House Prices

[JoeBloggs]

I know a lot of good landlords in my job, many rent lower thank market rate for good properties. Some are scum but I’d say most are not.

My parents have just taken on new tenants, theirs is well below market rate. They do no exploit their tenants and they have it as an investment/inheritance for me.

 

[Kim Mild]

One of the most stupid things about the housing market is that buy-to-let landlords can rely on tenants income for getting a mortgage on multiple second properties, but first time buyers can't rely on an income of a lodger. One rule for some, another for others.

It's like how a renter can't use the proof that they can afford , and do pay £x amount on rent each month to get their own mortgage but their rent can pay their landlord's mortgage.

 

[Homebird44]

I know a lot of good landlords in my job, many rent lower thank market rate for good properties. Some are scum but I’d say most are not.

My parents have just taken on new tenants, theirs is well below market rate. They do no exploit their tenants and they have it as an investment/inheritance for me.

Exactly. My relatives are in their 60s, have both ran their own businesses and bought rental properties when the prices were a lot lower. I can't afford certain things but I'm bitter than others can, they've earned their money, they can spend it.

 

[Kim Mild]

It's not like many other businesses. It relys on pricing people out of something essential and is exploitative by nature.

Very parasitic and provides next to no value to society. It's causing untold havoc for the whole of society with people feeling unable to put down roots and being seen as a failure for renting.

It's mainly people that were born at the right time to buy when house prices were affordable and they've now remortgaged to speculate on. They slap themselves on the back at what a great business person they are because they've benefited from the loose lending and printing that keeps causing asset bubbles.

"Most landlords are fantastic" evidence please? Your posts on this thread are interesting . Most landlords are like most businesses and want to make the most money.

Some landlords are money grabby wannabe entrepreneurs, some are people who have invested in property with little expertise and no clue what they are doing despite their best intentions.

However, there are some landlords that have been landlords like forever, these tend to have a fairly decent reputation and have a waiting list . ( I'm basing this on the landlords of my old workplace who had commercial and residential properties)

 

[Bitofthebubbly]

Did some rough maths and worked out we’ve spent over £50k on rent the last 10 years. 50 grand spent on someone else’s mortgage, always on time, zero payments missed, with the knowledge that we can be given 2 months notice to leave at any time. And it counts for nothing when it comes to eventually getting a mortgage. It’s galling.

Fwiw my current landlord is ok, he was an accidental landlord so there have been some minor issues and our kitchen is dated and starting to get a bit thread bear, but on the whole can’t complain. I’m sure there are other decent landlords out there, but the system sucks. People are trapped renting and are exploited by those with wealth.

Shared ownership needs to be abolished. What a tit show that is.

 

[Homebird44]

Of course they'll want to make money, but most landlords have the houses they rent out for a long time. Until wages go sky high and house prices massively drop, I don't know what the answer is. My children are adults now and they know as soon as they leave uni and start working they have to save, or they'll be renting for life. Nothing wrong with that, just make sure you've got a decent pension sorted to keep paying the rent.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

Landlords can’t be nice in the same way businesses can’t be nice. And before I start beef there’s a huge difference between someone moving abroad for a dream job or in with a partner for a year to test the waters and temporarily leasing their home to someone and a for business endeavour.

I live in a lovely area on a nice road and yet the rented houses stick out like sore thumbs, they’ve just not had the same investment in them as owner occupied because….. it eats into profit margins! I don’t think it’s fair to put families in houses with tit double glazing from the 80s or damp, if you wouldn’t live with it why should they? My neighbours rent and take immaculate care of a property their (serial!) land lady can’t be fucked to. The cosmetic work is done but the big ticket items actually reduce their quality of life eg a serious issue with their guttering causing floods through the garden door! Their boiler breaks every few months leaving a family of 4 without hot water for days on end, £3k to get a new boiler would be nothing to her yet she’s too tight to.

Sadly the majority of houses are bought to let (that’s an official figure!) as a lot of people round here are dying off in properties that need serious modernisation (eg central heating putting in, all decor replacing, new kitchen and bathroom immediately as they’re unliveable) the only people who can afford to buy them are developers or LLs. I currently know and love all my neighbours (including renters) but it just takes one tit landlord to buy 3/4 houses and churn through a few awful tenants to really change the dynamic of an area.

This is not saying if you rent you’re not a great neighbour btw, it’s just a concern when it’s in the volumes the market currently sustains? And the sort of LL this market encourages is not a good one. A friend lived next to a LL who rented to an “unhousable” (his words not ours) family as he had a guaranteed tenancy on a shithole paying above market rates. The tit she went through was unreal. It is a huge concern and will undoubtedly be the straw that breaks the camel’s back and pushes us out of London.

