Michael Jackson

[Upintheair83]

I think the film is typical Jacksons- using MJ to get their money rolling in.
I do think its nice for Prince and Blanket to celebrate their dad for his musical achievements. They've lived most of their lives hearing the allegations about their father, discussing their father as though he wasn't their dad just because they dont share the same DNA. And so, for them, I'm really pleased they can celebrate him and what he achieved in his professional life and have something that isnt tainted with controversy.
Whatever anyone thinks of MJ now, he was a pioneer in the music industry, especially for black artists and his achievements in music were groundbreaking. He was genius.

I was a massive fan of MJ but as iv grown older, I do see him in a more 'real' light now. He displayed massive red flags and I certainly wouldn't have allowed him near my child.
Every box of how to spot a predator, he does tick.....having said that I do strongly believe that Michael was a victim himself.
I really believe when he was little boy he was most probably abused. (I don't mean just by his father, I think the physical abuse was separate) But he was a young kid, in rooms and studios with older men. Powerful men. And we only have to look at Epstein and the rumours that go around in hollywood about powerful men...He would also be on the road with his brothers from a young age, in nightclubs- around all sorts of men. Safeguarding wasn't really a thing back then either. You only have to see how damaged Justin Bieber is now, to see how child stars are almost doomed from the start. I'm not excusing his behaviour, I'm not saying that the abused always abuse either. Because they don't.
I dont think Michael was a 'normal' person, with 'normal' experiences either, so it's almost inevitable that he turned out the way he did. I think alot of his eccentricities bore out of him not understanding himself -He was a total narcissist, ego driven, he wasn't emotionally intelligent either- he seemed stuck emotionally in his teenage years with no one ever really on his side, or to look out for him or to guide him. And so il be honest, I do feel sorry for the young Michael Jackson, that little boy who did just want to play- I don't think he ever had a chance, and I think he was pimped out in more ways than one. I'm not condoning his choices as an adult at all, but I will always have empathy for him as a child.
I don't believe all of his accusers either, there are some I really struggle to take seriously but I do think they should all have their voices heard and people to make their own minds up- every victim should be listened to.
But Michael Jackson never stood a chance either.

 

[Web30]

Paris has made it clear she thinks it's nothing more than a cash grab from people who were already wasting his money who don't care if some if not a lot of it is fiction.

https://www.archive.is/oldest/https...iticises-sugar-coated-biopic-about-her-father

Pop witch is also talking about him today with some known stories that used to go around about him.say

View attachment 3972734
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Aaron Carter always had good things to say about him didnt he? Or am I thinking of someone else.

 

[Miss Havisham]

Until fairly recently, I believed that MJ was likely to be innocent. I felt that he had various issues - and was somehow, almost a child trapped in an adults body.
I watched a few documentaries on him very recently (including the recent BBC doc). I realised that I previously knew little about the accusations made against him, and various timelines. I now see him as a manipulative, calculating man.

I do feel that not all his accusers will be genuine - even Saville had some people making false allegations against him, once his offences became official (though after his death ). I do believe he abused children, but he felt that he was smart enough to also have his “friendships” with children that he did not abuse. Knowing full well, that these children will be his “evidence” of innocence.
Even his marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. Hastily arranged after allegations made against him. I don’t know if she knew she was being manipulated - but what an absolute sham.

 

[Ivegone]

I think we should separate private and professional you can hate the a of someone but still admire their music
There's loads of artists who are tainted but have brilliant music

 

[skysky101]

I think we should separate private and professional you can hate the a of someone but still admire their music
There's loads of artists who are tainted but have brilliant music

I couldn't listen to a Gary Glitter song in all good conscience.

 

[Abominatrix]

I think we should separate private and professional you can hate the a of someone but still admire their music
There's loads of artists who are tainted but have brilliant music

What I wish would come of stuff like this is people would stop worshipping celebrities. Love their output, their talent, but understand that these are strangers with their own closets full of skeletons.

I know that will never happen, but it's the only solution that really makes sense. I adorded Jackson as a child, being raised on Jackson 5 and his own music, I remember excitedly waiting for the big premieres of his videos Black or White and Remember the Time. Absolutely loved Moonwalker, minus the story parts because that's tit odd as hell. But he turns into a damn car and flies away! Loved it.

He got weirder as we got older, and the accusations came out and boy do I believe every bit. Neverland was a nightmare place and grown men are very often sick ducks. Still love his music, would be happy to never see his face again.

 

[shellie]

Safechuck wanted his wedding at Neverland. Weird to want to get married at a place you were allegedly abused at isn't it?

Every victim is different so it isn't really that straight forward. Some realise at the time it's wrong but are too scared to say anything, some bottle it up then later in life admit to it because some kind of trigger brings everything back. Then there are whose who go to the grave denying everything even if there is evidence proving otherwise.

Here is a page explaining why so many victims defend their abusers/groomers.

