Apologies, I wasn’t meaning my post to read as defending MJ or paedos and could have worded it much better. I was only questioning the Bashir interview element of his story but that doesn’t excuse his abuse of so many.
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I don't know how anyone could watch Leaving Neverland and not believe those men. It was one of the most compelling and heartbreaking things I've ever watched, that was 6-7 years ago and everyone just brushed over it.
Now with this new biopic that's a total biased account produced by (and starring) his family, I wonder if the conversation will come up again.
Now with this new biopic that's a total biased account produced by (and starring) his family, I wonder if the conversation will come up again.
I didnt believe them, not fully. One of the story's took place in a building that didnt exist till years later for a start.
read this,
I think MJ was dodgy as they come but that documentary was filled with false and fake scenarios. I don’t believe Wade one bit because of that doc.
Also to note from that article: As for Jackson’s legacy — let us remember not a single dollar goes into his pockets anymore. He is dead. According to his will, his money should be benefiting his elderly mother, his children who have been orphaned, and charity. To date, his estate has brought in at least $1 billion since his death. That means, if his wishes are followed, there’s about $200 million to spare for charities. That’s probably more than any living celebrity has given to charity lately.
Watching the first ep of this, so Gavin hadn't seen MJ for a year and a half and was invited along for the Martin basher interview. Didnt they make out like he lived there full time? Clearly his mum saw it as a way back in and said yes to it.
Are you seriously saying we should absolve him of any wrong doing because he gives a lot of money to charity?! Maybe we should say the same about Jimmy Savile as well if we are going down that route?
I didn't believe a word of leaving neverland or the accusers in it. Do I think MJ was a child predator? I think it's more than likely. But I never thought Gavin Arvizo or the accusers in LN were credible at all. I think they were all chancers with agendas of their own. I also believe MJ was molested as a child- I think the signs are all pointing that he was. And I think the cycle went on unfortunately.
I believe the NL content.
Kids have hazy memories about buildings and timelines. But not about abuse.
MJ was a predator. He gave to charity with one hand and with the other he abused kids.
He was a genius performer. Genius musician. He has a strong fan base still after all this time. I even went to an awesome MJ concert.
But he was a paedophile.
Kids have hazy memories about buildings and timelines. But not about abuse.
MJ was a predator. He gave to charity with one hand and with the other he abused kids.
He was a genius performer. Genius musician. He has a strong fan base still after all this time. I even went to an awesome MJ concert.
But he was a paedophile.
I need to finish the show but I had to google when the Gavin abuse allergiedly happened. If this is correct it was after the documentary aired... why would he abuse Gavin while the press were after him for the sleeping in the bed accusations.
Attachments
My issue is that when you start pulling at the threads of ‘things may have been forgotten/confused’ of Leaving Neverland more starts to unravel.
For example, the case of the neverland train station mentioned above. James swore under oath he was abused up until 1992 and after that we was ‘dropped and then replaced by a younger boy once he’d hit puberty’ and that was apparently Michael’s pattern. He says in LN he was abused ‘hundreds’ of times, specifically in the Neverland train station. But the station was not built until 1994, this is a proven fact that can be verified through planning permission documents and video footage from helicopters etc.
Dan reed the director of LN said when asked about this discrepancy on a talk show that ‘the place of abuse is not being disputed but the dates of the abuse are’. However, if we then shift to this timeline where he was abused in the station in 1994 onwards, that means the abuse not only happened 2 years later than previously said in his sworn declaration (so he’s perjured himself) but also James would now be aged 16/17 not a young pre-pubescent when the abuse allegedly happened.
This invalidates their narrative of ‘Michal abused them until they hit puberty and then replaced them with a younger boy’. There are also photos of James with Michael from the set of the teaser for the History album in 1995/96, where James in holding a pink umbrella over Michael. This is years after the alleged abuse yet he is still hanging around with Michael which again questions the narrative getting ’dropped’ after he hit puberty. He’s actually taller than Michael in the photo so definitely is post puberty and in 1995 he would be 17/18 years old.
Wades story likewise has similar issues. In his sworn deposition in 2016 (so after he went public with his accusations) both he and his mom claim on their first trip to neverland the family left the ranch for a couple of days to visit the Grand Canyon before going back to neverland for a few more days then going back to Australia. But in LN, he claims his whole family went to the Canyon without him and left him at neverland on his own and it was then he was first abused. So why has the story changed?
Also, the fact LN doesn’t mention Wade dated Michaels niece for years (during the years of his alleged abuse too) is crazy. The reason it wasn’t mentioned is clearly because it ruins the story of ‘Michael kept them away from girls’ but in reality he was dating the daughter of Jackie Jackson for years.
For example, the case of the neverland train station mentioned above. James swore under oath he was abused up until 1992 and after that we was ‘dropped and then replaced by a younger boy once he’d hit puberty’ and that was apparently Michael’s pattern. He says in LN he was abused ‘hundreds’ of times, specifically in the Neverland train station. But the station was not built until 1994, this is a proven fact that can be verified through planning permission documents and video footage from helicopters etc.
