Florence Given

[Ranter]

I think there is a reality that Florence Given probably has become as popular as she has because she is white, middle class, pretty and slim. That’s not to discount the work she has done but she is palatable to the masses because of her privileges, I’m not sure that’s entirely a bad thing as more people will be exposed to the ideas than if she had not made the book.

Her brand has definitely evolved from being about her art work to being about herself eg her dancing in her apartment etc etc. I’m not sure feminism is really about that if I’m honest and perhaps the problem is Florence so strongly brands herself as a feminist and she needs to just brand herself as an influencer who sometimes talks about social issues.

I can see why slumflower is frustrated but I don’t think it makes sense to direct her anger at Florence Given because it’s not really about individuals it’s about society as a whole rewarding someone like Florence Given but not Chidera when she made something very similar and that’s not about either of them as individuals but more the way society treats people.

I think Chidera should address the fact she has also taken ideas from others (there’s sex workers and a dating coach who she has allegedly taken ideas from)

As for the books I ordered What a Time to be alone when it first came out, for me I much preferred it to Florence Givens book which I also purchased. But that may be to do with where I was at knowledge wise at each point. I noticed the similarities but honestly didn’t find that surprising. That’s capitalism isn’t it, it a certain type of book sells then you can expect someone to make something similar a few years later. There will probably be another book like both their books in a year or two.

 

[stopthescams]

She reeks of privileged white woman who doesn’t actually believe anything she says. I don’t buy her whole persona whatsoever.

 

[HinchythetwattyGrinchy]

What type of stuff ? I believe we come from the same home town but she's 21 or something isn't she ?

 

[Shopgal]

If they decide sue they are literally suppressing black voices. It plays into the slumflower’s narrative. Honestly at this point I don’t know what she can do without backlash. Florence has said that she hadn’t seen the other book when she wrote her own, the mutual publishers had no issues with the similarities, she’s admitted that all the ideas were derivative anyway and she’s offered a donation to a black charity (which was refused). I get the point that if she needed a diversity reader than maybe she shouldn’t have written a book but what 24 year old would refuse a deAl to make a book based off their Instagram. The issue to me is that too much social capital is being given to people who lack understanding, experience and knowledge. We love to tear them down when they inevitably fail but the truth is she shouldn’t have been on that pedestal to begin with.

 

[oczymlody]

I knew it. She is so obviously full of shit and she’s so narcissistic it’s not even empowering. Everyone who worships her are mugs.

I can’t stand her. Never have been able to. Telling women who are triple her age ‘dump him hun’... based on what? I have no idea.

 

[Hipbones]

I can't believe she copyrighted a font. Has anyone pointed out that her entire aestheic looks like an Austin Powers film?

LoudBossyGross just shared an excellent point on that

 

[northernspaces]

FG was sort of like my introduction into feminism and when I first read her book it was all new to me. But now my eyes have been opened to the fact that she is not doing anything revolutionary but actually she is heavily influenced by other people and passes it off as her own work!

Does anyone have any suggestions of better feminist accounts to follow?

Honestly, I have no suggestions. I feel like being an instagram activist is antithetical to movements like feminism. Instead I would say read work from academics and actual writers. Or listen to podcasts/lectures on youtube. There’s lots of good content out there that is academically sound and still accessible/easy to understand that isn’t boiled down into aesthetic activism.

 

[flutterby1999]

I don't like FG mainly because of her feminism as I've said before on this thread and on SF's thread many. a. time. Lol but on a waaay more shallow level she strikes me as one of those people who think they're super quirky and ~different~ with their dancing and 70s hairstyles and they make saying "fuck" their entire personality but they're actually just really annoying

 

[Jlurking]

Honestly I've been sus of Florence ever since she went on this Pride trip with Virgin last year. I found the whole thing so tasteless. Thousands of pounds spent to 'celebrate' pride with Virgin when that money could have been spent on helping out queer people who disproportionately experience homelessness, etc. She easily could have used this as an opportunity to call out the event, but she didn't, which I find very reflective of the way she views things.

 

[Hollyjenkins1234]

I really liked her Instagram to begin with but really gone off her since attempting to read her book - it’s very much “intro to feminism” interspersed with incorrectly (and harmfully!) using the terms abuse and trauma, as well as that “dump him” mantra.

I just felt like I would have found it revolutionary reading at 14 years old, but now I see through it as regurgitation of 2012 tumblr, some useful content but ultimately feel like it’s a vanity project rather than creating real social change. Florence repeatedly “acknowledges” her privilege but as just another pretty, thin, cis, white woman with a large platform - what is she actually doing to promote anyone’s struggle but her own?She posted BLM content while it was trendy but nowadays it’s all just self obsessed self promotion

 

[Tintin93]

I knew it. She is so obviously full of shit and she’s so narcissistic it’s not even empowering. Everyone who worships her are mugs.

 

[Theplantmum]

Do you think anyone has ever come out as bi before Florence was on the scene?

 

[lemonpeach]

I’m so glad I found this thread, like someone else said, I looked on Twitter and was surprised at how little conversation there was about it. It’s been really interesting reading everyone’s different perspectives.

I do like Florence but I also totally get why other people don’t, and I have to admit I’ve found the worshipping of her to be quite grating. I don’t think that she copied Slumflower’s books though As other people have pointed out, Slumflower herself has been in plenty of hot water about taking ideas from other marginalised groups and has said some frankly horrific things in the past. I feel like a lot of the people jumping into her DMs with support are white women who learned about the word ‘intersectional’ and the existence of white supremacy during the height of the BLM protests during the summer and are now desperately trying to prove how not racist they are by supporting CE without any objective or critical thought. I agree that CE is subjected to racism and held to a different standard that Florence is not - but I don’t feel like that means everyone has to automatically accept what she says as fact and declare that her work was plagiarised by FG. As many others pointed out...neither of these women came up with these ideas.

