Jenny Apple #5

[Saydee]

No more pain or fears. So many heartfelt condolences for her loved ones, especially the kids. I'm relieved Mel and her kids were there too, I see she's posted on her IG as well, looks like coordinated timing at play.

I am glad the kids have already been back to school, or stayed as long as they could.

These doctors really seem adept at providing an accurate assessment of the patients' condition. Sadly, their timelines were not far off, although Jenny was on the quicker end, even despite the proton radiation of her LMD that took her hair and cost so much.

Thank you @Saydee for giving us the heads up that she was really doing poorly and death was imminent, it made this sad news easier to expect. Interesting that they quickly turned in the hospital bed in favour of their own where Kyle could lay with her. Quite respectful that Kyle waited 2 days before posting a video with the news.

I hope those who love her will be okay. I have no doubt that she too will probably have a Disney-themed funeral.

Jennys albumin had tanked, she was no longer absorbing nutrients. Yes, she was in the terminal phase which makes it easier when expecting it. Today I just feel sickened, sickened that so so many lose their lifes to cancer and still we are no closer to finding a cure for such a horrible disease.
Kyle's head will be all over now, but in times of reflection I hope he realises that they did everything possible. Only 2 - 3 weeks ago Jenny was still having treatment.
My heart is very heavy for them all.

 

[AhoraM]

Damn. I did not expect that at all. I thought she would make it to Thanksgiving, maybe to the beginning of December. It’s still mind boggling that this could happen to someone so young. Wishing the best for her family.

I totally expected it, it was obvious to me especially from her last Instagram story (short video).

I'm sad about Jenny's life having been cut so short and everything she loved taken away from her. It's really unfair. Everyone else will eventually bounce back, life goes on. Sure, the children will be scarred, and everyone will have to work on their grief and trauma (possibly PTSD for Kyle as a carer), but eventually everyone will move on.

But Jenny shouldn't have suffered and died like that, a woman who was content with the little things. I've known so many unhappy people in my life, and still when I look around I see a lot of people who never seem to be happy no matter who they are and what they have or achieve, and yet for some strange irony they get to live long lives. Of course I'm not saying that those people don't deserve to be alive... you know what I mean, it just hits harder when you see someone like Jenny who was really happy with the simple things, losing her life like that.

In her video diaries, she would get so sad every time she thought about it. She kept saying "I don't understand, I just want to watch my children grow and be with my husband". She really had no other ambitions, nothing grandiose, no big dreams. It's hard to find someone like that in this day and age, in fact I always compare Jenny to a woman from the 1950s.

I've been re-watching so many videos, this time not skipping the mundane stuff that admittedly I find boring and pointless and always skipped before, and let me tell you, I've found a new appreciation for that part too, seeing how excited she got about the little things that a lot of people would take for granted / overlook. She really deserved to be around longer.

 

[Turaj]

They were mentally living in Disney Land where everything has always a happy end. Now reality kicks in and does that with a blast. Kyle and Jenny are now like 2 rabbits looking dazed and confused in the headlights of a car. Very sad to see.

And at the end of the day while I think we can comment on their lifestyle and attitudes on last days ....not sure anyone can really pass judgement on a 30+ year old woman and her husband facing death from such a horrific disease at such a young age. For me it is unimaginable.

 

[Petro48]

Been reading all the insightful comments on the "right" way to deal with young children at a time like this. One of the issues seems to be whether or not the child is old enough to understand what is happening.

Just want to add that "understanding" what is happening is not necessarily the same as being emotionally able to handle it.

Death of a loved one is never easy to experience. I'm 75. In the last handful of years, I have witnessed the deaths of my Dad, Mom, only sibling, and husband, topped off with the death of my 14 year old dog(<yes that counts). At my age that is far from unusual. Am I old enough to understand? Yep. Am I past the age of being emotionally scarred? Nope.

None of the deaths were easy. I was able to deal with the loss in every case. But still struggle daily with the memories of the suffering. I don't know what's best. None of it is easy.

Just some thoughts, I wanted to share.

 

[Morgan578]

It feels a bit intrusive to watch what’s happening now. It’s bizarre to me that they are even considering to pick up the camera.

I don’t believe they are filming the truth, more so they are sharing a story in order to gain views.

It didn’t sit well with me that Jenny apparently isn’t well enough to be transferred ‘she might not survive the journey’ but yet there she is filming, discussing plans for how Kyle could quit his job. I’m a hospice nurse and we have transferred patients right up to the last 24 hours before death if it was their wish.

Either there is no appropriate hospice care in place because of their denial or they have decided she shouldn’t die at home.

It’s been clear to all of us that she’s rapidly declining and yet we have been sold a strange story of clinical trials and hope for the future.

I don’t feel they have ever truly addressed the reality of the situation! I was horrified that Kyle woke her up to tell her she was dying. It’s like it’s total news to them and he couldn’t believe it.