ETA - I would welcome social style tenancies on these very old houses. If the council were to use them as a way to buy cheaper stock (not that they’re even cheaper at the moment tho) and fit it out as a council house that would be SO much better for society and the area than landlords trying to squeeze HMOs in every bleeping road

 

[Lanavalentine]

Having property as your pension is a risky game. I do hope your relatives at least have some form of proper pension with tax relief & employer contribution. People are total fools not to take advantage of both!

I think generally we need to move away from this idea that property is the ultimate investment. It’s actually very risky in certain circumstances, but most importantly, it is a driving force behind inequality, and especially poor living standards for those on low incomes.

Edit to add: I think comparing being a landlord to any other business is a bit off-base, too. The vast majority of industries have far higher regulations than the rental housing market, for a start. There are plenty of great landlords out there, sure… but there are also a lot of exploitative ones who take complete advantage of those with no choice, only to line their own pockets.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

I can't afford certain things but I'm bitter than others can, they've earned their money, they can spend it.

You don’t need to be bitter to comment on someone else’s relative privileges. We all have *some* privilege that others don’t benefit from, it’s not a hateful exercise to point out your own or others’.

 

[hollowcrown]

It's also not bitter to be angry or upset at the entire entire market being a complete tit show.

I will never be angry or jealous at someone owning their own property but when they start leveraging that to explot others it's unacceptable.

 

[Homebird44]

You don’t need to be bitter to comment on someone else’s relative privileges. We all have *some* privilege that others don’t benefit from, it’s not a hateful exercise to point out your own or others’.

Oops, that was a typo on my post. Should have said not bitter. I'm not it going to apologise for owning my home, I've gone without a lot and continue to do so. I feel bad for anybody that is stuck in renting.

 

[Lanavalentine]

This is a sombre but excellent read for anyone who fails to understand the relationship between property prices, rental property costs and poverty rates:

The current poverty rate is at its highest ever in the UK.

I don’t know how anyone can look at these figures and justify continuing the system as it currently stands.

Oops, that was a typo on my post. Should have said not bitter. I'm not it going to apologise for owning my home, I've gone without a lot and continue to do so. I feel bad for anybody that is stuck in renting.

I don’t think anyone has asked you to apologise for owning a home. I own a home and yet I’m still very much in disagreement with most of what you say.

Despite the typo, your post implies that people who can’t afford to be landlords might be bitter about it, which is rather ignorant of the actual issues being discussed here. Hope you read the article I’ve linked above.

 

[Homebird44]

I

This is a sombre but excellent read for anyone who fails to understand the relationship between property prices, rental property costs and poverty rates:

The current poverty rate is at its highest ever in the UK.

I don’t know how anyone can look at these figures and justify continuing the system as it currently stands.



I don’t think anyone has asked you to apologise for owning a home. I own a home and yet I’m still very much in disagreement with most of what you say.

Despite the typo, your post implies that people who can’t afford to be landlords might be bitter about it, which is rather ignorant of the actual issues being discussed here. Hope you read the article I’ve linked above.

Thats not what I said.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

I


Thats not what I said.

I can’t fully understand what you write, sorry, but I think your argument depends on the idea that everyone who could afford to become a landlord, would? It’s an awful asset class tbh even ignoring the human exploitation & suffering, I wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole even though we could.

I thought about buying a holiday home in Ireland (we’re both second gen) that would never be rented but even that didn’t sit right due to the conditions of their housing market. Some people are capable of thinking of others.

 

[Homebird44]

Nope,

I can’t fully understand what you write, sorry, but I think your argument depends on the idea that everyone who could afford to become a landlord, would? It’s an awful asset class tbh even ignoring the human exploitation & suffering, I wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole even though we could.

I thought about buying a holiday home in Ireland (we’re both second gen) that would never be rented but even that didn’t sit right due to the conditions of their housing market. Some people are capable of thinking of others.

Nope, somebody mentioned about pensions and I said that my relatives that do own properties that rent out, will use that as their pension. I can just about afford my own house, I wouldn't be able to buy another just to rent out. My sisters landlord was brilliant, used to do all the DIY so that they wouldn't risk losing their deposit.

 

[hollowcrown]

Every time bad landlords are brought up someone is always there to say something like "Well what about my old grandma who is a landlord too she's alright" or brings up one of the few good landlords who do the work that they should be doing at a minimum.

Most people do not have good landlords and that's a problem. Rooms are not redecorated in between tenancies. Houses are cut up and living spaces are removed in order to rent out more bedrooms. Equipment is not fixed in due time and is not high quality. Even landlords that are "good" will aim to cut costs and also throw you under the bus when it suits them.

If landlords in the UK were better I wouldn't mind renting. But they're not which is a big problem.

