Joss Whedon

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LadyCandour

Chatty Member
I feel like the worst of the abuse started later on in the show and peaked in season 6. The degrading sex scenes they made SMG shoot were awful.

SMG had always taken her status as a role model very seriously - making sure to never be pictured drinking or smoking at a time of her life when all her peers were having fun.

Joss would have known this so I feel the Spike and Buffy stuff was done to punish her and put her in her place. He'd have known that she would have hated filming that, and she says herself she made it clear. I feel she gave him an ultimatum and threatened to walk if they made her carry on with it.
Joss is a bully, racist, misogynistic and a perv. More details of the various complaints here.

In the mean time this I'd the complaint that started it all and why Charisma spoke out. This seems to get overlooked
 

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MrsPiggleWiggle

Active member
Joss is a bully, racist, misogynistic and a perv. More details of the various complaints here.

In the mean time this I'd the complaint that started it all and why Charisma spoke out. This seems to get overlooked
I don't think it gets overlooked, it's more that we've all been aware of what CC went through for years, and the rest of the cast are speaking out for the first time.

I really want to know why CC was written out of those episodes in season 3 where she was on holiday with Groo. No one has ever mentioned why that was.
 

Tinga

Member
I feel like the worst of the abuse started later on in the show and peaked in season 6. The degrading sex scenes they made SMG shoot were awful.

SMG had always taken her status as a role model very seriously - making sure to never be pictured drinking or smoking at a time of her life when all her peers were having fun.

Joss would have known this so I feel the Spike and Buffy stuff was done to punish her and put her in her place. He'd have known that she would have hated filming that, and she says herself she made it clear. I feel she gave him an ultimatum and threatened to walk if they made her carry on with it.
Probably explains why she had no sex scenes in the last season and it was deffo watered down compared to S6.
 

whowouldhavethought

Active member
I feel like the worst of the abuse started later on in the show and peaked in season 6. The degrading sex scenes they made SMG shoot were awful.

SMG had always taken her status as a role model very seriously - making sure to never be pictured drinking or smoking at a time of her life when all her peers were having fun.

Joss would have known this so I feel the Spike and Buffy stuff was done to punish her and put her in her place. He'd have known that she would have hated filming that, and she says herself she made it clear. I feel she gave him an ultimatum and threatened to walk if they made her carry on with it.
Season 6 would have been filmed after Cruel Intentions though and she was a pretty fruity character in that.
 
I feel like the worst of the abuse started later on in the show and peaked in season 6. The degrading sex scenes they made SMG shoot were awful.

SMG had always taken her status as a role model very seriously - making sure to never be pictured drinking or smoking at a time of her life when all her peers were having fun.

Joss would have known this so I feel the Spike and Buffy stuff was done to punish her and put her in her place. He'd have known that she would have hated filming that, and she says herself she made it clear. I feel she gave him an ultimatum and threatened to walk if they made her carry on with it.
There's an outtake video out there somewhere from Season 6 where SMG says something along the lines of there's far too much sex in this show, she definitely wasn't completely comfortable with the direction they were taking her character during that season.
 

MrsPiggleWiggle

Active member
There's an outtake video out there somewhere from Season 6 where SMG says something along the lines of there's far too much sex in this show, she definitely wasn't completely comfortable with the direction they were taking her character during that season.
She's spoken of that scene before specifically- where they are on the balcony in the Bronze. She said Buffy never would have done that in front of her friends and I think that was the tipping point that made her demand to speak to Joss.

Season 6 would have been filmed after Cruel Intentions though and she was a pretty fruity character in that.
True, but she filmed that after season two and we don't know when she signed up for it. It may not have been clear at that time that she would become a role model from her Buffy role.
 

Knight of Galador

Active member
I feel like the worst of the abuse started later on in the show and peaked in season 6. The degrading sex scenes they made SMG shoot were awful.

SMG had always taken her status as a role model very seriously - making sure to never be pictured drinking or smoking at a time of her life when all her peers were having fun.