 

[PW212]

@abitworried. I will share this with you. I would venture that most people on her have not lost a parent while at a young age, in a very traumatic way. Most have not had to watch countless hours of their younger selves watching their beloved mother decline and see themselves in obvious worry and anxiety. so although they are young and resilient I can guarantee you that these things will hang over them for decades. It will impact their lives in ways that we cannot fully understand. why do I say this? Because i was a young teen when I had to personally watch my beautiful young mother tragically die right in front of me. Until it happens to you, everything else is wishful thinking. I have carried this guilt and hurt with me every day for decades. I have spent my entire life trying to help others live and be safe. I know that with love and support these kids will be successful in life. I have been very successful myself. But do not mistake that from the trauma of living through this horrible death at such a young age and then reliving it on social media for decades to come. This is why some of us keep being concerned about the way the kids are being filmed, cared for and exposed to all of this. Losing your parent when young vs later in life does impact your life differently. There are many books written on this. I have read most of them. Especially on girls losing their mothers before age 22-24. one great book is “Motherless Daughters”. Give it a read It helps explain things better then I can ever try to.

 

[Saydee]

I was thinking last night how at least Jenny didn't linger very long once they told her she was dying. I think it was only about 6 days but she had so few weeks or months where she was actually feeling well during the 2.5 years after her cancer diagnosis. Not including the months and months she was ill before her diagnosis.

And the damn ghouls are just never going to stop. So disgusting.

From group observations, I find that people who are given a prognosis tend to go downhill very very quickly, whereas those who simply don't want to know and outright state they have no interest in knowing..... they tend to live longer. This tells me the mental side of it plays a massive part.

Jenny had a rubbish couple of years but I believe her anxiety made things a whole lot worse. A good example is worrying that the infusion was going to be the infusion that killed her. Leaving the children and wondering if she would be returning home from having her infusion. Jenny's anxiety was quite extreme.
In my private thoughts, I always hoped that Jenny would start a treatment that would stabilize her for a long length of time. In cancer groups, Kyle & Jenny was always so considerate and thoughtful to other patients. It must have felt a real kick in the teeth at times when they both saw fellow patients doing really well on their treatment.
It is tragic that Jenny felt something was wrong when she first felt shortness of breath and she wasn't taken seriously. Having to actually ask for a scan.
Like my husband, Jenny fell into the "too young for it to be cancer" category. My husband's GP didn't take him seriously either. By the time both were taken seriously, microscopic spread was spreading. I hope and want doctors to treat all patients the same. The "too young for" needs to stop! Young children are left without a parent because their parent wasnt taken seriously.
We are all told repeatedly to go get checked out if something doesn't feel right. Well, thats all good and well, but younger patients have to be taken more seriously when they do go report symptoms.

 

[TryingMyBest]

I think its perfectly natural to have those thoughts. I had them when I was younger and did wonder if hospice speeded up mums death. I then had a complete change of heart when I witnessed another relative pass away, too stubborn to accept any palliative care or hospice care. The difference was worlds apart! My mum had a relatively peaceful passing with the assistance of medications. The relative that didn't accept any help had an absolutely horrible painful traumatic death! And sadly he started begging for help on the day that he died, but he had left it too late to arrange or get any help. The GP arrived with end of life medications 45 minutes after he had passed in the most traumatic and horrific way.

From experience and from discussions and helping with a charity support group I now feel that hospice care def don't speed up the process, but don't attempt anything to delay the process either. The aim of the medications being that the patient feels as little pain and discomfort as possible. Some patients prefer to be as alert as possible and others prefer to be sedated and unaware as possible. I think its about finding the right balance. My husband was given a choice and he chose to have a high dose of sedative which made communicating with him pretty much impossible because he wasnt able to remember anything, but at the same time it made his actual passing comfortable and reduced the trauma for his loved ones.

I know from discussions with patients loved ones and even posts I have read on here that some people have witnessed horrible deaths. It's very sad, especially when it leaves questions.

My mom was on hospice for maybe 2 mos because it was the only way to increase her pain meds. She actually was only a hospice patient because of her age and arthritis pain. When she was transferred from assisted living to a care home for more one on one care she went from singing You Are My Sunshine to me on the phone on Tuesday to being comatose on Thursday. The owner of the home had to leave suddenly and I still swear the night caregiver over medicated her. I found out my only did she have her usual Fetanyl and hydrocodone but he gave her a sleeping pill AND liquid morphine. WTF!

I have no idea why hospice gave the care home liquid morphine. She didn't have it 3 days before at assisted living. She was 89 years old so I didn't make a fuss. She was ready to go. The only awful thing is my son died from a heroin overdose, my dad from my idiot niece giving him her Percodan, my brother who had breathing issues and was on many psych drugs from an idiot dentist giving him 20 Valium which he decided to take and not use his cpap and lastly my mom being overdosed.

