exactly :/ Zionists have a way to attack and scare people who spread awareness about Palestine and call them anti Semitic so not shocked to see that’s clearly what’s happened here, as a fellow northern Irish person I’d wish she’d have kept it up :/
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This conflict has never been about religion but zionists conveniently bring up anti semitism whenever someone standswith palestine. 
Ehh "zionists calling any criticism of Israel antisemitic is wrong and false" and "antisemitism is a huge problem amongst some who are pro Palestine" are two takes that can coexist and should. I'm pro Palestine but some of the antisemitic rhetoric that is spewed at ordinary Jewish people, many of whom aren't even Israeli and have no connection to the country is ridiculous and honestly cheapens the movement and strengthens Israel's assertions of criticism = antisemitism. That being said I don't really want to get involved into a debate about the Israel Palestine conflict on a forum about influencers.This conflict has never been about religion but zionists conveniently bring up anti semitism whenever someone standswith palestine.
Stating that anyone who supports the Palestinian genocide is Anti-Semitic is not a rhetoric that "should" exist. I agree there's different sides to this, but being Pro-Palestine does not = Anti-Semitism.
This is definitely not the platform for this discussion though! Esp when there's a number of Irish people on this thread...
I am confused by your comment - you are saying people who support the Palestinian genocide (i.e. pro-Israel) are antisemitic? Do you mean the opposite?Stating that anyone who supports the Palestinian genocide is Anti-Semitic is not a rhetoric that "should" exist. I agree there's different sides to this, but being Pro-Palestine does not = Anti-Semitism.
This is definitely not the platform for this discussion though! Esp when there's a number of Irish people on this thread...
Anyway if that is what you meant, I think you are misunderstanding/misreading what I am saying. I said that whilst Zionists call any criticism of Israel as antisemitic and that is wrong and untrue, there is antisemitism amongst some sections of the pro-Palestine movement that can't be denied. There is large number of Muslim majority countries in the Middle East that are anti-Israel and that have oppressive policies towards Jewish people and openly deny the Holocaust. I have seen blood libel even being used as a smear against Israel. I have seen people comparing Jewish people to Nazis when Judaism does not equal Zionism. I have seen people questioning any Jewish person whether they support Israel immediately or calling them names after they mention being Jewish when, again, being Jewish does not equal Zionist. Why does someone who lives in another country and has no connection to Israel receive this when they simply post about celebrating Rosh Hashanah online? This is also not just happening in Muslim majority countries in the Middle East; this happens in the West too.
I remind you that I said I am pro-Palestine but beside how antisemitism is wrong and a form of racism that has been perpetuated for over 2000 years, it also weakens the Palestinian movement and strengthens the arguments of the other side. I think not acknowledging this antisemitism and not openly combatting it is detrimental to the movement.
There's actually a lot of Fundamentalist Christians and Neo-Nazis who support Israel due to antisemitic and Islamophobic views but that's a whole other thing.
Freeing Palestine has NOTHING to do with religion let’s stop bringing that up,
Zionists conflate Zionism with Judaism. Antizionism is not antisemitism
It's not about different cultures/religions, it's a colonising force and those resisting being wiped out and replaced in their own home, anyways FREE PALESTINE
Zionists conflate Zionism with Judaism. Antizionism is not antisemitism
It's not about different cultures/religions, it's a colonising force and those resisting being wiped out and replaced in their own home, anyways FREE PALESTINE
I literally said that. Multiple times. I said multiple times that Judaism does not equal Zionism and that Zionists calling all criticisms of Israel antisemitic is wrong. I have also said twice that I am pro-Palestine. All I am saying is that SOME people use antisemitic rhetoric when arguing against Israel and towards Jewish people in general in the name of Palestine and personally, I think if we don't acknowledge that and openly combat against it, then we are strengthening Israel's assertions that any criticism of Israel = antisemitism and undermining the Palestinian movement. It also attracts people to the movement who we do not want. One bad apple ruins the bunch.Freeing Palestine has NOTHING to do with religion let’s stop bringing that up,
Zionists conflate Zionism with Judaism. Antizionism is not antisemitism
It's not about different cultures/religions, it's a colonising force and those resisting being wiped out and replaced in their own home, anyways FREE PALESTINE
What anti Semitic rhetoric is spewed at Jewish ppl by Palestine supporters? They don’t have to be Israeli, any Zionist should be challenged.