6 Stages of Grooming Adults and Teens: Spotting The Red Flags | Skills for Health

There are different types of grooming - sometimes carried out by an individual to an individual, such as online grooming and child sexual abuse, and other times it is executed by a group of conspiring perpetrators.

www.skillsforhealth.org.uk

 

[Tangerine Cat]

I think the film is typical Jacksons- using MJ to get their money rolling in.
I do think its nice for Prince and Blanket to celebrate their dad for his musical achievements. They've lived most of their lives hearing the allegations about their father, discussing their father as though he wasn't their dad just because they dont share the same DNA. And so, for them, I'm really pleased they can celebrate him and what he achieved in his professional life and have something that isnt tainted with controversy.
Whatever anyone thinks of MJ now, he was a pioneer in the music industry, especially for black artists and his achievements in music were groundbreaking. He was genius.

I was a massive fan of MJ but as iv grown older, I do see him in a more 'real' light now. He displayed massive red flags and I certainly wouldn't have allowed him near my child.
Every box of how to spot a predator, he does tick.....having said that I do strongly believe that Michael was a victim himself.
I really believe when he was little boy he was most probably abused. (I don't mean just by his father, I think the physical abuse was separate) But he was a young kid, in rooms and studios with older men. Powerful men. And we only have to look at Epstein and the rumours that go around in hollywood about powerful men...He would also be on the road with his brothers from a young age, in nightclubs- around all sorts of men. Safeguarding wasn't really a thing back then either. You only have to see how damaged Justin Bieber is now, to see how child stars are almost doomed from the start. I'm not excusing his behaviour, I'm not saying that the abused always abuse either. Because they don't.
I dont think Michael was a 'normal' person, with 'normal' experiences either, so it's almost inevitable that he turned out the way he did. I think alot of his eccentricities bore out of him not understanding himself -He was a total narcissist, ego driven, he wasn't emotionally intelligent either- he seemed stuck emotionally in his teenage years with no one ever really on his side, or to look out for him or to guide him. And so il be honest, I do feel sorry for the young Michael Jackson, that little boy who did just want to play- I don't think he ever had a chance, and I think he was pimped out in more ways than one. I'm not condoning his choices as an adult at all, but I will always have empathy for him as a child.
I don't believe all of his accusers either, there are some I really struggle to take seriously but I do think they should all have their voices heard and people to make their own minds up- every victim should be listened to.
But Michael Jackson never stood a chance either.

I think the same as I always have. He abused those boys because they knew about the vitiligo marks on his pen. There’s no excuse for that.

I still think he’s the reason Macauley Culkin went off the rails but he’s not going to come out and say anything because MJ’s weird fans would hound him and nobody would be interested in giving him a job anymore because admitting abuse hasn’t helped anyone’s career has it?

He groomed the world talking about his abusive childhood though. I don’t buy that he wanted to play with children because he didn’t have a childhood himself, he still had choices like we all have and most of us choose not to repeat the mistakes. We still grow up and want to have adult experiences rather than childhood ones. Having said that I do recognise all of his family seem to be very strange.

Michael was a hard nosed businessman when he wanted to be, the only thing I‘m not surprised about is that he ended up on drugs and dead much earlier than he should have.

He’s a mercurial character though, I can still appreciate his music - well everything before Bad was incredible, after that it all went a bit meh.

 

[Okivia2020]

I think he had a god like complex. You only have to look back and see how he walked around with the umbrella, he wants three kids, he got them, he wants a playground built for him in his house, done, he wants to change his skin colour, ok we can make that happen. I don’t buy all that child like behaviour with his “Peter Pan” stuff and his high pitched innocent voice and do believe he abused young boys. It can also be true he had a messed up childhood. He also did have some great songs. I don’t think he would get away with it these days

 

[Ivegone]

What I wish would come of stuff like this is people would stop worshipping celebrities. Love their output, their talent, but understand that these are strangers with their own closets full of skeletons.

I know that will never happen, but it's the only solution that really makes sense. I adorded Jackson as a child, being raised on Jackson 5 and his own music, I remember excitedly waiting for the big premieres of his videos Black or White and Remember the Time. Absolutely loved Moonwalker, minus the story parts because that's tit odd as hell. But he turns into a damn car and flies away! Loved it.

He got weirder as we got older, and the accusations came out and boy do I believe every bit. Neverland was a nightmare place and grown men are very often sick ducks. Still love his music, would be happy to never see his face again.

Yeah we do need to stop it. Some fans are so rabid and everyone people and farts

 

[Upintheair83]

I think the same as I always have. He abused those boys because they knew about the vitiligo marks on his pen. There’s no excuse for that.

I still think he’s the reason Macauley Culkin went off the rails but he’s not going to come out and say anything because MJ’s weird fans would hound him and nobody would be interested in giving him a job anymore because admitting abuse hasn’t helped anyone’s career has it?

