Congratulations to @TillyMiffin on the winning thread title. Bit of a mixed bag in the last thread, sadly the frustrations outweighed the successes, and some apathy has set in but there seems to be a lot more recognition of self worth and not putting up with subpar behaviour which can only be applauded.
Dating after lockdown #21 More red flags than Pamplona, we don’t wanna know about your boner.
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I’ve been inspired by the last thread in which someone mentioned manifestation. I did do this last year and met someone who ticked all of my boxes but I just didn’t click with. And he ended up acting in an odd way. (Christmas man) so maybe it’s not foolproof! But it’s worth a go right? I’m starting a strict meal replacement diet after half term, I’ve put so much weight on in last two years and I’m at the point that it’s making me unhappy. So heading into summer feeling a bit more optimistic. Come on my lovelies, let’s leave the ghosters, waste of time chatters, slow faders, indecisive idiots behind and raise our collective bar! Manifest what we want and raise our standards so that when we do let someone into our lives we make sure they’re worthy of us 
I was thinking about this (or day dreaming lol) earlier today. Manifesting. It’s worked for me in the past on a few things but I’m still on the fence about it. However, I’m going to give it a go. My daughter bought a nice notepad earlier so going to get myself the same one. I have in my head what I want, I’m going to write it downI’ve been inspired by the last thread in which someone mentioned manifestation. I did do this last year and met someone who ticked all of my boxes but I just didn’t click with. And he ended up acting in an odd way. (Christmas man) so maybe it’s not foolproof! But it’s worth a go right? I’m starting a strict meal replacement diet after half term, I’ve put so much weight on in last two years and I’m at the point that it’s making me unhappy. So heading into summer feeling a bit more optimistic. Come on my lovelies, let’s leave the ghosters, waste of time chatters, slow faders, indecisive idiots behind and raise our collective bar! Manifest what we want and raise our standards so that when we do let someone into our lives we make sure they’re worthy of us
Appreciate your comments and there’s a lot of truth here. He’s not feeding me a sob story, he’s not like that. He doesn’t behave like “woe is me” or bad mouth her to get me to take his side or some such nonsense. He doesn’t involve me or expect me to take on some emotional support role over it. He is pretty factual and has not said very much about it. He’s said a couple of things and it felt like he was stepping towards me. We haven’t directly discussed the divorce in months. He does have many good features, but also some frustrating ones. There’s no rose tinted glasses here, and I see his shortcomings.
The dating app thing is something I am confused by. No sooner than I was emotional about it, he’s not been online in a week and is never online on WhatsApp so he’s not talking to anyone. That’s largely irrelevant - what it is telling me is he’s clearly still very much in a confused zone and that simple fact - not that he’s on the app - is what’s brought it home that I really don’t want to be impacted anymore. His confusion has made me confused and I’m tired of it. I gave him the opportunity to talk with me and he’s not yet taken it. It’s pissed me off. I’ve really tried to decide whether to address that directly with him before I stop contact, or just stop contact. I do feel like I need to ease away from him. Abruptly pulling back felt wrong last week. I’ve dithered over giving him a direct explanation. I don’t even know what I’d say. I’ve been very confused about what to actually do, and a bit stuck to the spot. I feel like things are definitely shifting in me. I thought I was there a week ago, and could pull back completely and I failed. I know I’m swaying from one thing to the other. I’m fully conscious of it. The light contact is me trying to ease forward and deal with my own emotions. This is about me finding my way through it, in my own way. I fully appreciate the advice I’d give to others to cut it all off and do it now. I know. I was emotional last week for reasons besides men, which I did mention, and what I’ve needed to do is buy myself breathing space to work through it in a more rational and conscious way, rather than react to him from an irrational/emotional place, when other issues, including dumping the prat I was dating, were in the mix.