I think the way Diving Bell have handled this has been an utter shambles. The emails that slumflower shared last night were infuriating and I can completely see why she chose to give notice to end her contract. That guy seems like a total prick, the way he worded his email was so shitty.

 

[korma]

Chidera is really comparing Florence to a rapist. I’m still trying to get my head around the whole thing. For me, there is no strong evidence that Florence copied Chidera, I think her language is a step too far.

will she be taking legal action or is she going to just stay on the land of Instagram?

This makes me SO angry as someone who actually has to watch my rapist and abuser flourishing online. It's completely debilitating and awful and retraumatising. Fuck her for even thinking this was an appropriate comparison in any fucking way. HOW are people still sycophantically supporting her after this, why is nobody calling this out???? Honestly fuck this woman so hard. She's not suing bc she knows she's in the wrong, so instead she's coming for rape survivors?!?! There's being a straight talker and then there's talking out of your fucking arsehole, and Chidera is 100% doing the latter.

Like hmm, what would I rather see. My rapist living his best life with 0 ramifications for his actions after I spoke out, free in the world to mete out the same horrible abuse on some other poor woman, or someone copying my work (allegedly lmao) and making more money than me, even though I'm still comfortably well off thanks to my own book sales and command an audience of hundreds of thousands online. Tough call, they're so similar!!

 

[stopthescams]

Winds me up these white privileged influencers use being bisexual to be something “different”. now I’m not saying she or others aren’t bisexual but they play on it to seem more oppressed as it were. I’m bisexual and never really ever speak about it or have to speak about it because it doesn’t affect my life in anyway. Also I don’t want to flaunt it around like a fashion label or use it as an excuse to call myself queer

 

[oczymlody]

Really agree with this. I felt she was dead set on the idea of there being completely right and wrong relationships and that any difficulties we should just leave our relationships. But life isn't like that... men can be pretty shitty and relationships can be pretty hard but this comes from both sides.

I think leaving things as soon as things get a bit tough is very defeatist and even as someone with very left leaning points of view, I think is one trait of our individualistic society that can bring more negatives.

Also she is completely failing to take into account people who need to stay in relationships for practical reasons. Immigrants, people with serious health issues, people with lots of kids and not family support, obviously all these people can leave a relationship and pursue their "freedom" as she would proclaim, but really being able to be that picky about freedom etc really is a luxury.

Yes people should be able to have lives which are as fulfilling as possible, but I think shouting constantly at people just to leave and drop everything is irresponsible and not going to happen and potentially dangerous.

try telling someone who cannot financially cope to ‘dump him’ and as you say with dependents it becomes even more difficult. It just shows that beyond her single and comfortable life she has no idea about the real world.

 

[Riri4]

Lanvavalentine I totally agree with you. Both Chidera and Florence have the most basic reductionist version of feminism. I studied feminism at uni for both my Undergrad and Masters degree. We looked at international theories of feminism, state relations both inter and intra and I looked at the role of feminism as a political theory. It genuinely was life changing.

These women think that feminism begins and ends with how we feel about ourselves and how we feel about men. It’s so self concerned and not at all about women. Both women have enormous ego’s.

Florence is quirky and comes across like the type of friend that would be great fun at a gig, but she isn’t saying anything new. Chidera thinks she’s the architect of modern feminism but her ideas are not new, they we’re stolen and resold and now that another woman has done the same she’s demanding reparations because she’s a black woman.
I would genuinely welcome some genuine feminist critique on the world, rather than on my own body or on a man.

 

[stopthescams]

Lanvavalentine I totally agree with you. Both Chidera and Florence have the most basic reductionist version of feminism. I studied feminism at uni for both my Undergrad and Masters degree. We looked at international theories of feminism, state relations both inter and intra and I looked at the role of feminism as a political theory. It genuinely was life changing.

These women think that feminism begins and ends with how we feel about ourselves and how we feel about men. It’s so self concerned and not at all about women. Both women have enormous ego’s.

Florence is quirky and comes across like the type of friend that would be great fun at a gig, but she isn’t saying anything new. Chidera thinks she’s the architect of modern feminism but her ideas are not new, they we’re stolen and resold and now that another woman has done the same she’s demanding reparations because she’s a black woman.
I would genuinely welcome some genuine feminist critique on the world, rather than on my own body or on a man.

It’s so funny both of them ironically say they don’t care about men but they centre all their energy around them

 

[Pineapple87]

Just remembered she existed, and had a read through here - also cannot stand her ego-driven social media persona. One thing I've noticed, though - someone posted a screenshot of her IG back in June, and she was on 605k follows.

Five months later and she's grown it to a whopping... 606k.

So it looks like her surge of popularity has worn off, and hopefully this is the start of her fading into the background. Society doesn't need a recycled, image-obsessed white woman telling us that "we don't owe you pretty".

Omg this. Posing provocatively in barely there clothes knowing full well that sad loser men are gonna like it, while claiming to be a modern feminist because she has a tuft of armpit hair. Like get in the sea. Seriously.

 

[Saywhatnow22]

Needed to resurrect this thread because OH MY GOD. Her daily “get ready with me” videos are absolutely fucking insufferable. I’m all for self love but if she was chocolate she’d eat herself.

Agreed. I had to unfollow her they are beyond cringe. “Look at me I listen to music from the past and not regular chart music like all you plebs, AND I know the words!! I’m cool AF”