Dan reed the director of LN said when asked about this discrepancy on a talk show that ‘the place of abuse is not being disputed but the dates of the abuse are’. However, if we then shift to this timeline where he was abused in the station in 1994 onwards, that means the abuse not only happened 2 years later than previously said in his sworn declaration (so he’s perjured himself) but also James would now be aged 16/17 not a young pre-pubescent when the abuse allegedly happened.
This invalidates their narrative of ‘Michal abused them until they hit puberty and then replaced them with a younger boy’. There are also photos of James with Michael from the set of the teaser for the History album in 1995/96, where James in holding a pink umbrella over Michael. This is years after the alleged abuse yet he is still hanging around with Michael which again questions the narrative getting ’dropped’ after he hit puberty. He’s actually taller than Michael in the photo so definitely is post puberty and in 1995 he would be 17/18 years old.
Wades story likewise has similar issues. In his sworn deposition in 2016 (so after he went public with his accusations) both he and his mom claim on their first trip to neverland the family left the ranch for a couple of days to visit the Grand Canyon before going back to neverland for a few more days then going back to Australia. But in LN, he claims his whole family went to the Canyon without him and left him at neverland on his own and it was then he was first abused. So why has the story changed?
Also, the fact LN doesn’t mention Wade dated Michaels niece for years (during the years of his alleged abuse too) is crazy. The reason it wasn’t mentioned is clearly because it ruins the story of ‘Michael kept them away from girls’ but in reality he was dating the daughter of Jackie Jackson for years.
they actually changed their dates of abuse multiple times before it went to trial. Initially they claimed it happened pre-documentary but a video was found of them behind the scenes of the documentary talking extremely positive about Michael which they couldn’t explain away. They also claimed they were ‘held hostage’ at Neverland but again, they found that the mother went for a bikini wax and to the dentist during the time they claimed they were being held hostage so all the dates got shifted to after the documentary
.They also said there was a conspiracy for Michael to ‘get rid’ of them by sending them to Brazil in a hot air balloon.
This is all mentioned in the court transcripts. The mother was charged with Fraud after this case, as the mj case actually flagged the fact she was claiming welfare checks whilst concealing her income sources. They also continually fundraised for money for Gavins chemo, whilst they actually had insurance which covered all his medical care. Jay Leno, Chris Tucker and a few other celebrities took the stand saying this family tried to get money out of them too.Arr yes I remember the bikini wax story at the time. Load of bull the whole of it.they actually changed their dates of abuse multiple times before it went to trial. Initially they claimed it happened pre-documentary but a video was found of them behind the scenes of the documentary talking extremely positive about Michael which they couldn’t explain away. They also claimed they were ‘held hostage’ at Neverland but again, they found that the mother went for a bikini wax and to the dentist during the time they claimed they were being held hostage so all the dates got shifted to after the documentary
They also said there was a conspiracy for Michael to ‘get rid’ of them by sending them to Brazil in a hot air balloon.
Wade has always been a grifter and always used his connection to MJ for financial gains. I really don't trust anything Wade Robson says.
Where did I say that?
you've come to that conclusion.I’m simply pointing out that a huge chunk of his estate will go to good causes which will be a good outcome for this biopic which is what that person was talking about?
He groomed the parents as well. You offer the world to someone who has never seen it (it was always families who were poor and had nothing) and claim there is no strings attached and while they might have some issues, many would take it. With them out of the way getting this and that and going here and there, he was free to do what he wanted with the kids. I'm not saying this to absolve the parents because if something is too good to be true then it usually is, but they get to the kids through the parents more than most realise.He was a pedalo. No denying it or sugar coating anything. He had 5 year old boys spend the week with him. Why are people so blinded by celebrity? He was a bad man yet people offered their kids up. Sick
As for people who still refuse to believe it...look at what's come out about Epstein and the others. If you have the money then you can pay your way out of anything but you will eventually be caught. I honestly wouldn't be surprised that if he had lived, there would be more accusations and eventually one would come he wouldn't be able to talk his way out of.
The problem is, Leaving Neverland failed the victims because the director was pushing so hard for a story he wanted to portray that he allowed it to be picked apart with facts proving factually incorrect moments which added more doubt to a story that needed a public backing. I think it did more harm than good to MJs victims and I do believe there are more out there that haven’t come to terms to comprehend what grooming actually is. It’s a shame but yeah, Leaving Neverland was a stupid decision from all involved.
It would be so interesting to see how this would’ve played out if he lived, like I genuinely think he’d be in prison now.
I think if he'd have done those 50 shows it would have finished him off anyway. He wasn't well after years of drug abuse.
Saw this today:
www.independent.co.uk
I wonder what his fans who claim 'the FBI tailed him for years and found nothing' as well as 'They would never look the other way/take bribes to say he was innocent.' are saying now?
FBI concluded Jeffrey Epstein wasn’t running a sex trafficking ring for powerful men, files show
The FBI pored over Jeffrey Epstein’s bank records and emails
I wonder what his fans who claim 'the FBI tailed him for years and found nothing' as well as 'They would never look the other way/take bribes to say he was innocent.' are saying now?