I appreciate the blunt advice, I can take it. I do know my value and I usually have no issue walking away. I’ve never been in touch with an ex like this… it’s been tricky negotiating this and my own emotions. Some people around me are suggesting it’s worth exploring. Some say no, and desperately don’t want to see me get hurt. The thing is, I’m not naive. I’m fully aware of what’s at stake for me, and it’s for me to deal with it. I’m responsible for my choices. My friend has just got back with her guy after he threw a wobble. He’s still going through that moving on process after his divorce. We can want people to have done the work and be ready exactly when we are and this and that, but it’s not always that simple. Like we were discussing yesterday when people believe stuff like “it’ll happen when you least expect it”, others get angry by that sentiment. Whereas some would walk from this, others would be prepared to take the risks firmly on the chin to see what could happen when the process of his divorce is mainly done. If I meet someone in the meantime, great, if not, so be it. As for dating others, I’m very conscious and intentional. I’m at pains not to involve anyone in a serious way if I’m not ready. I’m pretty self-aware enough not to do that to someone. Browsing/having a chat with someone over the coming weeks is a million miles away from embarking on dating someone seriously if I’m not ready.
As ever I appreciate all the thoughtful advice and support here, while I handle my own very real experiences
There’s more apps to talk on than WhatsApp. I’m never on there but could be talking none stop on Instagram, Snapchat or even iMessage.
I didn’t mean it to sound naive. I’m aware that where there’s a will there’s a way, though. He’s not got any social media like that. He’s not interested in such things. He’s genuinely not.
@Belle123 you are so incredibly lovely, I would hate for you to get hurt by this potato of a man. However, I’m curious about what you want from this man. So genuinely, what do you want? From what you have told us, he very clearly seems to not be interested in wanting to get back together with you. So what are you trying to get out of this situation?
I very much understand that some people have a hold over us, which can make it very difficult for us to let go. But a relationship (any kind of relationship!) needs to be balanced. There must be give and take on both sides. Right now it seems like you are giving 110% whilst he is doing nothing but taking. And that is not fair to you.
The entire situation honestly reminds me a bit of that film “He’s just not that into you”.
If he wanted to, he would. If he wanted to be together with you, he would have made the effort. If he wanted to be friends with you, he would have been better at communicating. I have seen arseholes of men become princes on white horses for women, simply because they wanted to.
I strongly feel like what he is doing to you now, is not fair. He’s holding you hostage, whilst you deserve a fairytale ending.
I am rooting so incredibly hard for you, because you’re genuinely the most thoughtful person on this thread. You always take so much time to consider everyone’s issues and give very thoughtful advice. I hope I am not stepping out of line with this post, but I genuinely believe that you deserve so much better, even from just a friend (or whatever kind of label you want to put on this).
I very much understand that some people have a hold over us, which can make it very difficult for us to let go. But a relationship (any kind of relationship!) needs to be balanced. There must be give and take on both sides. Right now it seems like you are giving 110% whilst he is doing nothing but taking. And that is not fair to you.
The entire situation honestly reminds me a bit of that film “He’s just not that into you”.
If he wanted to, he would. If he wanted to be together with you, he would have made the effort. If he wanted to be friends with you, he would have been better at communicating. I have seen arseholes of men become princes on white horses for women, simply because they wanted to.
I strongly feel like what he is doing to you now, is not fair. He’s holding you hostage, whilst you deserve a fairytale ending.
I am rooting so incredibly hard for you, because you’re genuinely the most thoughtful person on this thread. You always take so much time to consider everyone’s issues and give very thoughtful advice. I hope I am not stepping out of line with this post, but I genuinely believe that you deserve so much better, even from just a friend (or whatever kind of label you want to put on this).
Thank you. As an outsider, I’d have come to the same observations as you. I think it’s clear what I want. I don’t share absolutely everything here and you get a snapshot. He has more or less said that things would have been different if he wasn’t in this headspace. When we reconnected, and mentioned talking, he worded things in such a way to me that it felt like what he was asking me for was time before we talked, and what we’d talk about is us. Initially I thought I could handle it and try and be more objective about it… be there in some way while he worked through things, before we had a conversation like he wanted. I couldn’t push that relationship while he was vulnerable and needing time to get through some difficult things. I see a lot of good with him, and yes I wanted to believe him. As we chatted, I thought the barrier was coming down. He’s never not followed through on things with me. What’s hurting me right now is that I agreed on the basis of his past sincerity, and he’s clearly not made the effort to step up in any way. I’m on his timescale and he isn’t seeing me in it all. How long do I wait to even see him. Even if it’s keeping it as friends right now, it’s ridiculous not to see each other. He’s not being fair.