Joss would have known this so I feel the Spike and Buffy stuff was done to punish her and put her in her place. He'd have known that she would have hated filming that, and she says herself she made it clear. I feel she gave him an ultimatum and threatened to walk if they made her carry on with it.
I do think that Joss Whedon is talented. In this case I can seperate the art from the artist but his creepiness definitely sneaks in the show. Season 6 is a good example of this with Buffy only feeling alive if she was having degrading sex with a man she hated. The absolute worst was when Spike attempted to rape Buffy and she let him go without staking him.
 

MrsPiggleWiggle

Active member
I do think that Joss Whedon is talented. In this case I can seperate the art from the artist but his creepiness definitely sneaks in the show. Season 6 is a good example of this with Buffy only feeling alive if she was having degrading sex with a man she hated. The absolute worst was when Spike attempted to rape Buffy and she let him go without staking him.
Disgusting how a show like Buffy just let's him get away with that. It should have put an end to all the Spuffy stuff.

Same with Andrew in season 7. He does some vile things in season 6 and kills Jonathan in CWDP, but he doesn't really earn his redemption.
 
She's spoken of that scene before specifically- where they are on the balcony in the Bronze. She said Buffy never would have done that in front of her friends and I think that was the tipping point that made her demand to speak to Joss.
Yes that's exactly the scene she was talking about. Didn't Amber Benson say she felt the same about the scene with Willow in Once More with Feeling. Seems he regularly made cast members feel very uncomfortable and if you said anything you were killed off.
 

Lavendergreendillydilly

Well-known member
Michelle Trachtenberg was 15 when she first appeared in Buffy, and Marsters (who was well into his 30s) would have known her since then.
So yeah, those lyrics are pretty creepy when you have that in mind. On top of that, it was her workplace! She’s got an adult twice her age writing an inappropriate song about her, and on top of that, whatever happened with Joss Whedon that meant he wasn’t allowed alone in a room with her. I feel so bad for her, that was her workplace and the adults around her should have been respectful, professional and made sure she felt safe.
Apparently James Marsters wasn't allowed alone with Michelle Trachtenberg either. That's hearsay but I've read it quite a few times now.

Disgusting how a show like Buffy just let's him get away with that. It should have put an end to all the Spuffy stuff.

Same with Andrew in season 7. He does some vile things in season 6 and kills Jonathan in CWDP, but he doesn't really earn his redemption.
Theory: Andrew is a Self-portrait of Joss ?
 

Knight of Galador

Active member
Disgusting how a show like Buffy just let's him get away with that. It should have put an end to all the Spuffy stuff.
That should have the end of Spike. I can give him a pass in season 7 because he's a different person with a soul but it's still disapointing that Buffy didn't stake him on the spot after that.

Apparently James Marsters wasn't allowed alone with Michelle Trachtenberg either. That's hearsay but I've read it quite a few times now.
Technically she wouldn't be allowed on her own with any of the cast since she was a minor when the show was shot and would have to have a chaperone with her at all times. Although it's a little sketchy that there are rumours that Joss and James were specifically not allowed to be with her.

Theory: Andrew is a Self-portrait of Joss ?
A lot of fans believe Xander is Joss' self insert character. Then again Andrew is a lot of like early series Xander except murdery.
 

Lavendergreendillydilly

Well-known member
I think looking back it’s easy to see now that some episodes were totally inappropriate and not needed for the story line. There was no need to create a buffy bot just to have sex with spike and there was no need for a whole episode basically of buffy and Riley having sex!
There was no need for Riley full stop. I always skip the majority of that season if I'm rewatching.
 

Knight of Galador

Active member
I was rooting for Riley to work as a character. During that period earnest boy scout characters were out or fodder to make edgier characters look cool its why people have had difficulty making new versions of Superman. Riley started out as a decent attempt to do that kind of character until he got insecure and started getting sucked off by vampires.

Come to think of it that was another questionable decision. Xander lecturing Buffy that the reason Riley for all intents and purposes cheated on her was because she wasn't paying him enough attention and her actually agreeing with it.
 
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