I'm emigrating if Johnson or McVey win. 2nd PM in a row not chosen by the electorate to deliver a ridiculous premise devised by Cameron to ensure his re-election. Still no fucker has a clue what it means but it's coming to an economy near you soon...be afraid...be very afraid...
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Such a mess. Best bit was seeing Larry the Number 10 cat getting taken back indoors.
Oh I love Larry! I need to see this....
On a more serious note associating immigrants with rapists and terrorists is part of the problem in my view. I know you said "some of them" come with good intentions or whatever but that's just as divisive.
Terrorism is a totally different topic to the EU or immigration. The Manchester bomber was a British citizen how can you stop him coming and going ? Maybe he should have been.under surveillance etc but that's a different issue to immigration. And maybe treating British citizens who happen to be Muslims as terrorists feeds into extremist propoganda? Its not just manchester. In 2005 they were 3/4 citizens. Same westminsrer. Same 1/3 of London bridge. If you're made to feel like an alien in your place of birth it's obviously going to be a lot easier to turn you. I accept there's still a long way to go but it's not helpful to have this us and them way of approaching things.
People like you really irritate me. Always so quick to defend the immigrants who do cause crime over here or terrorism related incidents. I never stated anywhere all immigrants are bad, every time a slight comment is made someone gets really defensive and the R card comes about. I have been a victim as a child of abuse from English and non Englishmen so I can comment and I have immigrant friends so I definitely am not saying they all are bad. But we cannot ignore or deny that this goes on from migrants. We already know about the Rotherham case and Charlene Downs because people are scared to have the R card thrown at them from people such as yourself.
Well I never actually once used the "r card" as you call it - racism. All I did was point out was what was problematic about what was being said. It's funny how you call it racism in defense. Says more about you than me.
And I'm sorry for what's happened to you. I really am. Thats truely revolting and hideous to do to a person let alone a child. But I don't want to connect it too closely to this discussion because I feel uncomfortable not knowing you and your situation and don't want to offend.
And I'm sorry for what's happened to you. I really am. Thats truely revolting and hideous to do to a person let alone a child. But I don't want to connect it too closely to this discussion because I feel uncomfortable not knowing you and your situation and don't want to offend.
I don't think that commenter called you a racist? They just stated that the Manchester bomber was born here - he wasn't an immigrant so couldn't be deported anywhere.
Unrelated but god it'll be a joke if we get Boris Johnson.
You implied that I was being racist or unfair to all immigrants and I actually have respect for those who come here and work hard, do well for themselves and help our country. I have foreign friends who are good people they know respect and would do anything for you. Most people who migrate here do it for a better life and work harder than many English people. They do jobs from the lowest to good working jobs such as nurses, surgeons etc who study and work hard. But we cannot ignore that there is a revolving door with no stops on it who let in anyone. Some people who are dangerous to our country and people. But as usual you cannot ever say a bad word against immigrants because you get labelled as racist/unfair/extreme which is why MP's/PM/general public are scared to speak up because this country has become a snowflake state with people who are quick to take offense to small points. I never said all people who move to this country are bad or rapists or terrorists, I think you saw one sentence of mine "immigration needs to be sorted" and try to undermine my post. I'm sorry if you disagree with my views but I want my country and children to grow up safe.. Likewise when we visit other foreign countries or move there as ex-pats we have to respect their cultures and laws or face the consequences. If I move to France or Spain and do bad things there I wouldn't be welcomed by their people and mostly likley deported and that is seen as okay and fair. But when an English person speaks up about immigrants who DO come here and cause crime and are in and out of our prison system - we get labelled. Double standards.
I don't think it had anything to do with you? It was a discussion between me and Horatio. They took offence to my post saying that what i have said is unfair and I am labelling most immigrants to which I have not. There are terrorists who come over here who aren't born in England such as the incident in London September 2017 the bucket of explosives. He was a foreign student who moved over to England to live with an English couple and he was found to have explosives and bomb paraphernalia in his bedroom when police searched it. So it does happen, I love how people get defensive over it though.
You're the one making assumptions. I don't have the energy to argue online against someone complaining about immigration in general. I would never have bothered but you really seem to have a.chip on your shoulder about it and are by far rhe most defensive poster on this thread. However I do honestly respect the right to a.different opinion belive it or not.
But Mayday is right it was the mention of the Manchester bomber because it was seemed so disconnected from.the topic but connected to the fact that many UK terrorists are ."home grown." And what that says about our society.
But Mayday is right it was the mention of the Manchester bomber because it was seemed so disconnected from.the topic but connected to the fact that many UK terrorists are ."home grown." And what that says about our society.
Okay wow, no need to be rude! You realise this is a public forum and people are allowed to join into a discussion right?
I know it happens, and its awful - I was just agreeing that the example you used was bad.
Mayday, I do realize it is a public forum but it was a discussion between H and myself and you jumped in not knowing all the facts. Which is also rude!
Horatio, it is alarming that you get so defensive over the immigrants who are dangerous people and think it is okay for them to come here. If something awful happened to your child I would wonder if your viewpoint changes. But keep calling me bad/racist/extreme/chip on my shoulder.
I am just going to leave this here https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...od-plane-passengers-revealed-gang-rapist.html
Horatio, it is alarming that you get so defensive over the immigrants who are dangerous people and think it is okay for them to come here. If something awful happened to your child I would wonder if your viewpoint changes. But keep calling me bad/racist/extreme/chip on my shoulder.
I am just going to leave this here https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...od-plane-passengers-revealed-gang-rapist.html
Well you didn't know the facts yourself when you used him as an example on immigration.Mayday, I do realize it is a public forum but it was a discussion between H and myself and you jumped in not knowing all the facts. Which is also rude!
