Please could you quote from this thread where anyone has said or even inferred that they deserved to have their child murdered?
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I cant comment what I'd do as I would not have done none of these things beforehand. I don't even leave my kids in an unlocked house with both their parents inside.
I was commenting as to why they didn't join in on the official search.
I totally agree. I lost my then 7 year old son for an hour once. I will never forget those frantic minutes and the feeling of total devastation and panic. Nothing else comes close to that experience. My sleep was disrupted for weeks afterwards even though he was totally fine. And that was only losing him for an hour!!
To be honest I never understood how bizarre the McCann’s reaction was until I had a child and then particularly until after that incident. When I rewatch their early interviews now I see two people who may well have been devastated and even broken by the death of their child but who have closure, and that is an entirely different state of being. It is not their “coldness” or lack of emotionality that stands out to me, it is that they are not in the panicky clawing hell of not-knowing.
In one if the early interviews Gerry talks about “grieving” Madeleine but the point is that parents of a missing child cannot grieve (and they cannot rest, they cannot sleep, they can barely eat and they almost certainly could not do TV interviews where they spend most of the time talking about themselves, because ALL they want to do is search for their child). The McCanns talk about how the first 3 weeks after her disappearance were bad but “now we are doing much better”. That is incomprehensible in my opinion and any parent who has had a child go missing for any period of time will know that. Your child is not with you, they are calling for you, they are scared, they are alone, they are terribly confused, they are possibly being horribly abused, and YOU are doing ok? I don’t think so.
It has been shared before here but the Peter Hyatt interview is super interesting on this topic when he does a statement analysis of one of the McCanns’ bizarre interviews (the interviewer Richard Hall is a bit of a nutcase IMO but Hyatt is great). At some point he talks about the behaviour of parents of missing children, and what happens in the parental brain when a child goes missing. It is my understanding that it is simply not true to say that “all parents behave differently” in these circumstances: there may be slight anomalies but there is very much a shared experience and there are behaviours one would expect to see from such parents, and the McCanns don’t display them.
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I think I can safely say that the situation the McCanns were in, I’d never have been in. My daughter would never have been left alone and so someone breaking in while I’m in bed as apposed to someone coming in and taking my child while I’m dining out would NEVER have happened. It’s not self righteous it’s a FACT. And I’ve no idea how I would have reacted if someone broke into to my home and stole my child but I can tell you 100% I would not have trusted anyone with my other children while I went jogging or playing bloody tennis. Never …
I don't think anyone is suggesting leaving your 3 young children alone while you go to dinner is a good thing. It's great to hear about all the good parenting but that's not what happened for MM, yes the parents were negligent but someone either took her from the apartment or found her outside the apartment. Who knows what happened to MM after that, but this person is ultimately responsible for whatever they did to MM.
It’s super basic: parents are there to protect their children and keep them safe. If tragedy befalls a child as a direct result of gross negligence then the parents are responsible.
That’s maybe if that’s what happened. Forensics might suggest otherwise. If you look at the evidence, especially the cadaver dogs, which in other occasions are believe but when it came to the mccanns it was dismissed.
I’m not actually sure what happened.
But what I do know for sure is that there should have been some sort of social services investigation into ALL those parents when they returned to England for leaving their very young children (toddlers) and babies alone. It’s called neglect and definitely neglectful and poor parenting.
A dog indicating is not evidence, yes it should be investigated to produce evidence, but an indication from a dog is not evidence.
I agree social services should have been involved, maybe they were, I think everyone would agree it is neglect to leave young children alone.
I think a lot of people can't get past the fact that the parents left the children alone - yes they did that, yes it is neglect, yes it is poor parenting - but who ever (presumably) killed MM is responsible for that, neglect doesn't equal murder.