Is it any wonder I went thru 8 hrs of colon cancer surgery, 7 days in the hospital with all sorts of complications and only took Tylenol.

Medication can be a miracle and a curse.

 

[carolinew]

All these descriptions of the way family members have died are very enlightening. My mother who died in 2020 at nearly 92 years had something the doctors called terminal agitation. It was terrifying to witness and it haunts me to this day. You read in all the obituaries etc that so and so died peacefully and this was the polar opposite. Didn't help when my ultra religious sister said it was a sign of the devil trying to claim her soul! Imagine my feelings when she said that, especially as my mother was such a kind and gentle person. The whole thing has left me quite fearful.

 

[Saydee]

So Is it just bad luck and another patient could have gone into remission but Jenny’s cancer didn’t respond to the treatment? Lung cancer is one of the worst ones to treat, too isn’t it?

Not many with stage 4 cancer go into remission. Treatment isn't aimed to cure when patients are stage 4, its aimed at extending life only. If their disease goes into remission then its a bonus, but it rarely happens. Even when it does, it rarely lasts. My husband had an amazing response to a trial medication which was amazing. It destroyed all his tumours and scans showed a clear chest, abdomen & pelvis. Just over a year later his scan showed his disease was back but had come back much more aggressive. The oncologist was never happy when my husband reached NED, his words was "go live life to the fullest, we will scan every 12 weeks, but don't be surprised when I am having to break the news to you both that the scan is showing something sinister, it will come back."
His oncologist was correct. My husband had microscopic disease circulating which was too small to show on any scans. Because his oncologist had pre warned us, we wasn't shocked when his disease showed itself again. And in all honesty, my husband couldn't live life to the fullest because the side effects from the trial medication made him very unwell. He was in hospital for almost 3 months!
Lung cancer isn't one of the worst to treat, there are much worse cancers, much much worse, but what makes lung cancer very difficult to treat is if patients have aggressive mutations, and Jenny did. Same with my husband, his cancer was quite common, but he had rhabdoid and sarcomatoid features which made his cancer very aggressive.
Jenny had the EGFR Exon 20 mutation which tends to evade treatment. Hence why Jenny didn't respond to treatments.

 

[Andi6009]

Completely deranged behaviour. Entitlement at it’s best.

I agree but this why people should not monetise cancer, never mind end stage cancer.

Nor should Kyle have posted the two lives. Nor should they have documented the half of what they have done and saying they will documeent to the end.

When it comes to the "end" especially for younger people , believe me , it isnt high on the list of priorities.

When you invite contributions and people are supporting you financially then they do feel "entitled". As the saying goes "if you aren't in the rookery you won't get fired at".

 

[Farblegargoyles]

I have many thoughts but they aren't for today. Rest peacefully Jenny, you deserved to see your children have their own children but life is unpredictable, often wonderful but sometimes very cruel.

Also, thank you to the people on this page. We all have our own opinions but the level of productive debate, acceptance and respect for each others opinions irregardless of how they mesh or don't with our own is a lovely thing to be part of. I hope everyone has a great day

 

[Daisychain4]

RIP Jenny

 

[Farblegargoyles]

Thread suggestion for #6 Thousands of issues but never one tissue.

 

[AhoraM]

You reap what you sow! Her lack of boundaries has created a monster. In the second live stream she literally said that she'd be back ASAP with another live, and then disappeared. All that after saying stuff like "you guys! My family needs you, my kids need you, my Kyle needs you, take care of them please they need you so badly!" Now I understand that she was high but WTF was that, WTF did she expect, WTF does that even mean. Not to mention the "if you have any idea what I should do, leave a comment on my latest Instagram photo". That's what you get with that ridiculous behaviour. She's been feeding the toxic parasocial relationship beast for two years, involving her kids too, slowly but surely escalating it to the point if no return.

 

[TryingMyBest]

From my personal experience (UK based) it was that way.
My husband had advanced care planned to hopefully be at home with support from our local hospice and district nurses to change his syringe driver 24 hourly and administer injections when required. Unfortunately those wishes couldn't be granted because he suddenly declined while in hospital for a planned surgery.
He wasn't able to have a private side room because they was full on all wards. Having to spend time with him whilst on a ward with other patients was difficult for us, and I am sure it was difficult for the patients.
An example: He was on steroids to reduce lung and heart inflammation. The ward staff carried out daily blood sugar checks (due to steroids causing high blood sugars). He was dying with high blood sugar readings, no intervention was taken after carrying out blood sugar checks, therefore it felt pointless to do them.
I requested that the blood sugar checks, skin checks (for pressure ulcers) and observations be stopped. The ward sister agreed and understood but did say they would at least do 24 hourly observations (oxygen, bp, RR & temp).
Would your nursing homes offer the same services as a hospice?
---