What’s become clear to me is I’m definitely feeling a push back because he yet again had the stupidity to see his ex. That he’s still swinging from one thing to another with his emotions tells me I need to get off this ride. I was so determined to walk completely a week ago and it crumbled because I wasn’t ready to fully let go. I’ve been stuck about how to do that. I’ve finally had a clear chance to properly focus and quietly reflect on this, having dealt with other things going on recently, and I just don’t know that there’s any merit in saying “you want that chat now?!”. I think it’s pointless to say anything. I don’t want him to take me for granted any more… not even ‘friends’ do that.
Thanks! The marriage lasted several years, after a reasonably long relationship beforehand. I was his first serious relationship after they had been separated for nearly a year, but not his first date. His ex has now been in a relationship for nearly a year, and I do not believe there is any struggle on her part. I don’t want to explain it in too much detail here, but his ex is after a settlement that involves things that really belong to him, and he’s hurting over it - he’s a sensitive guy and my reading of it is he’s having to go through painful emotions as he realises she is prepared to play a bit dirty. It’s very difficult for me because I don’t want to take sides, judge a woman I know nothing real about, nor do I know her story, but morally I don’t agree with her going after this aspect of things.
Ok so whilst there is some residual baggage as always with long relationships, it's old baggage so to speak. I was just concerned that he was rebounding with you but sounds like the relationship has been over for a long time and the fact that she has moved on means it's over for her too which is always a good sign. It's always sad when the ' fighting ' starts over things, these are 2 people that loved each other at one point but that gets forgotten about when the selfish head games and behaviour starts and all perspective is lost because winning said item becomes the most important thing.
I don't have any answers Belle to be honest. I think in these situations so much is out of our control especially when we care deeply for someone and are soo willing them on to make the right decision. And I'm a great believer that you have to walk a day in someone else's shoes to fully understand what they are feeling and thinking. As always we are all here for you
my question would be belle, i suppose, what is an ideal outcome here for you? i know that you felt a strong connection with this guy, and a strong possibility that it had real potential to go further - is your hope that, at the end of this, when he’s ready, that he comes back to you? how long are you prepared to wait for that?
the apps thing is still a big one for me. how you take and react to that is completely your business but i can’t compute that he is both not in a position to date and also actively looking to date. as said above, him not being very active on whatsapp doesn’t mean he’s not messaging anyone.
as everyone has said, we are all just invested in your happiness and emotional well-being. you always give such wonderful and considered advice here, and i would hate to think that a man is taking advantage of that aspect of your nature.
Hi Belle, I have kept up with your situation but never felt it my place to comment as it would be a little hypocritical of me (and everyone else does it so eloquently) but then again, I have been exactly where you are. As LaBlonde said, I’d be intrigued to know what your ideal outcome is from this situation. You’re giving this man a lot of credit and I’d hate to think of your good nature being taken advantage of.
If, for example, he sorts out the messy situation with the ex wife and all she is wanting, puts it in a box and moves on, do you think you could be truly happy and content with him? Would you ever truly be able to relax and be sure that he is 100% done with the aftermath of his marriage ending?
You are clearly astutely aware of the situation and I’m not disputing that. You definitely have your head screwed in and see things for what they are. I just wonder ultimately whether this could ever end in you being really truly happy and content with this man, in any way.
I’ve been there with the trying to be supportive of the messy break up, who’s entitled to what chat. I spent days listening to him reel off how much she was taking him for a ride, how much it was unfair and I, the same as you, thought “wow this woman is taking the absolute piss here,” but in hindsight, it’s all one perspective.
The hardest thing I ever did was cut all contact with someone I was mad about, even though I could have probably continued with them as they wanted to have their cake and eat it, to keep all their options open, I guess. If you really did close the door on this man and walk away for good, do you think he would come after you (maybe not now but in the future?)
Again just echoing what everyone has said, you have a good heart and we want the best for you
If, for example, he sorts out the messy situation with the ex wife and all she is wanting, puts it in a box and moves on, do you think you could be truly happy and content with him? Would you ever truly be able to relax and be sure that he is 100% done with the aftermath of his marriage ending?
You are clearly astutely aware of the situation and I’m not disputing that. You definitely have your head screwed in and see things for what they are. I just wonder ultimately whether this could ever end in you being really truly happy and content with this man, in any way.