Israel flouts international law and is committing genocide and goes unchallenged. Tbh find it really really hard to feel sorry for ppl who are merely offended by this conversation being openly had when there’s innocent civilians and children who are being bombed and killed because Palestinians dared to resist being evicted by settlers. Israel/Israelis/Israel supporters are absolutely not the oppressed and should not be pandered to under any circumstances. There is no argument, what Israel is doing is ethnic cleansing.
I’m glad Olivia posted about Palestine, I wish she didn’t delete it but I understand that she most likely got a fright and was absolutely jumped on by Zionists in her DM’s. Just yesterday the Ballymurphy inquest proved the British army murdered 10 innocent and unarmed Irish civilians in the north of Ireland so can absolutely understand her support of Palestine.
Israel flouts international law and is committing genocide and goes unchallenged. Tbh find it really really hard to feel sorry for ppl who are merely offended by this conversation being openly had when there’s innocent civilians and children who are being bombed and killed because Palestinians dared to resist being evicted by settlers. Israel/Israelis/Israel supporters are absolutely not the oppressed and should not be pandered to under any circumstances. There is no argument, what Israel is doing is ethnic cleansing.
I’m glad Olivia posted about Palestine, I wish she didn’t delete it but I understand that she most likely got a fright and was absolutely jumped on by Zionists in her DM’s. Just yesterday the Ballymurphy inquest proved the British army murdered 10 innocent and unarmed Irish civilians in the north of Ireland so can absolutely understand her support of Palestine.
Before I say anything else, I think some people think that I am denying what Israel is doing is murder and genocide and that I am Zionist. I am not. I have said that I am pro-Palestine many times. I agree that what Israel is doing is a form of apartheid and is disgusting and that Zionists try to deflect any criticism of Israel by calling it antisemitism and that is wrong. I have said this many times. I understand many Irish people feel strongly about this and don't want anyone to think I am downplaying the atrocities committed by Israel.
However, I did grow up in an area (not in Ireland) with many Jewish people and have personally seen antisemitism perpetuated against them in the name of Palestine. I have seen Jewish friends met with suspicion and skepticism and racism when they want to join groups that are pro-Palestine purely because of their religion. I have seen Jewish friends be shunned by Arab Muslims because "they're probably Zionist". There has been antisemitic vandalism and arson attacks at synagogues in my area from Arab people when there has renewed violence by Israel. I have had Jewish friends post online about celebrating religious holidays (nothing to do with Zionism) and immediately be replied to with "Free Palestine" - people conflating their religious practices with the oppression of Palestine.
Hamas have openly promoted Holocaust denial. Iran has promoted Holocaust denial. Jordan does not allow Jewish people to enter their country with religious items in their possession. Both of these countries are very pro-Palestine. Mahmoud Abbas (leader of the PLO) has published works relating to Holocaust denial and said that Jews were massacred in Europe for centuries due to their "social role related to usury and banks". Jewish people 'controlling' money has been an antisemitic dogwhistle for centuries.
I am not saying that everyone in the movement is antisemitic or uses antisemitism, I am merely saying it exists. Antisemitism alienates Jewish people against joining the Palestine Solidarity Movement and we need to encourage Jewish people to join as Israel banks on Jewish support as their basis for legitimacy. Again, don't really want to get into this on a forum for influencers.
I'm glad to see people like Olivia speaking up against oppression. I'm sick of influencers just going on about "positive vibes" and not using their platform for good.
The way British news is reporting this is sad to see
Headlines about the number of dead in Israel without specifying that the majority are actually Palestinian. Haven’t even seen much about the amount of people displaced in Gaza since last night, or the horrible things being said to Palestinians by Israeli authorities. Everything is on how Israeli people have died (which is equally as sad) or how Israel are the victims
There really is no balance to it
Headlines about the number of dead in Israel without specifying that the majority are actually Palestinian. Haven’t even seen much about the amount of people displaced in Gaza since last night, or the horrible things being said to Palestinians by Israeli authorities. Everything is on how Israeli people have died (which is equally as sad) or how Israel are the victims
There really is no balance to it
I think we are all essentially singing from the same anti oppresion/ anti colonial hymn sheet. I think the issues here of people using this as an excuse for antisemitism as well as Zionists using antisemitism as a way to avoid reproach can both be true. However, its the Palestinians who are dying here!!!!
