Scott and Laura Castle

[Milktray]

Completely agree with all that you've said.
I too was hoping the jury don't believe her blatant lies, I had a horrible thought that maybe she'd try to pull the MH route in her own favour, sounding like she was any other desperate mum who was struggling with a baby's consistent crying. And didn't know the harm or wrong in what she was doing, she certainly did. She thought nothing of slapping him so hard across the face that neighbours heard it. She's a vile piece of and I hope those jury members don't feel pressure or obligation to give her a lesser charge (manslaughter as opposed to murder) from the postpartum point of view, as we are all aware of how terrible and common PPD/PPP(?) is among new mums with babies. Laura Castle is trying to make it sound like she's someone similar to a new mum struggling badly with either postpartum depression or psychosis. But she wasn't, she was short tempered and callous, and not even his birth mother.


The reporting is awful honestly there must be so many details missed out, I understand its a smaller news outlet but that doesn't stop the court reporters in other cases reporting for other local papers.

The reporting is truly awful...and I initially thought Wales Online (and affiliates) was bad. This is 100x worse.

I really hope they dismiss any PPD/MH opinion. Many mums out there suffer from PPD, depression and frustration but it doesnt lead to killing a child.
She had so much support and all she had to do was say 'Take this child back now, I seriously can't cope and I'm scared of hurting him'.

Thing is, I know you have kids, it is bleeping hard at times and honestly it's frustrating when they won't stop crying...but as a mum, you put the child's needs over that frustration. You find a way. I remember when my youngest was 2 and she was up at 3am every night. We tried everything going and in the end, we just let her sleep with us because it was the only thing that seemed to work. Of course we created a rod for our own backs but my daughter was content and it just meant we could sleep.

 

[thaliamay]

The reporting is truly awful...and I initially thought Wales Online (and affiliates) was bad. This is 100x worse.

I really hope they dismiss any PPD/MH opinion. Many mums out there suffer from PPD, depression and frustration but it doesnt lead to killing a child.
She had so much support and all she had to do was say 'Take this child back now, I seriously can't cope and I'm scared of hurting him'.

Thing is, I know you have kids, it is bleeping hard at times and honestly it's frustrating when they won't stop crying...but as a mum, you put the child's needs over that frustration. You find a way. I remember when my youngest was 2 and she was up at 3am every night. We tried everything going and in the end, we just let her sleep with us because it was the only thing that seemed to work. Of course we created a rod for our own backs but my daughter was content and it just meant we could sleep.

Oh absolutely. If you have children they should come first. Many of us have felt overwhelmed in parenting, it's natural. What's not natural is her battering a 1 year old and saying it's okay as she was supposedly hit as a kid. Doesn't make it right.

Typo there did you mean I know if you have kids not I know you have kids

 

[Tots]

Terrible reporting the last few days, no details given. The daily mail has covered it a little bit the last few days too.

 

[Milktray]

Oh absolutely. If you have children they should come first. Many of us have felt overwhelmed in parenting, it's natural. What's not natural is her battering a 1 year old and saying it's okay as she was supposedly hit as a kid. Doesn't make it right.

Typo there did you mean I know if you have kids not I know you have kids

Oh God yeah! I was trying to do 2 things at once! It didn't come out too well.

 

[GingerJones50]

Today has been awful. She was smacking him when he was 9 months old and SC stood back and watched by his own admission and said it wasn’t abuse!

It’s so sad. They said if he wouldn’t settle they just left him to it and ‘joked’ about wrapping him in duct tape.

This is going terribly for the Castles. They’re so callous. Saying ‘Oh he woke up in the night so we couldn’t cope’. I had twins and me and my husband were so tired he completely forgot AN ENTIRE TRIP TO IRELAND to see his family. We never smacked them or shouted abuse at them.

And all the ‘he didn’t like us’, ‘he seemed happier at his foster carers’. He was a baby who was on the 3rd set of parents in his first year. He was unsettled and confused and needed patience and love to settle. Not beatings. Poor little soul.

Terrible reporting the last few days, no details given. The daily mail has covered it a little bit the last few days too.

It’s odd. The BBC has had the best reporting so far. It does make me wonder, Star Hobson, Arthur Labinjo, Logan Mwangi were all very photogenic. It’s sad if Leiland isn’t getting the same coverage for that reason.

We tried everything going and in the end, we just let her sleep with us because it was the only thing that seemed to work. Of course we created a rod for our own backs but my daughter was content and it just meant we could sleep./QUOTE]

Oh we did the same with the twins. I had one, husband had the other. Every morning I used to have to get up and wash one twins head because it smelt of my husband’s armpit! I remember nights cycling colicky twins legs to settle them. But as long as you get some sleep it’s worth it.