Horatio, it is alarming that you get so defensive over the immigrants who are dangerous people and think it is okay for them to come here. If something awful happened to your child I would wonder if your viewpoint changes. But keep calling me bad/racist/extreme/chip on my shoulder.
I am just going to leave this here https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...od-plane-passengers-revealed-gang-rapist.html
If you don't think this sentence is racist or bigoted I wonder what you think that means? Bad people are bad people it has nothing to do with their immigration status. Rapists come.in all races. If someone close to me was assaulted I would be equally upset if they were British as.if they were not because that's really not the point.
Your argument again't Mayday also makes no sense when they knew as much of "the facts" as anyone. Certainly myself.
You keep calling me racist it is typical of today's society in Britain. Yes I am a racist and bigot for not wanting dangerous immigrants and rapists/terrorists in my country. So I apologise if that is so bigoted of me. I am not talking about British people, I just said above that both Englishmen and non Englishmen have abused me in my childhood. I am saying what others have said - immigration needs to be sorted. I AM allowed my views on that whether you like it or not, it is at the moment a free for all country where dangerous people come in and out under the radar is what I said all along. Like I said when we visit or move to other countries we have to respect their cultures and laws and the same should be applied here and if not - then they should not have a right to stay here. In most countries if you cannot obey laws or have criminal records you are not allowed in. Okay I was wrong about Abedi, but so what? I am correct in that others who are not English citizens have come here and committed terrorist activities. All I am saying is we need to be careful of who we let in and if our government had been, then there probably would never had been BREXIT. People who want to leave is all about immigration. If the gment did something and protected us we wouldn't be in this mess.
I mean this argument is.just going to keep going round in circles as it always does which is why I usually try to avoid.it. Let's not bother saying the same things back at each other and respect each others right to an opinion as you say. I honestly think the worst thing to.have come.out of.this whole referendum saga is reveal how divided the country is and I think the way people speak to each other on both sides just fuels it. I would even go as far as saying the left, which I generally align myself with, has a tendency historically be particularly aggressive. It comes from a good place often but feeds the trolls and the worst of the right but also is unfair to genuinely good people with different views for whatever reason. Background plays a large role.
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My point is our government needs to be careful of who it is letting in. Many atime I've flown and never had anyone check my passport at border control. Some very dangerous people come in when you leave the door wide open and we need to be careful of activites. When the multiple terrorism attacks happened in 2017 everyone was up in arms that we needed to be more careful about who is being let in and out of the country. May was a terrible leader and did nothing to solve this, she just went out each time and read from her stand prepared speeches. I feel that Grenfell sufferers should have been helped much more, also. Alot of them were migrants and treated appallingly. I never said that all immigrants are bad or they are all violent people. That is why I am annoyed at the comments. It is common of today. You cannot have a simple debate without being accused of being bigoted. Yes I do want my country to be safe, and I do feel that more could be done. The vast majority of migrants are hard workers and good people. I apologise if my comments seem in any way bigoted, but that is your issue as I am truly not and that has upset me. I dislike the far right members in politics but I feel more could be done from our current government to protect our nation.
Thank you. I didn't mean to jump into the argument and offend you either (or imply you were racist, I was simply saying the Manchester guy wasn't a good example as I feel he became the poster boy for 'anti-muslim' and 'anti-immigration' after that happened). I also agree that the Grenfell victims have been treated poorly, and its shocking that May is leaving before they have been properly rehoused. (I wonder if they even will be now or will just be left to fend for themselves?)
Also unrelated but don't want to double post. I had a good chuckle at this
Thank you. I didn't mean to jump into the argument and offend you either (or imply you were racist, I was simply saying the Manchester guy wasn't a good example as I feel he became the poster boy for 'anti-muslim' and 'anti-immigration' after that happened). I also agree that the Grenfell victims have been treated poorly, and its shocking that May is leaving before they have been properly rehoused. (I wonder if they even will be now or will just be left to fend for themselves?)
Also unrelated but don't want to double post. I had a good chuckle at this
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No worries, I'm sorry if my comments came off the wrong way at all. I have no problem with our multi-cultural nation and it is nice that we are more accepting than 30/40 years ago. My comments about Abedi may have come across as ignorant and I apologise in that he was indeed an English national. I just don't want to be viewed or accused of being against all immigration at all or any form of bigotry and felt offended but it was a crossing of wires.
There's a.great youtube channel called "middle ground" that gets people on different sides of controversial issues to sit down and talk to each other in a non judgemental non accusatory manner. It can get heated but it always ends well. I'm sure that's sometimes down to the editing, but the objective is so important I think. It's American though and I really think someone should make one with people who live.in the UK on our own issues. We have the same horribly divided society here and there's something cathartic about just watching these all too familiar topics be discussed in that way.
We are living in a stubborn society where both sides (generally speaking) have views but don't listen to the others side or we stereotype each side.. It would be good if the UK people could come together to talk about debates and hear both sides. I also think that the media doesn't help. The reason why I thought that Abedi guy wasn't English is because after the incident, the media kept saying afterwards 'why did nobody stop him going between countries, why wasn't something done about this?'. We are living in hostile times and Brexit has caused a huge division between people.
My twitter feed right now is a perfect example of the divide. Well really its between those who share roughly similar liberal views arguing over whether we should have sympathy for Theresa. May's tears. I think we should and have despised her since she was.home.secretary. but when I say that I mean I despised the politician. Those were the tears from her the person - which she very rarely shows. As I said before I think the left have a real problem with separating the two. Remember all the celebrations when Thatcher died? It's the idea that they lacked empathy in their policies and don't deserve it now. Which is a misunderstanding of empathy in my view and the enemy of progress or diplomacy.