I agree with what you say and I think you raised an important point.
Jenny attended ER and has woken to be told that she will likely never leave the hospital. That in itself is very distressing. Leaving home and being told you will likely not be able to return. Very normal reaction.
Jenny had advanced planned for the end. When she was writing cards out for her children she was preparing for her not being around. I don't think hoping for a miracle or more time was bad of them, not at all. I'd say most patients on trials do hope that the treatment will benefit them.
The conversation about Kyle moving on? I admire Jennys strength to be able to say it. It didn't need to happen on a youtube live, but I assume that it was also discussed privately? It must have been for Jenny to know that Kyle thinks Jennys subscribers would be upset if Kyle moves on.
I'm part of a support group for widows who have lost loved ones to cancer. Moving on is a topic often discussed. It's surprising how many couples do have THAT convo prior to dying.

I live in the US in Arizona. We have several actual hospice facilities as well as at home hospice care. My dad was in a beautiful one for awhile. Our hospitals are actually almost exclusively single patient rooms except for during the COVID-19 ordeal and they often had to put 2 patients in a room.

The creepy YouTube dude that filmed his wife actually dead, used all the the GoFundMe money on himself and not his 9 kids, started looking for a wife within a month of his wife's death at least managed to get her home to die with her kids. Her brother chartered a plane and she made it back to the small town but the referring hospital hadn't set up the meds and there was only one hospice nurse and she didn't have the pain meds. They knew she didn't want to die in the hospital so they managed to get her into a hospice facility for her maybe 6 remaining hours.

I wonder if Jenny couldn't go home if they insisted.

Not that this compares but my sweet little doggie went into respiratory failure and was in the ER in an oxygen cage. They told me I couldn't take him home to die because it would be horrible for him and horrible for me. They even had to give him oxygen as he crossed the bridge in my arms.

My mom was on 100mcg Fentanyl patches along with hydrocodone before she passed with hospice care in a care home. She was quite out of it. I don't know how Jenny was coherent at all on 400mcg Fentanyl and anxiety meds and they said other meds as I recall.

It's a horrible situation for that family and I hope she goes quickly and without pain and more suffering. Those kids don't need to see her struggling to breathe.

 

[PW212]

Recap:
jenny was taken to their local hospital bc tests revealed that she had suffered multiple? Pulmonary Emboli? She is not stable enough to be transferred to CoH. She is having difficulty breathing and is in pain. They admitted her for treatment. after seeing her ct chrst results an oncologist? Told them that Jenny was actively dying. Kyle tells us during two live videos yesterday, that Jenny hadn’t been doing so well the past five days. He also said that her left lung is full of cancerous tumours. The family and close friends are gathering. Jenny comes on the video and despite her condition seems very lucid and gives direction to Kyle on what he should do after her passing. Kyle speaks about transitioning to “comfort” care at some point, but at this point we are not sure what level of treatment she is on besides high flow oxygen and pain medication. No other info known at present I believe.

Please feel free to add, edit or correct any missing or wrong info. Lots of details were not given or explained, which is perfectly fine.

 

[Saydee]

I've been busy facing and starting my new life as a widow. Kyle is in the exact same position as I started off in at the start of the year.
When I cry and breakdown, I tend to shut myself off from friends and family because I need to deal with it alone. I honestly can't imagine myself breaking down, and then broadcasting it to youtube. No chance.

I hope Kyle takes time for himself.... away from youtube.

 

[AhoraM]

Sigh, poor Jenny, so unfair.
Kyle said some really beautiful words and I'm glad that Jenny died knowing she was loved, honestly I can't think of a death more surrounded by love than that! It's probably impossible... good job everyone, that was an incredible group effort, Jenny must have been a very special woman to be so beloved by everyone.

I can't help thinking of poor Sarah, she was so sweet too but her passing was very different, with everyone pretending it wasn't happening, and Josh keeping away as much as he could and posting a video after another.

Of course I won't watch Blobby's grief videos. I wish he just stopped filming but he won't, he already announced it. "We love you guys and we'll keep on filming"! Of course you will, Kyle.

I will miss Jenny's videos, I'll keep rewatching the old ones but it feels so sad now. I wish I could believe that she did beat cancer but F that S, she didn't and it effing sucks!

 

[Morgan578]

At this stage there is probably very little to update people on. Jenny has either passed and they are taking time as a family or she is mostly asleep. I lost my mum to the same cancer and she was thankfully unconscious for the last few days of her life and was well medicated. I know there are some strong opinions on Kyle but part of me feels that YouTube and the publicity was Jenny’s love and not his. Kyle may not feel comfortable updating anyone at this point and announcing her passing, if that is the case, will be incredibly difficult for him. Ultimately, she’s the love of his life and the mother of his children who will be the priority right now. It’s a terrible situation.