He groomed the world talking about his abusive childhood though. I don’t buy that he wanted to play with children because he didn’t have a childhood himself, he still had choices like we all have and most of us choose not to repeat the mistakes. We still grow up and want to have adult experiences rather than childhood ones. Having said that I do recognise all of his family seem to be very strange.

Michael was a hard nosed businessman when he wanted to be, the only thing I‘m not surprised about is that he ended up on drugs and dead much earlier than he should have.

He’s a mercurial character though, I can still appreciate his music - well everything before Bad was incredible, after that it all went a bit meh.

I agree, and that's why I said that I feel sorry for him as a child. I truly suspect he was sexually abused as a child- he was in hollywood from a young age- in a time that no one would ever believe or care if a little black boy was a victim. He was sold to the highest bidder in hollywood and I think we would all be naive to think that no abuse happened to him. But I also think that because of his fame, his family and also his own god-like complex, is why he ended up the way he did. He was a complete and utter mess.

And so I suppose I find the whole story sad- the cycle of abuse that goes on- but not just in MJs story, in a lot of stories too. And I admire those adults who stop the cycle of abuse and don't use excuses to take away the innocence of others, and dedicate their lives to make sure it never happens again.

It's the saddest fact that adults let children down time and time again, and in his adult life Michael did the same to the children he abused.
I just think that all abuse victims deserve sympathy- of course some grow up and go on to abuse too- and some dont- but it still doesn't stop me having sympathy for all of them as a child.
Adults have so much to answer for at times, childhood should be treasured and looked upon as the most sacred gift in this world. I actaillt despair for humanity at times that we even have to think about CSA.

 

[Prince fan 1999]

I think he had a god like complex. You only have to look back and see how he walked around with the umbrella, he wants three kids, he got them, he wants a playground built for him in his house, done, he wants to change his skin colour, ok we can make that happen. I don’t buy all that child like behaviour with his “Peter Pan” stuff and his high pitched innocent voice and do believe he abused young boys. It can also be true he had a messed up childhood. He also did have some great songs. I don’t think he would get away with it these days

The umbrella was because of his vitiligo. The vitiligo was the reason for the skin change.

 

[MsPelzer]

I cannot listen to his music because he was a pedalo. He paraded his favorite child stars around like trophies. I also feel he messed with Lisa Marie Presleys son.

 

[Prince fan 1999]

I cannot listen to his music because he was a pedalo. He paraded his favorite child stars around like trophies. I also feel he messed with Lisa Marie Presleys son.

You can't throw around accusations because of a feeling you have FFS Jesus Christ

 

[Tangerine Cat]

I cannot listen to his music because he was a pedalo. He paraded his favorite child stars around like trophies. I also feel he messed with Lisa Marie Presleys son.

Interesting thought. He had mental health problems and committed suicide didn’t he? I guess we’ll never know if there’s any truth in that or it was the result of being born into vast wealth without any purpose in life.

 

[Upintheair83]

Alot of fans dont like Lisa Marie because she bashed MJ after their divorce....but actually a few years before Lisa Marie's death, she did an interview where she talked about MJ...she said any anger she had towards him had subsided and she felt deep regret she couldn't 'save him'
She said she was the only one who could even comprehend the fame and the problems that come from fame, because it was so similar to her dad's level of fame. She said both lived in an ivory tower where they could pick up and dispose of people at their will. A place where they were surrounded by sycophants and where there was no accountability.....why anyone would ever want fame is beyond me. Lisa lost alot for the price of fame, I hope she's at peace with her dad and son now.

 

[magsmagsmags]

Could anyone recommend a good documentary about his life? I feel like I actually know very little and would like to before I see the movie (not all that keen on seeing it but promised a friend I’d tag along)

 

[Upintheair83]

Could anyone recommend a good documentary about his life? I feel like I actually know very little and would like to before I see the movie (not all that keen on seeing it but promised a friend I’d tag along)

I find the new BBC one a very fairly balanced one. Not too much in favour of him, but doesn't bash him totally either.
I feel its honest and unbiased. Definitely one of the better ones and iv seen and read almost everything on him that's out there. It doesn't shy away from the uncomfortable truths but also remains balanced.

 

[MarshMallowMonster]

Watch also the Channel 4 ones for balance.

 

[Upintheair83]

Watch also the Channel 4 ones for balance.

Or maybe the updates from the trial of 2005?... you can find online where he was tried in a court of law as any living American citizen is-you know, with a jury, a judge, evidence against him, evidence on his defence, victims testimony, eye witnesses. Not a documentary that is purely one sided with no defence, how is that fair in any way? Its like saying go and watch a documentary that is purely fan fiction of his innocence. I understand we need to hear what the accusations are, but at the same time it's hardly balanced. I hope you aren't called for jury service any time soon.
I can't stand the fans that protest his innocence all the time, completely blind sided and romanticising his music and legacy, but equally i think its unfair to believe every accusation sent his way when we don't have any evidence. This is why we have a justice system in place.