I say 'killed' - I suppose MM could have been trafficked/given away but it all seems a bit far fetched, poor child
I’m halfway through this interview. The speciallist speaks really well and it’s compelling to listen to. It’s slightly skewed in that the interview has been edited and produced and created my a news channel and of course, the director will want to dramatise and recreate scenes, so maybe that’s the questions they were asked and they were replying to them. The specialist keeps pointing out that they were always referring to her in the past tense and not voicing their concerns as to where Maddie would be now and what was happening to her. Maybe they did do that and those bits were edited out as the news channel wanted a story not speculation.
I’m not defending them in any way , I think they are both shifty as hell. But basing statement analysis on a very slickly produced news feature is not the best practice. If such an interview exists where they both sit and are free to talk without being asked leading questions, that’s what a statement analyst should focus on.
See this has always been my theory - that Maddie woken up crying and wandered outside to find her parents and met her fate there.
And I think this is why her parents constantly say she was taken from the apartment. Cos is she got out herself, they're responsible - if someone took her - they're off the hook.
Let's face facts - for years, kids were put to bed in hotel rooms and apartments and adults went to the entertainment/bar.
However, I never heard of anyone leaving their kids in an unlocked room.
And that's the bit ill never get past with the McCanns as everyone has said, if he'd been a bin man and she was a cleaner, they'd have been charged with neglect and a protection order would have been put on the twins.
I know some people live a sheltered existence however imagine being so oblivious to the impact of class bias in everyday life, let alone in the media and anything related to crime and justice
I think not necessarily middle class but definitely in with, and accepted by, the right crowd.
Agreed - middle class is so broad now. It is a minefield to narrow down however as you say it’s all about the right crowd. Typical attributes being the way people speak and professions such as doctor, lawyer, architect etc are generally more automatically trusted. And the importance of good connections which is often the result of your upbringing (eg a private education and everything that leads to).
As I say, a very reductive way of thinking.
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I definitely think that the fact they were doctors in the sainted NHS - and the implications of that kind of a scandal for the government on the international stage - had an impact. And their contacts, for sure. It was bizarre how quickly they connected with that Mitchell guy. Didn't someone have a direct connection to Gordon Brown?
it was either Gerry or his brother that said "They called in a few favours!" now who were the few favours? Jill Renwick (Kate's friend) the one that contacted GMTV I believe it was Martin frizzell, who allowed her to speak live on air, Martin Frizell's Father was a Scottish sport journalist, Gerry Maccann had worked previously for Celtic Football Club as a physio during the 90''s , had Frizell and G Mccann's paths crossed previously? and this led him giving the sudden dissapearance of the wee girl a platform on live TV? it was also rumoured on various forums that former Labour Prime Minister Gordon Brown's brother lived on the same street as Kate's friend Jill Renwick is this why he got involved? to add Frizzell sent Kate Garraway out to report on the disappearance in Praia Da Luz for 4 weeks. it just so happened she was married to a Labour spin doctor, when wee Ben Needham disappeared did we ever witness the same kind of level of assistance from the UK media and UK Government in a word NO!
I don't think many working class parents in that situation who were either unemployed or working minimum wages jobs would have been granted an audience with the pope.
I have no idea whether the Portuguese police were incompetent or not. I do know that the McCann’s were incompetents parents. Who in their right minds leave young children alone in an apartment? I know exactly what I would do. I would either arrange child care or I wouldn’t leave the children on their own. I expect everyone else on this thread would do likewise. I would also cooperate with the local police 100% and answer all of their questions. Wouldn’t you?
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I think we can be pretty sure that working class parents in the same circumstances would have been pilloried by the media in the UK. It is also highly unlikely that we would still be talking about their child now.
Well I think that many of us have been on holiday with small children and we've ended up bringing all the kids to one of the apartments and taken it in turns to look after them there or chosen to socialise in that apartment en mass. It's not difficult. I don't personally have kids but I've mucked in with everybody else in situations like this. It's what you do and if everybody takes their turn then it's not much of an effort. A lot harder to murder or abduct a kid that's being correctly supervised.