. To digress a little my parents are not legally married but have been together for 46 years. They have had their ups and downs but still smitten. My sisters and I roll our eyes at them but its actually nice. Dad was more of the caretaker of us growing up and ran the household and did school runs while working more infrequently. Mum was busy working full-time, and saving the world. Its all we really knew for a long time and it was rad and it worked for all of us.
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Thats not what I meant at all. I was highlighting her privilege to be focussing on something so naff during a housing crisis and suggesting women leave their husbands as if its just that easy. Its not easy for a lot of reasons, money being one of them! It just feels very off to me.
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Go join a Clementine fan club or something.
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Go join a Clementine fan club or something.
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Thanks mate. Id love to say that I am Laura but I really am not. I have met Laura once when she taught a workshop in Melbourne. I have met Clementine a handful of times and seen her around for years. I am a Black woman and some fools on here don't understand that making comment from my normal account is a recipe for Clementine trawling through here and piecing together who I am but honestly I don't even want to weigh in at all now,
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do any of you live in the city outskirts suburbs of Melbourne? because the stuff I have in here is commonly known. its a small city and Clementine is known and disliked by many. No one is piling on "Laura" because I am not Laura loll this is so silly
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Thank you for validating what I said while others attack me and accuse me of being someone Im not. I have close friends who know Clementine and her partner and I heard how much he suffered throughout that time but all the Clementine stans can't see past their rose coloured glasses for a second to see how some authors use their public platforms to their advantage.

I mean her ex partner not partner
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I do agree because my experience of early motherhood was your first example (all that crappy behaviour) but it took me socialising with my mum group friends and seeing how their husbands parented and handled things that really opened up my eyes. 2 of the dads were so hands on and caring and I was like woah I want this too for myself (and my baby) or I want to be single.

Here here

 

[therealsmilf]

Go join a Clementine fan club or something.

LOL.

I think Clementine is doing just fine when it comes to fans.

Such a coincidence that you always post here on another account but you can't do it while talking about Clementine because that account is not anonymous

I was highlighting her privilege to be focussing on something so naff during a housing crisis

Staying in an unhealthy relationship is not a naff thing. I'm not sure you understand how troubling that language sounds to a women struggling with the decision to stay or go.

 

[atome74]

This, but also c) being exposed to the worst of the worst way more than most. The nature of her work and the way she presents it attracts vitriol from the very worst subspecies of men. It must be impossible to cop additional flak like that and not have it further sour your (already pretty dismal) opinion of men.

absolutely agree with this! I also really am stunned by how she goes out of her way to find the absolute worst content about herself online (or maybe people send it to her - either way it sucks?!) And then she goes and basically doxxes these guys! Who the hell has the time? It's like she considers running an instagram account her fulltime job, everything else is just fluff.

 

[Sleepyapple]

LOL.

I think Clementine is doing just fine when it comes to fans.

Such a coincidence that you always post here on another account but you can't do it while talking about Clementine because that account is not anonymous



Staying in an unhealthy relationship is not a naff thing. I'm not sure you understand how troubling that language sounds to a women struggling with the decision to stay or go.

I think you might be misinterpreting what is being said. I actually agree with much of what Clementine says about marriage, but I do think her attitude towards it comes across as lacking nuance around how difficult it can be for women to leave, especially in situations of financial inequality in the midst of a cost of living and housing crisis. It’s fine that it’s not within Clementine’s scope to provide women for whom leaving is difficult advice around how to navigate this, it’s fine that she has a hardline stance about marriage, but sometimes her attitude comes across as condescending, as if women who don’t just leave immediately are stupid. She is not particularly receptive to feedback that even slightly disagrees with her stance. Pointing this out is not the same as advocating for women to stay in abusive relationships.

 

[therealsmilf]

I'm not misunderstanding and I am well aware of the difficulties in leaving any relationship.

I haven't seen Clem say anything particularly offensive or condescending about people staying in relationships but maybe I have missed things. Her Leave Him slogan is in jest, but in my experience rings true for so many women.

I believe the housing crisis and crappy relationships are separate issues and shouldn't be compared.