I’ve been there with the trying to be supportive of the messy break up, who’s entitled to what chat. I spent days listening to him reel off how much she was taking him for a ride, how much it was unfair and I, the same as you, thought “wow this woman is taking the absolute piss here,” but in hindsight, it’s all one perspective.
The hardest thing I ever did was cut all contact with someone I was mad about, even though I could have probably continued with them as they wanted to have their cake and eat it, to keep all their options open, I guess. If you really did close the door on this man and walk away for good, do you think he would come after you (maybe not now but in the future?)
Again just echoing what everyone has said, you have a good heart and we want the best for you
Ok so whilst there is some residual baggage as always with long relationships, it's old baggage so to speak. I was just concerned that he was rebounding with you but sounds like the relationship has been over for a long time and the fact that she has moved on means it's over for her too which is always a good sign. It's always sad when the ' fighting ' starts over things, these are 2 people that loved each other at one point but that gets forgotten about when the selfish head games and behaviour starts and all perspective is lost because winning said item becomes the most important thing.
I don't have any answers Belle to be honest. I think in these situations so much is out of our control especially when we care deeply for someone and are soo willing them on to make the right decision. And I'm a great believer that you have to walk a day in someone else's shoes to fully understand what they are feeling and thinking. As always we are all here for you
Thank you all so much for you input and advice.Hi Belle, I have kept up with your situation but never felt it my place to comment as it would be a little hypocritical of me (and everyone else does it so eloquently) but then again, I have been exactly where you are. As LaBlonde said, I’d be intrigued to know what your ideal outcome is from this situation. You’re giving this man a lot of credit and I’d hate to think of your good nature being taken advantage of.
If, for example, he sorts out the messy situation with the ex wife and all she is wanting, puts it in a box and moves on, do you think you could be truly happy and content with him? Would you ever truly be able to relax and be sure that he is 100% done with the aftermath of his marriage ending?
You are clearly astutely aware of the situation and I’m not disputing that. You definitely have your head screwed in and see things for what they are. I just wonder ultimately whether this could ever end in you being really truly happy and content with this man, in any way.
I’ve been there with the trying to be supportive of the messy break up, who’s entitled to what chat. I spent days listening to him reel off how much she was taking him for a ride, how much it was unfair and I, the same as you, thought “wow this woman is taking the absolute piss here,” but in hindsight, it’s all one perspective.
The hardest thing I ever did was cut all contact with someone I was mad about, even though I could have probably continued with them as they wanted to have their cake and eat it, to keep all their options open, I guess. If you really did close the door on this man and walk away for good, do you think he would come after you (maybe not now but in the future?)
Again just echoing what everyone has said, you have a good heart and we want the best for you
The dating app things hurts, of course it does. It’s painful to realise even this seemingly ‘good’ guy is behaving this way - like a f%#*boy - because of apps. Feels like he’s keeping it moving with me while browsing because it’s just there, isn’t it? Men can literally sit on the sofa in their pants and browse women in the land of make believe and uncomplicated, where they get to avoid their feelings and consequences. I’m not going to be a hypocrite here. I’m on dating apps and he would have seen that. Who knows what he’s thinking about the whole thing. You never know what’s going on in someone else’s mind, what motivates them and what their perspective is. Objectively, I can see how he needs to explore things for himself right now. He’s single, I’m single. Whether he comes back to me and whether I will accept him is impossible to know. I dare say, in time, I would not be able to abide taking him back. I can’t deal in what ifs and imaginary situations, though.
The apps thing is really an irrelevant detail - it’s open to so much interpretation, and I will only do my own head in by analysing it, including whether he is talking to anyone, whereas what I can focus on is what is (and isn’t) happening between us. Great connection and conversation? Yes. Coming towards me and opening up gradually? Yes. Pulling back from me as soon as he interacts face to face with her? Yes. Dithering? Yes. Leaving me in some imaginary waiting room while he works through things? Yes. Being so wrapped up in his own emotions he’s not seeing mine? Yes.