Its also worth remembering that Palestinians of all religions are being persecuted/displaced (Muslims, Christians and Jewish people)
There are many Israeli and/or Jewish movements who are pro-Palestinian. If anyone is looking to support Na'amod UK are doing great work
Its also worth remembering that Palestinians of all religions are being persecuted/displaced (Muslims, Christians and Jewish people)
There are many Israeli and/or Jewish movements who are pro-Palestinian. If anyone is looking to support Na'amod UK are doing great work
It very hard to find accurate information in the mainstream media about the whole thing especially when you come from a country with a very pro-Israel government. I have seen a lot of "Hamas is shooting rockets at Tel Aviv and Israel is shooting back in retaliation") when I have only seen the videos of the attacks on the Al Aqsa Mosque on social media or given very little airtime. Not exactly unbiased. Does anyone have any reliable journalistic sources that they prefer? I have been using The Guardian mostly.
Just for a crumb of context for anyone reading, this thread used to be part of the Olivia Neill thread hence the references to Ireland and my original comments were in response to several comments from people saying they get accused of being antisemitic because they are pro-Palestine and some of the comments came across as a bit 'the lady doth protest too much' and ignoring how there is some terrible pockets of antisemitism in the movement which ultimately undermines it.
I also think we can be angry about antisemitism in global society (which is often overlooked and has risen leading to violent hate crimes in recent years - Pittsburgh synagogue shooting and Unite the Right Rally come to mind) and the oppression and murder of innocent Palestinians at the same time.
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I meant the opposite! Apologies, I miss-typed.
Finally a thread on here! I’m so deeply upset and saddened by the genocide and ethnic cleansing going on in Palestine 
I’m going to a protest later in the week in my town. But I wish the mainstream media were doing more and reporting from Palestine’s side. The videos circulating are horrifying
I’m going to a protest later in the week in my town. But I wish the mainstream media were doing more and reporting from Palestine’s side. The videos circulating are horrifyingJust came on here to point out that lots of Instagrammers that had BLM posted all over their feed but say nothing about other human right issues should be called out. I particularly am thinking of the ones that continue to promote companies that should be boycotted like Emma Louise Connolly with Puma and Fleur Bell with soda stream.
I expressed anti-Zionist views today as I was accused of being anti-Semitic. Nothing could be further from the truth. My support for the Palestinian people in no way makes me anti-Semitic.
In reality, I often express a certain level of sympathy for the Israeli Zionists as I feel their government programmed them to be this way through a campaign of propaganda and fear. As a population, they are victims of generational trauma. Most Jewish-Israeli citizens can trace back at least one relative who were the victim of Nazi genocide. But their trauma caused the next generations to be distrustful of outsiders, and want to keep their community to themselves. That's the first problem. And then if you put yourself into the shoes of an Israeli-Jew, imagine seeing those deplorable images of concentration camps in your history textbooks. Learning about Nazi crimes and knowing that could have been you had you been born at a different time would really scare you or anger you. They are reminded over and over that they were hated for who they were, and mass-exterminated. I can't even imagine what it would be like to carry that knowledge tbh. But then, they militarize their young people through conscription for Israeli-Jews. And I believe it is this mix of generational trauma and conscription for teenagers that leads to disastrous results. Young IDF soldiers believe that outsiders are conspiring against them, and they must do anything to defend themselves from becoming victims again. It also goes without saying that these soldiers are incredibly young, and given inadequate training (seriously, I've seen videos of IDF teenagers with machine guns that they couldn't even hold correctly!). This is NO way excuses the crimes of the Israeli state, but on some level I find it deeply sad that the descendants of people who suffered some of worst crimes against humanity we have ever witnessed are perpetuating a cycle of abuse and human rights violations. Just something to think about.