I've said many times I don't agree with every Clementine says. But I don't agree with Gooridoori's take on her either.
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absolutely agree with this! I also really am stunned by how she goes out of her way to find the absolute worst content about herself online (or maybe people send it to her - either way it sucks?!) And then she goes and basically doxxes these guys! Who the hell has the time? It's like she considers running an instagram account her fulltime job, everything else is just fluff.

I have fully supported her doxxing the few times I have seen her do it. Some of these bleeping men and their entitlement deserves to be called out. That Blokes Advice stuff was a joke, BA wrote a blog post about her doxxing members but didn't share even 1 of the violent comments about her. The hypocrisy of it all "its just a joke maybe you don't find it funny" excuses from men who are raising children. Men really are vile humans a lot of the time.

I've been sent gross messages from men over the years and I wish I'd had the will to call them out the way she has.

 

[gooridoori]

LOL.

I think Clementine is doing just fine when it comes to fans.

Such a coincidence that you always post here on another account but you can't do it while talking about Clementine because that account is not anonymous



Staying in an unhealthy relationship is not a naff thing. I'm not sure you understand how troubling that language sounds to a women struggling with the decision to stay or go.

Another CF stan. You obviously just want to argue with me. What Clementine talks about and what you are talking about are two different things. Clementines leave your husband campaign is mostly about not doing mens washing for them, man-babies and so on. Clementine does reduce a serious topic to naff. Dont preach to me about DV when I like so many have experience first hand coz you are gas lighting me just for the sake of it and putting words in my mouth. I have been that woman before and housing and access are very real issues and yes it is a struggle and yes it is terrifying. My communities are in crisis and Clementine goes on about just leaving while being blindsided to how have easy it is for people like her. Im a Black single mum who comes from poverty and not going to respond to any more keyboard warriors trying to distort what I am actually saying. You're wasting my time and energy.
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I think you might be misinterpreting what is being said. I actually agree with much of what Clementine says about marriage, but I do think her attitude towards it comes across as lacking nuance around how difficult it can be for women to leave, especially in situations of financial inequality in the midst of a cost of living and housing crisis. It’s fine that it’s not within Clementine’s scope to provide women for whom leaving is difficult advice around how to navigate this, it’s fine that she has a hardline stance about marriage, but sometimes her attitude comes across as condescending, as if women who don’t just leave immediately are stupid. She is not particularly receptive to feedback that even slightly disagrees with her stance. Pointing this out is not the same as advocating for women to stay in abusive relationships.

Completely agree with you. I swear its literally white women obsessed with my choice to remain anonymous because I doubt WOC would give it a second thought. White women don't fear their safety the way Black women like myself do. Im option out of this discussion because the gas lighting coming my way is harmful and I dont need it. I think its amazing how quick so many women are to defend a toxic white woman over Black women it speaks volumes.
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absolutely agree with this! I also really am stunned by how she goes out of her way to find the absolute worst content about herself online (or maybe people send it to her - either way it sucks?!) And then she goes and basically doxxes these guys! Who the hell has the time? It's like she considers running an instagram account her fulltime job, everything else is just fluff.

So true. Its what keeps the machine going. If she didnt do this she would be much lighter on material. Seems like a strategy to me that she knows is proven to work.
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I think you might be misinterpreting what is being said. I actually agree with much of what Clementine says about marriage, but I do think her attitude towards it comes across as lacking nuance around how difficult it can be for women to leave, especially in situations of financial inequality in the midst of a cost of living and housing crisis. It’s fine that it’s not within Clementine’s scope to provide women for whom leaving is difficult advice around how to navigate this, it’s fine that she has a hardline stance about marriage, but sometimes her attitude comes across as condescending, as if women who don’t just leave immediately are stupid. She is not particularly receptive to feedback that even slightly disagrees with her stance. Pointing this out is not the same as advocating for women to stay in abusive relationships.

And thank you Sleepyapple you said it better than I could but that is exactly what I am saying
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LOL.

I think Clementine is doing just fine when it comes to fans.

Such a coincidence that you always post here on another account but you can't do it while talking about Clementine because that account is not anonymous



Staying in an unhealthy relationship is not a naff thing. I'm not sure you understand how troubling that language sounds to a women struggling with the decision to stay or go.

"I believe the housing crisis and crappy relationships are separate issues and shouldn't be compared." -------->>> This is the most ignorant thing I have read in a long time.