 

[thaliamay]

SC is a spineless drip of a bloke. He clearly knew what his missus was capable of, he was complicit in physically smacking this poor child and seemed to think that was perfectly acceptable discipline despite the fact they'd been trained by SS in regards to parenting advice,was all available to them.
Stupid man, claiming leathered meant being given a gentle slap. Liar. And neither would be OK. The fact they both acted and thought the same way, it's sad as it left Leiland with no one truly in his corner to protect him.

 

[Keelz11]

SC is a spineless drip of a bloke. He clearly knew what his missus was capable of, he was complicit in physically smacking this poor child and seemed to think that was perfectly acceptable discipline despite the fact they'd been trained by SS in regards to parenting advice,was all available to them.
Stupid man, claiming leathered meant being given a gentle slap. Liar. And neither would be OK. The fact they both acted and thought the same way, it's sad as it left Leiland with no one truly in his corner to protect him.

He’s a total liar he knows exactly what leathered meant it’s a very common saying here

 

[thaliamay]

He’s a total liar he knows exactly what leathered meant it’s a very common saying here

I still can't believe he was allowed out on remand before this trial. Free until court. Lord I hope he's found guilty of causing & allowing.
I hope he didn't have access to the other child in the meantime?

 

[Keelz11]

I still can't believe he was allowed out on remand before this trial. Free until court. Lord I hope he's found guilty of causing & allowing.
I hope he didn't have access to the other child in the meantime?

No idea there hasn’t been one mention of her which I find strange

 

[Wouldn'tYouLikeToKnow]

Jesus. These pair are something else.

In December Mrs Castle texted her husband, who was on a night shift at BAE Systems, telling him: "He just had another rit. I really lost the plot and leathered him. I'm at my wits' end. I'm a midge's d*ck away from ringing Penny [the social worker] to come and get him."

Mr Castle replied: "He's becoming a right d*ck. I don't like him at the moment either."

But he told the court he thought his wife was exaggerating. In other messages, Mrs Castle told her husband: "I don't want to be this mum at all. I really hate him. The more he does it the more I don't want to do this anymore. He makes me so angry".


Taken from: https://www.lancs.live/news/local-news/dad-said-hated-baby-leiland-23941988.amp

I still can't believe he was allowed out on remand before this trial. Free until court. Lord I hope he's found guilty of causing & allowing.
I hope he didn't have access to the other child in the meantime?

A friend of a friend, who admitted child cruelty following the death of her child was free to roam the streets whilst police were investigating, was pregnant too, thankfully that child was removed and placed with family, without contact.
So I assume that would be the case here.

Very much off topic but that haunts me to this day tbh, she was my next door neighbour's friend, I was told by my neighbour her child had died, but didn't ask questions. I was heavily pregnant, one of the first things she did upon meeting me was offer me her child's clothing - several bags of it.

It came out around 2 years later what had actually happened.

 

[thaliamay]

Jesus. These pair are something else.

In December Mrs Castle texted her husband, who was on a night shift at BAE Systems, telling him: "He just had another rit. I really lost the plot and leathered him. I'm at my wits' end. I'm a midge's d*ck away from ringing Penny [the social worker] to come and get him."

Mr Castle replied: "He's becoming a right d*ck. I don't like him at the moment either."

But he told the court he thought his wife was exaggerating. In other messages, Mrs Castle told her husband: "I don't want to be this mum at all. I really hate him. The more he does it the more I don't want to do this anymore. He makes me so angry".


Taken from: https://www.lancs.live/news/local-news/dad-said-hated-baby-leiland-23941988.amp



A friend of a friend, who admitted child cruelty following the death of her child was free to roam the streets whilst police were investigating, was pregnant too, thankfully that child was removed and placed with family, without contact.
So I assume that would be the case here.

Very much off topic but that haunts me to this day tbh, she was my next door neighbour's friend, I was told by my neighbour her child had died, but didn't ask questions. I was heavily pregnant, one of the first things she did upon meeting me was offer me her child's clothing - several bags of it.

It came out around 2 years later what had actually happened.

That link, omg.
So basically he wasn't allowed to do the toilet, wasn't allowed to spit out Weetabix, wasn't allowed up for a cuddle, what was he allowed to do without angering this woman.


Re your story, That must be eerie when something like that happens close to home. So sad.

 

[Kam2243]

Oh god that beautiful beautiful baby. I can’t have any more children (unexplained infertility) even though I am lucky enough to be a Mother already and would have loved to add to our family. That baby should have known love his entire life. So many families would have loved and cherished him. How confused and distraught he must have been to be taken from a loving foster home to this hell.

Why has this case not been reported on as extensively as Star and Arthur’s?! How on earth did they get through the adoption process. The SCR will be an interesting read for sure.

 

[MrsJones83]

I have a 13 month old. She doesn’t walk yet. That doesn’t make her lazy.