 

[Anne1448]

Did some rough maths and worked out we’ve spent over £50k on rent the last 10 years. 50 grand spent on someone else’s mortgage, always on time, zero payments missed, with the knowledge that we can be given 2 months notice to leave at any time. And it counts for nothing when it comes to eventually getting a mortgage. It’s galling.

Fwiw my current landlord is ok, he was an accidental landlord so there have been some minor issues and our kitchen is dated and starting to get a bit thread bear, but on the whole can’t complain. I’m sure there are other decent landlords out there, but the system sucks. People are trapped renting and are exploited by those with wealth.

Shared ownership needs to be abolished. What a tit show that is.

Yep I had the same conversation with my banker who said that my current rent (which is 795€) can not be used as a proof that I could spend the same amount for a mortgage. So because I earn 30k I can only get a 105.000€ mortgage which won't even buy me a house in the countryside.

Landlords are charging rents that are close to what massive rental corporations do. Yet, their rentals do not come close in terms of quality. Someone may say that it is simple demand. However because there isn't enough new properties built (at least in Ireland) people are forced to rent these terribly overpriced rentals. When you have the choice between being homeless or renting an overpriced home it is indeed exploitative.

A lot of landlords are boomers who bought these homes for peanuts. Yet, they have no problem locking 3 generations ( Gen X, millenials and Gen Z).

When people are forced to rent forever it means that poverty will rise. And when poverty rise violence and insecurity is near. These governments and landlords better not complain when their neighborhoods will be flooded with homeless.

 

[Clairer86]

Wow, what an interesting thread. Its been really interesting reading all the posts here.
I dont know anything about buying a house. My parents were always in a council house, and my mum still lives in the council house where she raised me and my siblings.
My partner and I, have a mortgage. Our little house is an ex council house on a small estate that was council but i think its all mortgaged houses now.
I have always always always wanted to live in a new build! But my partner who is an electrician said no because he has worked on enough of them to know how they are thrown together and normally have loads of issues a year down the line. But i cant lie, i love New Builds. I dont know if its because im shallow and dont know about houses, or what. But at the time, in my head i thought if we got a new build then we really would have 'made it'. I hope that makes sense, i know i probably come across as a right vain witch here! But i had nothing growing up, i am the first person in my family to go to uni and get a mortgage and have a 'professional' career, so it was probably more of a status thing caused by me not knowing anything about houses. I am very proud of our house though, i mean its nothing special- just your average 3 bedroom, semi detached house. But it needed loads of work doing to it, luckily my partner is an electrician and just generally very good with everything so between him, his plumber friends and his builder friends, we were able to do it up to a really high standard. But i think this is our forever home, im almost 35 and he is 46. We have a friend who has moved houses 3 times during the past 10 years and now lives in a huge beautiful house, but the mortgage is sky high. He is the same age as my partner and i know he is absolutely skint now and he said he wishes he was still in the first house he got.

 

[heretoreaditall2019]

I have always always always wanted to live in a new build!

Oh my love no no no, ex council stock is SO MUCH better made as building standards for council were so much higher back then! You’re in a brilliant solid house!

New builds are awful, I know they look crisp and fresh but a few months in they’re grubby af, all the fittings are cheap and nasty, you pay a premium to buy them but everything needs ripping out and replacing in 2-3 years. I lived in a new build flat and the kitchen was literally disintegrating before us, despite the fact we barely cooked in it - probably 3 dinners a week? And then there’s the issue of re selling them, I’ve heard a lot of people have ended up making a loss, and then you’ve got the cladding scandal, sorry writing this out frantically like a mad woman but you couldn’t give me a new build for free tbh. I know it’s tit to live in the chaos but take the time to ~renovate~ your house and it’ll be a lot higher spec than a new build and worth a lot more too x

 

[Clairer86]

Oh my love no no no, ex council stock is SO MUCH better made as building standards for council were so much higher back then! You’re in a brilliant solid house!

New builds are awful, I know they look crisp and fresh but a few months in they’re grubby af, all the fittings are cheap and nasty, you pay a premium to buy them but everything needs ripping out and replacing in 2-3 years. I lived in a new build flat and the kitchen was literally disintegrating before us, despite the fact we barely cooked in it - probably 3 dinners a week? And then there’s the issue of re selling them, I’ve heard a lot of people have ended up making a loss, and then you’ve got the cladding scandal, sorry writing this out frantically like a mad woman but you couldn’t give me a new build for free tbh. I know it’s tit to live in the chaos but take the time to ~renovate~ your house and it’ll be a lot higher spec than a new build and worth a lot more too x

Oh my god, thats exactly what my partner says about council houses! I just thought he was trying to put me off newbuilds!