 

[Coffeee]

Same, never been married, no interest in getting married. Happy to go to weddings though and eat the free food and drink the booze and celebrate the choice made by consenting adults.

Omg. I was literally about to write this EXACT thing .

 

[screenfreelookatme]

@gooridoori please don’t feel like you need to defend yourself. You explained right at the start and I don’t know why people keep questioning it. It made perfect sense to me. It’s just derailing at this point. I think you’ve raised some really interesting points for discussion. It’s super common on Tattle for people to deep dive and drag out old screen shots, it means nothing. Presumably we’re all adults and can read both sides of an argument and make up our own minds, without resorting to fighting with one another.

 

[giveitaboneploise]

It’s like a glamour shot you’d get at the back of Grace Bros back in the day . They’ve clearly gone for this look on purpose, so I guess I’ll just file it under “not for me”

i don’t really get the HH lewk. So shiny. I don’t think it looks very flattering. I’m quite amazed by how much Clem has physically changed in the last few year.

 

[atome74]

I have fully supported her doxxing the few times I have seen her do it. Some of these bleeping men and their entitlement deserves to be called out. That Blokes Advice stuff was a joke, BA wrote a blog post about her doxxing members but didn't share even 1 of the violent comments about her. The hypocrisy of it all "its just a joke maybe you don't find it funny" excuses from men who are raising children. Men really are vile humans a lot of the time.

I've been sent gross messages from men over the years and I wish I'd had the will to call them out the way she has.

Look the BA website is an absolutely abhorrent farce but I can't get behind doxxing, as if it would actually do anything to change these men's behaviours! If you've got that much free time to spend literally hours piecing together that info, go and volunteer in a women's shelter
I guess if you don't have to bother researching and referencing because you pinch it from others online, you do have a bit of free time once you're done writing.

 

[hazelnot]

@gooridoori please don’t feel like you need to defend yourself. You explained right at the start and I don’t know why people keep questioning it. It made perfect sense to me. It’s just derailing at this point. I think you’ve raised some really interesting points for discussion. It’s super common on Tattle for people to deep dive and drag out old screen shots, it means nothing. Presumably we’re all adults and can read both sides of an argument and make up our own minds, without resorting to fighting with one another.

This

I’m quite amazed by how much Clem has physically changed in the last few year.

Did anyone here follow the thread on her Facebook earlier this year about her use of Botox etc? tit popped off.

 

[robbolife]

This



Did anyone here follow the thread on her Facebook earlier this year about her use of Botox etc? tit popped off.

I didn’t! What was said?

 

[hazelnot]

Two moments caller, I'll see if I can find it. I remember I was staying at a friend's house, couldn't sleep and ended up reading all eleventy thousand comments at some ungodly hour of the morning - essentially an ongoing variety of "THAT MEANS YOU'RE NOT A REAL FEMINIST" rebutted by "ACTUALLY FEMINISM MEANS WE CAN DO WHAT WE WANT" then "NOT IF YOU ONLY WANT THE THING YOU WANT BECAUSE OF THE PATRIARCHY" etc
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Here we go. This is the post itself, back in March. I'm positive there were far more comments, and reading through now they seem largely supportive so I wonder if the contrary ones have since been deleted... (or I was just trippin' )

 

[melfish]

God, she's so angry. Why is she so overinvested in this Jonah Hill thing?

 

[Michy02]

God, she's so angry. Why is she so overinvested in this Jonah Hill thing?

It’s a story currently in the media and she wants likes, shares, comments. She’s editing her book so it’s all about gaining more following to make money off her work. It’s what I’ve seen Abbie Chatfield do. She goes on these crazy rants to drum up attention. Can’t follow her she drives me nuts.

With the “Leave your Husband” thing it’s really easy to tell women they are in toxic relationships with abusive men but for the woman involved it’s extremely difficult to just leave. Finances, housing, schooling for kids, income. Links to DV service providers should be given and some will stay in the relationship to protect their kids. Family court is a nightmare and having a new girlfriend/s parent your child is another type of pain.

 

[melfish]

It's all so tawdry and depressing. I hate 2023

 

[robbolife]

Rubyhamadwriter stories are on fire atm about this

God, she's so angry. Why is she so overinvested in this Jonah Hill thing?

 

[gooridoori]

Rubyhamadwriter stories are on fire atm about this

Where is this?