With all that being said however, Zionism is intertwined with colonialism and imperialism. Any attempt to create an ethno-state in which one group of people are given preferential treatment over others is always disastrous in terms of human rights. It's ironic that when I criticise the human rights violations in Qatar, Saudi Arabia and/or Sharia law... I'm never called Islamaphobic.
Edit: Evangelical Christians are also a huge problem, literally FUNDING the conflict which no-one ever talks about. They believe the Jews returning to Zion (Israel) is the beginning of Armageddon and all this conflict is further 'evidence' of this. Bunch of quacks. No wonder they believe in Q-Anon too, they're always looking for evidence that the world is ending.
In reality, I often express a certain level of sympathy for the Israeli Zionists as I feel their government programmed them to be this way through a campaign of propaganda and fear. As a population, they are victims of generational trauma. Most Jewish-Israeli citizens can trace back at least one relative who were the victim of Nazi genocide. But their trauma caused the next generations to be distrustful of outsiders, and want to keep their community to themselves. That's the first problem. And then if you put yourself into the shoes of an Israeli-Jew, imagine seeing those deplorable images of concentration camps in your history textbooks. Learning about Nazi crimes and knowing that could have been you had you been born at a different time would really scare you or anger you. They are reminded over and over that they were hated for who they were, and mass-exterminated. I can't even imagine what it would be like to carry that knowledge tbh. But then, they militarize their young people through conscription for Israeli-Jews. And I believe it is this mix of generational trauma and conscription for teenagers that leads to disastrous results. Young IDF soldiers believe that outsiders are conspiring against them, and they must do anything to defend themselves from becoming victims again. It also goes without saying that these soldiers are incredibly young, and given inadequate training (seriously, I've seen videos of IDF teenagers with machine guns that they couldn't even hold correctly!). This is NO way excuses the crimes of the Israeli state, but on some level I find it deeply sad that the descendants of people who suffered some of worst crimes against humanity we have ever witnessed are perpetuating a cycle of abuse and human rights violations. Just something to think about.
With all that being said however, Zionism is intertwined with colonialism and imperialism. Any attempt to create an ethno-state in which one group of people are given preferential treatment over others is always disastrous in terms of human rights. It's ironic that when I criticise the human rights violations in Qatar, Saudi Arabia and/or Sharia law... I'm never called Islamaphobic.
Edit: Evangelical Christians are also a huge problem, literally FUNDING the conflict which no-one ever talks about. They believe the Jews returning to Zion (Israel) is the beginning of Armageddon and all this conflict is further 'evidence' of this. Bunch of quacks. No wonder they believe in Q-Anon too, they're always looking for evidence that the world is ending.
I really recommend a video about Jewish man who rejects Israel, he came to the protest today and hes extremely insightful!
It demonstrates how as a pro-Palestine supporter, I am in no way anti-Semitic because Judaism does NOT equal Zionism.
Im not sure how to share it but this is the video, on this account if anyone would like to watch
It demonstrates how as a pro-Palestine supporter, I am in no way anti-Semitic because Judaism does NOT equal Zionism.
Im not sure how to share it but this is the video, on this account if anyone would like to watch
Attachments
I say this in the kindest way possible but we as a movement need to stop sharing videos and pictures of this group as support for our side. There are other Jewish groups that we can support and share about. They are the Neturei Karta which is a fundamentalist religious group in Israel. They have abhorrent beliefs about women, LGBTIQ people, any other religion etc and use violence against those who disagree. They only don't believe in Zionism because they believe Israel shouldn't be a state until the Messiah comes and that the state of Israel is against God. They believe that when the Messiah comes, Israel will only be for Jews and others will be exiled or killed. They are only sympathetic to the cause because of their wack religious beliefs. They also openly deny the Holocaust. They are not our allies.I really recommend a video about Jewish man who rejects Israel, he came to the protest today and hes extremely insightful!
It demonstrates how as a pro-Palestine supporter, I am in no way anti-Semitic because Judaism does NOT equal Zionism.
Im not sure how to share it but this is the video, on this account if anyone would like to watch
Seems to be the cycle that every 5 years or so it kicks off big style over there. It will be in the media for about a week and half and then suddenly vanish.
Relax, I literally sent the video because I said it was interesting and insightful. I’m not using it as “support for our side”. Nothing more than what I said