When we were back in touch I was in a good place, had started dating again and honestly felt I could “be there” for him when we re-established contact. Treated it like an option, if you will. Wanted to have that chat he mentioned and hoped it would happen fairly soon. We had logistical issues that prevented us meeting, and it’s not been pure avoidance from him. I’ve no idea if he does intend to talk to me. I don’t want to chase it. I feel I’m back to feeling turbulence in our connection because he’s interacted in person with her. He’s pulled me back towards him and I’m emotionally too close to it all. The trigger for the pull back yet again is the ex. I know what happened to us the last time such an interaction happened and through the benefit of this experience I know what to do - step away and not allow his emotions to dictate our interactions like this.
Maybe I am the delayed rebound. Maybe I’m not. I’ve no way of truly knowing. He’s never fully walked from me. I know what I want with him, but whether I could have that is impossible to know. I have no idea how long it would truly take for him to process his emotions and put it all in its rightful place. The older we get, the more we’re going to meet people with baggage and it’s a bit naive to think we won’t hit bumpy parts along that journey with someone. Perfect doesn’t exist. He’s got to choose me though, and be willing to step towards me and work as a team. He’s not doing that right now. Fact.
What I can control is what I do now. I want to be in a happy, healthy relationship with someone and he’s derailing that too much. I was prepared to give it time. I’m not sure I had a timescale in my head, but I have to listen to my heart now, and it’s telling me to pull back and protect myself. If he wants that chat, he can pull his finger out and deal with it. I didn’t sleep well as it all floated around my brain. I’ve had a really good think. As I’ve reflected, I realise my gut is telling me to let it drift now and not to say anything directly to him unless he asks. I don’t regret anything here and I know I tried. It’s helped to work through it here with you lovely bunch and thank you
Belle.. You said he isn’t woe is me and he hasn’t discussed the divorce in months so what’s his deal? Is he just quiet or chatting to you consistently? What is he saying to keep you here because I can’t see one hint of effort from him. You say he is confused which tells you all you need to know. He’s feeding you breadcrumbs at best but I can’t see any hope from the things you have said about him.
The dating app in itself is a strike - He may not be using it now but the intentions were there.
Abruptly cutting contact might hurt you for a few days but you’ll start to feel better.. This is hurting you over a longer and drawn out time.
I used to post about my man when he was depressed but even when he was having his darkest months he would do everything he could to make sure I knew he wanted me.
Don’t wait around with false hope and don’t feel like you have to have one final conversation - just go silently.
The dating app in itself is a strike - He may not be using it now but the intentions were there.
Abruptly cutting contact might hurt you for a few days but you’ll start to feel better.. This is hurting you over a longer and drawn out time.
I used to post about my man when he was depressed but even when he was having his darkest months he would do everything he could to make sure I knew he wanted me.
Don’t wait around with false hope and don’t feel like you have to have one final conversation - just go silently.
@Belle123 - you absolutely shouldn’t regret anything 
you tried and were patient and considerate of his feelings. i think your final paragraph there is a really mature and well-rounded assessment of the situation, your heart and gut are correct (imo) in letting you drift away from him. you couldn’t have done more and his dithering and vagueness isn’t fair to you.
you tried and were patient and considerate of his feelings. i think your final paragraph there is a really mature and well-rounded assessment of the situation, your heart and gut are correct (imo) in letting you drift away from him. you couldn’t have done more and his dithering and vagueness isn’t fair to you.Thanks! I think this was posted almost as soon as I’d put my thoughts out there, so you can see I’m not taking this any further with him. Breadcrumbing or not, what I actually don’t want to deal with is the turbulence that follows when he’s interacted with her.
For what it’s worth, we talk about what we’re up to, and check in with each other. It’s been almost daily, with a fair consistency to it like when we were dating. It’s been lighthearted on the whole, but we’ve also discussed some practical things going on in each other’s lives. He had input in a problem I had and found what I needed to help me fix it. It’s been easy going, rebuilding a connection in a light hearted way for what I thought was building up to us meeting to chat, when he was ready. Whether we would have been on track to do that soon, if he hadn’t had to see her, is not helpful for me to ponder on.
He hasn’t used me as some emotional dumping ground over his divorce. Being my type of personality, others would have taken advantage, and he hasn’t. Through my job/contacts, I am able to help with some of the things he needs to arrange and he hasn’t abused that by drawing me in to help him. I genuinely think he doesn’t want to bring me into his crap. It would be far worse if he was using cynically using me for that support.
Thank you for this@Belle123 - you absolutely shouldn’t regret anything
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