Sometimes she spits food out. Sometimes it’s because she thinks it’s funny. Sometimes it’s because she doesn’t like it/ she’s had enough. It’s what kids do. But you learn to read them, and understand them, and it’s our job to teach them.

She’s had the occasional bruise on her leg where she’s crawled over-a toy.

I’ve never felt an urge to snack, or shake or pinch her. Ever. They’re babies, they don’t know how to be spiteful, or malicious or nasty,

They weren’t cut out to be parents, why on earth did they keep going.

 

[GingerJones50]

No idea there hasn’t been one mention of her which I find strange

This is standard. Other children in the relationship are not allowed to be mentioned at all in reporting. It was the same in the Logan Mwangi trial, his baby brother was not ever mentioned in reporting once.

 

[Tots]

Closing addresses being given on Monday. She’s definitely guilty, but I suspect jury will go for manslaughter.

 

[MissTeddy]

Closing addresses being given on Monday. She’s definitely guilty, but I suspect jury will go for manslaughter.

prosecution closed today, defence close on Monday.
I think she’s 100% guilty of murder, and he‘s culpable for not removing baby from harm.
I hope the jury see through her lies.
Anyone who smacks an innocent baby is evil.

 

[Wouldn'tYouLikeToKnow]

This is probably gonna sound horrible but I'm really underwhelmed by this trial.
The live reporting is awful so of an evening I end up having a Google and going through the various articles for that day. It seems rather short as well, considering the time taken for other recent trials.
However, it doesn't take away from the seriousness of it all, and I truly hope a guilty verdict is returned.
They're both as bad as each other, making out like they wanted to save a child from the care system yet hated him within days of him being there!
That little boy will never know ANY life because they took it away from him, and that is unforgiveable.

 

[Milktray]

This is probably gonna sound horrible but I'm really underwhelmed by this trial.
The live reporting is awful so of an evening I end up having a Google and going through the various articles for that day. It seems rather short as well, considering the time taken for other recent trials.
However, it doesn't take away from the seriousness of it all, and I truly hope a guilty verdict is returned.
They're both as bad as each other, making out like they wanted to save a child from the care system yet hated him within days of him being there!
That little boy will never know ANY life because they took it away from him, and that is unforgiveable.

It almost feels like they are treating it as an 'open and shut' case.
Laura Castle admitting that she killed Leiland (albeit not intentionally, she claims) has likely thrown half the prosecution case out the window. So rather than spend weeks of proving that she did kill him, they now only bring up evidence that it was intentional.

The thing is, aswell, there was no dispute that SC was asleep - so there was none of 'whose fault was this'. Again, prosecution only need to prove that SC allowed Laura to cause serious harm.

Oh definitely guilty, the court know that Laura is at least getting manslaughter. I don't think *they* care so much about SC, he'll get a slap on the wrist, no doubt.

 

[Tiare Tahiti]

I keep thinking about Leiland's smiling happy little face, and the terror this darling child must have experienced before he was finally murdered. How confused and helpless this sweet little boy must have felt. It makes me physically ill.

People get overwhelmed. People get frustrated. People fail to bond with children, for whatever reason. But why didn't they just tell social services it wasn't working, and give Leiland back so he could be with someone who loved him? They had such an easy way out.

 

[Milktray]

I keep thinking about Leiland's smiling happy little face, and the terror this darling child must have experienced before he was finally murdered. How confused and helpless this sweet little boy must have felt. It makes me physically ill.

People get overwhelmed. People get frustrated. People fail to bond with children, for whatever reason. But why didn't they just tell social services it wasn't working, and give Leiland back so he could be with someone who loved him? They had such an easy way out.

I struggle to see where Laura's maternal feeling was and her true motives to adopt.
SC was obviously just going along with it. He worked at BAE Systems and if he worked the same number of hours as those in Woodford used to work, then he would have rarely been at home. He would have been going off what Laura had told him and using that to punish Leiland.
SC comes out as weak...he is guilty for allowing it.

I can only think Laura was one of these people who liked attention or wanted to be seen as a 'do-gooder'.
Going down the adoption route is not easy, it requires alot of maternal desire and dedication. I mean even just thinking about adoption/starting the ball rolling conversation wise is a journey.
To finally have a child, after such a lengthy process, should be the most precious gift.

And whilst I can totally understand that an adoptive parent can suddenly feel overwhelmed and not have a bond with that child...in that case, you do the right thing and hand them back.
I completely fail to understand why a person who would go through the strong desire for a child to then go on and abuse/kill them. (But it's ok, because they made their feelings known to Child Services.)

It makes you wonder if this is all a game that Laura is playing. Did she want to have a child to love or did she always intend on inflicting pain on to a baby? Was her motive for adoption genuine or was she always evil?